deskthority

Alright, I have a few Topre boards and they're my favorite switch.
But there are far too many nice MX compatible boards to collect to go Topre only.

Now this thread is not (or no longer) about MX switches that are close to Topre because there's nothing like a Topre.
It's about what switches a Topre user/fan likes besides Topre.
I would love to hear others opinions, preferences and story's.

My favorites are: Zilent78, Tealio, Kaihl Box Dark Yellow and Hako Clear. Still have to try Hako Violet.
I like a medium heavy switch with slight tactility just off linear that feels smooth and I don't mind a smooth linear switch as well.

I'm not a fan of clicky MXs any longer, I was a long time ago before I knew there were other mechanical switches than clicky. That said, if I had to choose a clicky switch it would be Kaihl Box Jade.

None of them feel like Topre 55 IMO. The closest would probably be the "Holy Panda" franken switch (Halo Clear/True stem in Panda housing). Holy Pandas feel more mechanical and responsive vs Topre 55g and lack the "wet clay" bottom out from the rubber domes. They are closer to SKCM Brown Alps but with a lighter key feel.

hako clear vaguely tries to replicate topre feel, but it's probably closer to 45g domes than 55g.

Indeed, the Hako Clear is a good contender. I feel the Zilent 78 does a good job as well but both have the weight closer to a 45 than 55g.
For me the Hako has a little less or smoother tactility, the Zilent a little more or sharper tactility.
I love the soft bottoming out on the Zilent.
I’m trying to make my MX keyboards feel as Topre-like as possible while at the same time modding an FC660C with NovaTouch stems so I can put MX keycaps on it. Guess which fine keycaps I chose for that.

I see Pandas are made of unobtanium these days and am a bit reluctant to mod switches for a whole board, let alone three of them. All I do is put a 100g spring in a switch for the spacebar, I tried 150 but it was too heavy and made the spacebar feel too different from the other keys. Thanks for the tip on the Panda though, I’ll see if I can get a few to make a few tester variations.

Comparing Topre to MX directly is just not a good thing to do, in my opinion. There is literally nothing that compares directly to it in MX or Alps.

There are more membrane switches that feel far closer to Topre than any MX/Alps variant I've ever tried. The switch construction, the difference in how resistance from a dome vs spring feels and works, sliders vs stems, etc.

I really think it is borderline deceptive when people try to market MX switches as "Topre-like" because they frankly never are.

livingspeedbump wrote: ↑Comparing Topre to MX directly is just not a good thing to do, in my opinion. There is literally nothing that compares directly to it in MX or Alps.

There are more membrane switches that feel far closer to Topre than any MX/Alps variant I've ever tried. The switch construction, the difference in how resistance from a dome vs spring feels and works, sliders vs stems, etc.

I really think it is borderline deceptive when people try to market MX switches as "Topre-like" because they frankly never are.

I agree with all aspects of this.

If you want something that feels like Topre, get Topre.

I agree as well and have 4 Topre boards not including the 23U numpad. So I got Topre.

But there are certain board layouts/types/styles that I can't get in Topre, only in MX. Planck/Preonic and UHK for example are the ones I'm interessted in but I've seen others that are less or in some cases even more exotic.

Also, I am modding one Topre board with nice MX caps but mostly for using nice cap sets I'm going to have to use mainly MX boards. Modding a bunch of Topres like that would be too expensive and the feel changes as well so that would be a shame. And almost all Topre boards I like have 6u spacebars which would exculde a lot of sets. The two sets I'm interested in are Honeywell and /dev/tty.

Hence my search for the MX switch that "feels most like a Topre", not "is a Topre".

I edited the title from 55 to 45/55g as the options mentioned are closer to 45 than 55g.

Khers wrote: ↑

livingspeedbump wrote: ↑Comparing Topre to MX directly is just not a good thing to do, in my opinion. There is literally nothing that compares directly to it in MX or Alps.

There are more membrane switches that feel far closer to Topre than any MX/Alps variant I've ever tried. The switch construction, the difference in how resistance from a dome vs spring feels and works, sliders vs stems, etc.

I really think it is borderline deceptive when people try to market MX switches as "Topre-like" because they frankly never are.

I agree with all aspects of this.

