deskthority

Since I became interested in keyboards I've seen people discussing the thickness of keycaps and a lot of people seem to dislike Signature Plastics' profile or thickness. I don't know if I prefer the thicker keys as don't have thick double shots from any company, but I'm interested in getting some.

I haven't been able to find any information on this, but maybe I failed at using Google...

Anyway, has anyone contacted SP about their cap thickness and profiles and inquired about whether it's a possibility for them to make them thicker? Or even different profiles that they don't have molds for? I imagine it'd be very expensive for them to make a differed mold, but has anyone actually asked them if they'll do it?

Impossible. Tooling costs would reach nearly 100k for the molds.

if we want thicker we would have to pay for the entire setup and that's alot of $$$

sixty wrote:Impossible. Tooling costs would reach nearly 100k for the molds.

Haha, wow. Okay thanks for the information, I didn't know just how expensive it'd be. :S
That more than explains why it's not doable.

So then what happened to the facilities that produced the thicker DS keycaps?

sixty wrote:Tooling costs would reach nearly 100k for the molds.

Holy sh—. That is a *lot* more than I would have guessed it to be. Do you know why it’s so high? How many moulds would be required?

ped wrote:So then what happened to the facilities that produced the thicker DS keycaps?

I’d imagine they went out of business/were closed when good keyboards stopped being routinely manufactured. There would be no point in cost-cutting by using rubber domes but continuing to use high-quality (and expensive) double-shot keys.

You could always consider using a 3D printer...

koralatov wrote:

ped wrote:So then what happened to the facilities that produced the thicker DS keycaps?

I’d imagine they went out of business/were closed when good keyboards stopped being routinely manufactured. There would be no point in cost-cutting by using rubber domes but continuing to use high-quality (and expensive) double-shot keys.

Pretty much this. The last standing double-shot bastion was Cherry, who produced double-shot keys and took orders for special orders up until 2010. In February, that last bastion fell.

This actually makes me sad. The best quality products always end beaten up by cheap, bad and low quality products. The end is near

I'm not quite getting the Signature Plastic $100K number either.

They need metal molds for the 1st shot R1-R4 profiles and modifiers but CNC cut the second shot mold out of acrylic.


I think it's like Unicomp and tenkeyless. They give big numbers when they don't want to do something.

Even my bike brakes are now CNC milled, not forged. Why would the metal molds be even close to $100K?

The "setup cost", for programming the CNC mill, is usually a very large number independent of how many items that are produced. Molds for injection molding are usually done at very high tolerances compared to many items that are merely produced in a CNC mill.

I am a stupid person, I really am. But even I don't buy that.
Starting next week, I'll take keycaps to some local shops and factories, who do all sorts of polymer production and injection molding, down to "smallest parts" like for scale modeling. I bet they won't want to have one hundred thousand bucks from me.

Get Thick PBT Dye-Subs from Vortex or some other Chinese seller.

Injection molds are extremely costly. Depending on the size, complexity and required precision of the plastic part to be made, prices for such molds exceed the imagination of the average but-I-can-do-that-at-home-for-much-less person.
Double shot molds and insert molds add complexity and are even more expensive.
Here's some information in Dutch (there's always google translate).
http://www.awamolding.nl/?pag_id=44477

e-Bay can be fun at times:
The mold for a back scratcher; asking price is 175k: http://www.ebay.de/itm/Kratzboy-Spritzg ... _880wt_932
and a mold for a warning triangle (including some other tools) for nearly 700k:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/EURO-Warndreieck ... _715wt_932

We should track down the machines used to make the cherry caps and as quietly as possible roll them onto a truck and drive away with them.

Kurrk wrote:The mold for a back scratcher; asking price is 175k: http://www.ebay.de/itm/Kratzboy-Spritzg ... _880wt_932

He takes PayPal ...

Scarface did it for his alu keys.

webwit wrote:Scarface did it for his alu keys.

Woah, what is THAT? http://cafe.naver.com/sfkey.cafe?iframe ... oardtype=I
want...

webwit wrote:Scarface did it for his alu keys.

he bought cherry molds or made them himself?

He made them

Made to specs, check out the SF sig (0-4 for different rows). Machine/molds should be in his album somewhere.

How do we get some?

Oh darn, i SO want a full set of lead keycaps now....... but then id also need some stronger springs for my switches and only type with gloves on.... But this would make my cat unable to throw the board off the desk again!! OMG or solid gold!!! Would eliminate the glove problem........

Maarten wrote:Oh darn, i SO want a full set of lead keycaps now....... but then id also need some stronger springs for my switches and only type with gloves on.... But this would make my cat unable to throw the board off the desk again!! OMG or solid gold!!! Would eliminate the glove problem........

Lead, that wouldn't be good for you...

On the other way PBT is not the best at all if you have some "dyphényle polybromé" added for fire resistance ...
Toxic via the skin.
Happy typing

ripster wrote:I'm not quite getting the Signature Plastic $100K number either.

They need metal molds for the 1st shot R1-R4 profiles and modifiers but CNC cut the second shot mold out of acrylic.


I think it's like Unicomp and tenkeyless. They give big numbers when they don't want to do something.

Even my bike brakes are now CNC milled, not forged. Why would the metal molds be even close to $100K?

Ended up being $50K btw.

I KNEW it wasn't $100K.

However the outcome is unchanged.

In the typography world improper letter spacing is called shagging sheep. Signature Plastics loves to shag sheep.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederic_Goudy

ripster wrote:In the typography world improper kerning is called shagging sheep. Signature Plastics loves to shag sheep.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederic_Goudy

You should repost your stuff in the typophile.com forums. They'd love it. (Hint: kerning and letterspacing are two different things.)

Fixed!

The main point is I knew $100K sounded high.

$50K would have been good enough for Melissa to blow us off. Shagging sheep. Whatever.
Watch as a German tells me I should have used the Strg key.