HHKB Professional BT (Bluetooth)

[cookie]

Ohh you, I like you.

[the_marsbar]

The same figure is also used on an older page on the PFU website (https://www.pfu.fujitsu.com/hhkeyboard/ ... hhkb2.html), so I think it's just a comparison with regular rubber dome switches, as has already been pointed out.

[vivalarevolución]

BT HHKB vs classic HHKB.

Inner beauty is what counts.

[cookie]

There are more pics on this page, for those who might me interested: http://ascii.jp/elem/000/001/152/1152535/

Also you can see that the actual case is a different thank the HHKB. It's are more modern one, differently rounded endges. That would mean that they've used a different mold.

I don't know if that is a good or bad thing, we will see.

[vivalarevolución]

Then what was the purpose of the spring?

it is there just to vary the capacitance.

Fyi, I took apart my Plum 84 today, (a Topre clone electrostatic capacitive keyboard), and it definitely feels like that spring helps with the return keystroke. I compared a dome with the spring and one without the spring next to it, and it feels like the dome with the spring returns faster. I am sure many have tried that before and the placebo effect might be at play, but it definitely feels like the spring is an important part of the return of the keystroke on the Topre feel.

I do understand that technical specifications note that the spring only has a minor effect on the actuation force, but it definitely feels like a difference on the return stroke.

[matt3o]

and it feels like the dome with the spring returns faster.

of course it does, it's a spring after all, but it's incredibly light (compared to the rubber itself) and its main purpose it to vary the capacitance. Indeed the difference between 45g and 55g topre is the rubber, not the spring.

[cookie]

I once have tested dampening materials and had to re assemble my HHKB several times without the springs.
As picky and sensitive as I am, I couldn't tell any difference. The springs are just too light to notice and not necessary to return the switches.

[shreebles]

BUT you can hear them

At least I could, when I silenced the Novatouch I could hear them afterwards. They scratch a bit on the PCB. It can annoy you a bit, or not at all. It annoyed me sometimes. One author of the german mecha-blog.de site said it bothered him.

[Muirium]

I've never heard a spring in my HHKB or Realforce. The NovaTouch… well, there's enough strange in that board that it's more plausible you might. But when Topre switches are working properly, the spring makes no sound. It's merely there as a target for the capsense, trapped snugly inside its very own dome.

[shreebles]

Then what makes this small noise? Air trapped under the domes? Are these Topre farts?

[joric]

Preordered and got one a while ago. Tried to swap switchboards and get rid of the hump. Doesn't really fit into the old case.
HHKB BT and HHKB Pro 2 comparison http://imgur.com/a/YYAOv

[cookie]

What a pitty but nice that you've shared pictures of the internals! I'd love to see a picture of the BT under the dome though. Could you take one for me?

[joric]

What a pitty but nice that you've shared pictures of the internals! I'd love to see a picture of the BT under the dome though. Could you take one for me?

NO. I wouldn't like to do that. It would need disassembling the board and unscrewing 20 mount points. I assure you, domes are the same. Circles on the PCB are slightly smaller so they're completely covered by the domes.

[joric]

Maybe you'll find it here, someone has posted a large review yesterday: https://keykollectiv.com/2016/05/25/redefining-endgame/

[Muirium]

Ugh. Just that URL pisses me off. I love the HHKB. But endgame? With a hideous lump like that all along the back? Get a grip.

[Plasmodium]

...hideous lump...Get a grip.

Finally a good use for the battery bulge - a handy carry handle?

[joric]

You can't grip it If anything, it only makes gripping worse!

[Muirium]

How apt. As Topre's lost it with that board.

They redesigned the PCB, which gave them the perfect opportunity to go with a built in battery and charging circuitry too. As is the style of the time, and a huge improvement over trashtastic AA cells. But instead of that, they redesigned the case as well, making a pig's ear of the backside. Uh, to mix metaphors, as they did with this fugly half arsed redesign!

They put in as much work was required to make something natural and great, but in all the wrong places. Argh!

[kudosgodspeed]

Maybe you'll find it here, someone has posted a large review yesterday: https://keykollectiv.com/2016/05/25/redefining-endgame/

If you took the time to actually read the post, I emphasize the idea that "endgame" doesn't exist. The term "endgame" pisses me off equally.

[Muirium]

And yet your title?

[seebart]

Hmm am I missing something here...Topre? When I last checked the holy HHKB was a PFU product. PFU happens to be a "daughter" of Fujitsu, their ugly battery bulge in this expensive product looks like Nintendo 1991. Fujitsu boards in the 1980's looked sleeker altogether (no battery bulge)

Spoiler:

IMGP8470.JPG (871.36 KiB) Viewed 7024 times

[Muirium]

The innards are Topre. I assume they produce the entire thing for Fujitsu. And the last thing my brain needs is another faceless set of initials to fail to remember. So I'm blaming Topre and you guys can find and replace as necessary in your minds!

[seebart]

Sure Topre manufactures it for PFU, but to PFU's specs including their funky AA battery bulge. In this price range with these kind of consciously mobile customers a slap in the face. And of course AA batteries, why not this for an energy supply:

hamsti.jpg (46.36 KiB) Viewed 6989 times

[Muirium]

Which, passed through my acronym deficiency, reads as:

Sure Topre manufactures it for Topre, but to Topre's specs including their funky AA battery bulge.

Yeah, uh, pretty much.

Anyway, whoever screwed this pooch, I'm pissed off with them. They never run their damn fool mistakes past us first. At least CM let us have a peek of the NovaTouch prototypes, and then politely ignored our input. (Most all of it was out of their hands. The rattle was all Topre's doing.)

[seebart]

It's mind boggling just in terms of the battery choice. AA batteries? 1980's? Jeez. It's not like there are no options.

Of course our DT chief summed it up perfectly:

they clearly wanted to reuse the case mold they already have... that is probably easiest/cheapest solution to carry the batteries without having to reinvent a new case design. Understandable but a bit lame considering the premium price.

After two HHKB I honestly came to the conclusion that they are not worth what they are charging them, but I'm very glad that they came out with a BT version.

[Muirium]

A little birdie tells me they're up to something funny with the Realforce now as well. Shields up!

For what it's worth: I adore my HHKB. Type S + Matteo's PBT spacebar = sublime 60% perfection. Except for that wretched cable! If I had to lose every keyboard but one, it'd come right down to my HHKB and the Kishsaver. Neither of which have Bluetooth, sadly. But not this sadly!

[seebart]

The RF case is much bigger, way more room for AA batteries.

[Muirium]

Hey, I could bear AAs hidden in an externally pristine Realforce. But for the record: my birdie wasn't chriping about that.

[t!ng]

https://imgur.com/e5froXB

This, I like this.

[matt3o]

https://imgur.com/e5froXB

This, I like this.

only if it were reprogrammable!