If you want something that feels like Topre, get Topre.

+1

People please get over it by saving the money of 2-3 normal MX boards and buying a real Topre.

"What vegan or vegetarian bacon tastes most similar to real hickory smoked bacon with some rosemaries on top?"

p.s. I am a vegetarian for years.

Allright, then link me a Topre Planck please.

Keep in mind that just because you like Topre, you might not enjoy the most Topre-like MX switch. I personally really like Topre, but tactile MX are not my cup of tea. At all. Hence, almost all MX-switches I own are linear; and all the better for it.

Luna wrote: ↑Allright, then link me a Topre Planck please.

I am sure you are not just asking me.
People thought about it, and now with the dome separately available, it's becoming easier.
https://github.com/tomsmalley/custom-topre-guide

Yup, that’s all nice, I skimmed through that page but for me, as well as many others, it could as well have been written in Chinese. I mean I’m not up to taking on a project like that and even if I was and did it probably wouldn’t turn out the way I wanted it. Also sourcing the parts would be hell and some stuff would have to be manufactured and requiring group buys and the like. I’d happily settle for an MX board instead.

Nope, my intention for this thread was to find something remotely similar to a Topre switch in MX design to be able to fill some particular keyboard layouts with switches that make me think of Topre, fully knowing it wouldn’t be the same and not minding since I do love a bit of variety.
I had made up my mind more or less before creating the post but wanted to make it anyway since I like to know what switch others consider to resemble Topre and in what manner and the thread might be useful to others looking for similar info.

But it could also be useful for people liking Topre but not having the budget and/or not wanting to spend that much but would still like a nice looking and feeling keyboard with a layout that suits them. Yes, they could save up and spend three times as much but who’s to say they’re wrong if they find a price like that for a keyboard ridiculous? I don’t but they have the right to.

Maybe the question in the title would have been better if I asked “What is the favorite MX switch of Topre fans” I come to think now.
I am a Topre fan, nothing comes close to the feel of the Leopold (so called 45g but they’re heavier) and Topre 55g domes for me.
But that said, I do like the feel of Zilent78, Tealio and Kaihl Box Dark Yellow as well. I don’t mind a little variation in my life.

Allright, changed the title as I’m really interested in MX switch preferences of Topre users.
Deleted the poll as it’s no longer useful with the new title/subject.

And why totally exclude Zealios from your list? When you include their Zilent?

By the way, I think Cherry's been awake from their lazy ass and getting more ready for competitions in the market. Keep an eye on their new products (and denied revision) too.

The MX switches I like the best are Nixies and vintage blacks, with a spring swap to lighter springs. Those linear MX switches are really rather good, while I find both tactile and clicky MX, regardless of type, rather lacking in comparison to the alternatives like Topre and capacitive buckling springs.

I know for many DT users the MX Brown switch is not the most vocal choice, but in my case (after starting with MX Blue, and then trying MX Clears and toying with different spring weights) the MX Brown was the choice I landed to. But not a normal MX Brown - some years ago I bought from DT a cheap Ducky TKL keyboard, unsoldered its switches, made myself some custom MX Browns with 65g springs and the "trampoline landing" silencing mod, and soldered those on the TKL. Together with some OEM-tall keycaps made from POM, the combination proved to be better than the sum of all the parts - the keys hit that happy perfect equilibrium point where they weren't not too tactile (for me), but not completely linear, not too light nor too heavy, and had the quality of snapping back very easily (I don't know how to put it better) - in a few words, while not feeling like Topre, its key back-snapping reminded me of Topre, and it was a joy to type on. It's all in the past tense, since a friend at work effectively took the keyboard from me (not knowing what modding efforts were placed in it, a keyboard is just a keyboard right) and told me he would compensate me how I see fit (him at that point knowing nothing about mechanical keyboards) - and I let him have it for the enthusiasm, meanwhile he got the mechanical bug and fished for me some Alps keyboards as compensation If it looks like a cheesy story, well - it's real nevertheless , and of course this is before the custom MX switches era, right now I have some hopes with a custom Tada 68 build and some silenced tactile Aliaz switches from kbdfans.cn.

