deskthority

Hello everybody,
I have been reading about cherry mx reds, and I would like to know your opinion about something I have read. I never tried this switch and I would like to get a board with reds but I have read that due to the low force needed to activate the key it is very common to have many typos because of mispressed keys. What is your opinion? Do you make more mistyped keypress than usual?
And I also wanted to know what is the average force for an average rubberdome keyboard?

I use reds all the time for typing, and am typing on them right now for this post. I have no such problems from accidental keypress and make no more typo than I do on any other MX type. I think those that have a problem on reds are clumsy or have poor motor control
I find most rubberdomes to be around 60-70g to bottom out/actuate but of course it feel more to me since you usually have to crush them into the hard plastic case bottom to make them register.

There's a possibility for you to have more typos on Reds because of how light they are and that there is no "bump" to get over. However, if you are a decently accurate typist, you shouldn't have too many problems. Like any mechanical switch they will take some getting used to, but I find them quite enjoyable to type on.

pheo wrote:... I have read that due to the low force needed to activate the key it is very common to have many typos because of mispressed keys. ...

Thjerea are no many typso when typing in reds!

Please order resf here:
Cherry MX.

Variable Topre are worse. Low initial force does it.
The initial force required for a Cherry MX red isn't that low.

I'm using reds too, and haven't faced a problem at all.

You can get typos quite quick (i.e. triggered keys next to the pressed one), if you lower the sample rate in your controller. If I set the value for a detected keypress down to something like 6 successful scans, I get bogus keypresses due touching the other keys lightly. It's not only restricted to the reds, it happens also with blacks at that settings.

Thank you everybody for your answers! Probably I will grab one.

I still make more mistakes on my Filco with MX reds but practice helps.

imp wrote:You can get typos quite quick (i.e. triggered keys next to the pressed one), if you lower the sample rate in your controller. If I set the value for a detected keypress down to something like 6 successful scans, I get bogus keypresses due touching the other keys lightly. It's not only restricted to the reds, it happens also with blacks at that settings.

Don't you need to scan the keys really slowly to make it ignore short presses? Sounds like you could miss presses if typing fast. I could not get any bouncing or contact in MX reds before the activation point and that is pressing the key half way down.

I make mistakes on mine, but nothing bad just occasional double press. My main problem right now is I use a cherry mx brown at work and a red at home so I think it takes a few min for my brain and fingers to adjust to the lack of feedback. You may have some adjustment time, but nothing drastic.

Findecanor wrote:Variable Topre are worse. Low initial force does it.

Funny, I find my Realforce variable to be the keyboard on which I type the best, and it's the kindest to my fingers and wrists. The variable weight isn't even noticeable, although I did find the keyboard horribly stiff at first, after being so accustomed to Cherry MX, but I got used to it very quickly. Great keyboard, but I just prefer the sharpness and precision of browns over the rubber feel of Topre.

Certainly, light switches can lead to a lot more typing mistakes, and I imagine red would be even worse than I found with browns. Moving from Dell rubberdome to Cherry MX for me was really hard, but conversely, rubberdome boards feel all the more awful for it now :-)

I must try reds one day.

The only problem I had when I got my first board with reds was that I bottomed out a lot, but I was able to adjust after some weeks. Generally I prefer stiffer tactile switches for typing but reds managed to get my 2nd favorite switch as typing on em feels sooo "effortless", also I don't wanna use anything else for gaming anymore (well, perhaps something with even lower resistance and more travel, like 8mm but activation still at around 2mm, the last 6mm would be just a "shock absorber").

At one point, I had quite many keystrokes registered twice, but it was PEBKAC, and it took me only few days to adjust the way I typed. Otherwise, I always use just about the right amount of force to actuate. If people have problems such as hitting keys by accident... well, they should probably fix their typing technique.

davkol wrote:At one point, I had quite many keystrokes registered twice, but it was PEBKAC, and it took me only few days to adjust the way I typed. Otherwise, I always use just about the right amount of force to actuate. If people have problems such as hitting keys by accident... well, they should probably fix their typing technique.