@Menuhin

Well the list is gone as I think it’s better to leave the question open and ask Topre users for their favorite. Favorite MX switch as opposed to Favorite Topre replacement.

But I didn’t include Zealios in the poll as I felt the comparable Zilents were closer to the Topre feel than Zealios due to the way they bottom out.

I tried the Cherry Silents in black and red but found they really sucked, even more so compared to Zilents. The decrease in travel is clearly noticeable (I hate speed switches due to short travel) and the dampening is very mushy.
I used to like Cherry but I find Zealio, Hako and Kaihl Box to be better feeling switches compared to the Cherry equivalents. Box Jade for Clicky, Zilent78 for tactile and going back and forward between Box Dark Yellow and Tealio for linear.

@Laser

I'd rather call it a good story and an interesting read. That's what I was after when making this thread.

I went from Buckling Springs to Blues (before I knew anything about mechanical switches) to Razer Greens after which i became more intersted in tactile than clicky. Browns first, then moved to Clears. Added a Red board and later a Topre at which point I started to have more than 1 keyboard. Changed from time to time to get newer/better/different. Fast forward to the present day and I end up with 10 mechanical keyboards of which 4 Topre, 1 buckling spring, 3 nice MXs and a gaming one as well as a Romer G. I know, let's forget that one but the lighting is nice and unique. And a numpad and K830 to control a few media centres from the couch that fits in the remote drawer.
I choose a different mouse and keyboard each morning though and enjoy the hell out of it!

I think your brown could be desccribed as a heavier clear that was silenced? Probably in the direction of a 65g Zilent but less smooth?
What you seem to look for in a switch resembles my preference: light tactile, just off of linear, not light but not overly heavy, soft bottoming out like a Topre and a nice smooth but just stong enough uwpard force.

Some nice tips here with Alianz, Panda and some modded alternatives you and others liked.
I see one problem though: my 64-space switch tester with only about 20 spaces left is going to become too small.
Nevertheless I'm starting a list with switches and modded switches to test.

I am also in touch with someone that might make me a 24 switch Topre tester: 45g, 55g and the 4 Reduxes without any silencing and all 6 of them silenced with Silence-X, Hypersphere and Keyclacks. I hope he will want to make it for me.

Luna wrote: ↑@Khers

Well the list is gone as I think it’s better to leave the question open and ask Topre users for their favorite. Favorite MX switch as opposed to Favorite Topre replacement.

But I didn’t include Zealios in the poll as I felt the comparable Zilents were closer to the Topre feel than Zealios due to the way they bottom out.

I tried the Cherry Silents in black and red but found they really sucked, even more so compared to Zilents. The decrease in travel is clearly noticeable (I hate speed switches due to short travel) and the dampening is very mushy.
I used to like Cherry but I find Zealio, Hako and Kaihl Box to be better feeling switches compared to the Cherry equivalents. Box Jade for Clicky, Zilent78 for tactile and going back and forward between Box Dark Yellow and Tealio for linear.

I'm not exactly sure what parts of this post that were addressed to me, it feels rather like a response to Menuhin's post.

Having said that, I too dismissed linear Cherries after trying out the modern ones. The more recent ones, commonly referred to as retooled, are significantly better, however. And the really old ones (made in the eighties and early nineties) are very nice. The clones are no match for those, if you ask me. If you would want to know more about my journey into the keyboard swamp, you can read about it here: photos-f62/khers-collection-t13388.html

Khers wrote: ↑The MX switches I like the best are Nixies and vintage blacks, with a spring swap to lighter springs. Those linear MX switches are really rather good, while I find both tactile and clicky MX, regardless of type, rather lacking in comparison to the alternatives like Topre and capacitive buckling springs.

A member from Sweden speaks my mind again, although I am not as rich to try a whole board of Nixies, I like well tuned MX linear switches.
Perhaps I should try Surströmming after all.

Menuhin wrote: ↑ Perhaps I should try Surströmming after all.

No! Don't do it!

@Khers
Yes, it was a reply to Menuhin. Edited, sorry.
Thanks for the tip on the Nixies, added to my list for testers.
I’ll check out your story now, looks like an intersting read, thank you!

Vintage MX clear with 62gr spring for me (with QMX clips too).

Edited the first post to be inline with the new title and what this thread is about along with some more info about my favorites.

I have a bit of a dilemma.
I (am going to) have 3 MX keyboards I want to put different switches in: the UHK, Varmilo VA68M and a Planck.
I want to put tactiles in two of them and linears in the other one.
Does anyone have an idea which board would be best with linears or which one certainly not?

I like Topre switches best as well, and of course I have loads of beautiful MX-stemmed keycap sets that I want to type on, so my solution is to exclusively use Realforce RGB, Novatouch, and Plum Nano 75 boards. I don't have to hack anything, aside from adding silencing rings and swapping keycaps. So far it has worked out great, though the lack of case options is frustrating.

Having said that, I am always in search of an MX-based switch that I can possibly like as much as Topre, but so far I haven't found it. I need to try Kaihua Speed Coppers and Hako Clears but I'm pretty sure I won't like the amount of bottom-out and upstroke noise they make since they are both non-dampened (internally). Maybe Zilents hold the answer? I dunno. At the end of the day, there's just no substitute for that wonderful Topre thock, regardless of how good the tactile bump may feel on another switch.

But hey, maybe one of these days someone will design a quiet, tactile MX-compatible switch that will amaze me.

I'll check out the Plum keyboards, might be a nice idea. Came across them but didn't give them much thought.
I was planning to buy two of the TKL RGBs when they come out, one to recap, one to keep with the shine-through caps.

What silencing do you use by the way? I have all three incoming to make me a 24 switch Topre tester. 45g/55g/the 4 reduxes without silencing and with the three silencers.

Of all the switches I treid I like Zilent 78g best and it is the one that comes closest to the Topres on the Leopold for me. You should try them, they're a really nice siwtch and have a wonderful soft bottom-out.

zslane wrote: ↑I like Topre switches best as well, and of course I have loads of beautiful MX-stemmed keycap sets that I want to type on, so my solution is to exclusively use Realforce RGB, Novatouch, and Plum Nano 75 boards. I don't have to hack anything, aside from adding silencing rings and swapping keycaps. So far it has worked out great, though the lack of case options is frustrating.

Having said that, I am always in search of an MX-based switch that I can possibly like as much as Topre, but so far I haven't found it. I need to try Kaihua Speed Coppers and Hako Clears but I'm pretty sure I won't like the amount of bottom-out and upstroke noise they make since they are both non-dampened (internally). Maybe Zilents hold the answer? I dunno. At the end of the day, there's just no substitute for that wonderful Topre thock, regardless of how good the tactile bump may feel on another switch.

But hey, maybe one of these days someone will design a quiet, tactile MX-compatible switch that will amaze me.

Those plums seem intersting indeed. 35g sheet can be replaced by a 55g sheet and if I don't like it I put some Rduxes in.

A few questions if I may.
- Whats XLED as opposed to RGB? Single color and if so what color? I'm looking for a white/warmish white/light yellow.
- Are the Plum 75s cursor keys easily accessible and how? Does it use all standard keysizes? I mean, the way they are configured standard on the R-Shift and below, not with remapping. Else I'd go for an 87 but a 75 RGB Bluetooth sure looks attractive to me.
- The springs you can get for them (10g/20g) make the key feel heavier it seems. Do you recommend using those springs an how does it change the feeling?
- Is the waterproof version nicer than the regular version?
- Do you silence your Plums?

- I don't know what XLED is, but the backlighting is full color as I recall (I don't use it, so I don't know much about the details).
- The Plum 75 doesn't have cursor keys per se. By default, Fn+Rshift,Rctrl,Rmenu,Ralt are the arrows. Essentially it is just a standard 60% layout with the F-row added. I prefer to program Fn+IJKL to be the arrow keys.
- The default right side bottom row is: Fn, Alt, Menu, Ctrl
- I just use the springs that come with it and it feels fine. The resistance comes from the domes, not the springs, and I only use 45g domes.
- I don't know anything about waterproof versions, sorry.
- There is no need to silence the Plum. It comes from the factory with silencing rings already installed. However, SA keycaps have a tendency to thwack against the plate, especially the stabilized keys, so I stick small strips of felt on the plate along the sides of the stabilized switch housings to dampen the impact.