For what I have read or seen it is most like people tend to hit keys by accident due to the low force it requires. I would really like to give a try to these.
Thank you all for your opinions

tlt wrote:

imp wrote:You can get typos quite quick (i.e. triggered keys next to the pressed one), if you lower the sample rate in your controller. If I set the value for a detected keypress down to something like 6 successful scans, I get bogus keypresses due touching the other keys lightly. It's not only restricted to the reds, it happens also with blacks at that settings.

Don't you need to scan the keys really slowly to make it ignore short presses? Sounds like you could miss presses if typing fast. I could not get any bouncing or contact in MX reds before the activation point and that is pressing the key half way down.

I'm scanning quite fast with currently 1.6kHz and waiting 7 scans before sending out a key isn't that much time -> (1/1.6e3)*7 = 0.0043750s or 4.375ms (let's wait for whining gamers ). If one would manage 1200cpm, the time between each keypress would be 1/(1200/60) = 0.05s or 50ms - so if your finger keeps pressing a key down 1/10 of that time, you are still fine . You can even lower the count (maybe I should, since the value of 7 was for my old controller), harder pulldowns and stronger drivers will eliminate the floating state on the lines faster.
If you are not hitting the keys in the center, it's quite likely that another key will be pushed far enough to be at the activation point - maybe I need some time and an high fps camera to make some movies .

I did have a lot typos at first because the force was so much lower than anything I had used before, but using the Cherry MX Red on a regular basis has improved my typing accuracy.

O-rings have helped. They reduce the impact from bottoming out and reduce key travel distance.

My main issue is typing a word that requires both hands. I often start with the wrong hand first.

I've been typing with MX Reds for about half a year now and get these typos every once in a while. The keys are just so light that if I'm focused on something else, my finger (that is resting) might accidentally press a key to the activation point and then I suddenly have no idea why my computer is doing whatever that keypress causes it to do. So for me it's not really a case of accidentally pressing a key when aiming for another, but accidentally pressing keys when I'm not typing anything. And it's very rare considering how much I use the keyboard, but happens, and I consider myself a pretty good typist. Although I can sometimes be a bit more absent-minded than the next guy...

Nothing that would make me move to another switch for my daily typer, though!

Calade wrote:I've been typing with MX Reds for about half a year now and get these typos every once in a while. The keys are just so light that if I'm focused on something else, my finger (that is resting) might accidentally press a key to the activation point and then I suddenly have no idea why my computer is doing whatever that keypress causes it to do. So for me it's not really a case of accidentally pressing a key when aiming for another, but accidentally pressing keys when I'm not typing anything. And it's very rare considering how much I use the keyboard, but happens, and I consider myself a pretty good typist. Although I can sometimes be a bit more absent-minded than the next guy...

Nothing that would make me move to another switch for my daily typer, though!

Great to hear that!

I routinely rotate between red, brown, and blue switches. I can honestly say that I don't notice any more typos with Red than anything else. In fact, I probably have more on the blues because my fingers get spoiled with the light touches on reds that I may not fully actuate a switch when going fast.

Now... the variable force Realforce Topre boards... I accidentally trigger A's and S's and such on those all the time. Drives me batty. But nothing like that on the reds. Everyone types different though.

buy mx red board
talk to 7bit about MX Clears
???
ERGO-CLEAR PROMISED LAND

Please order MX Clears board if it is the same price.
Reds are cheaper and I've got too many of them ...

or that (!!) if you can find a clear board (who knows you might like it)

edit: I am not a fan of reds. I thought I would like them but my hands were too manly for them and I experienced a lot of the typos mentioned in the OP. I was not manly enough for Greens. Ergo-clears, Black Alps, and BS are where it's at for me.

7bit wrote:Please order MX Clears board if it is the same price.
Reds are cheaper and I've got too many of them ...

I will check ergo clear on wiki. Sadly there is not clear switches option. I am actually expecting the ISO-ES pure to be released. And only the usual switches are available.

go go go http://deskthority.net/marketplace-f11/ ... t5311.html

kwago wrote:go go go http://deskthority.net/marketplace-f11/ ... t5311.html

nice try, but... I got a filco last week, expecting to get it soon

Reds are my main, i have no issues.