Alps Appreciation

[amigastar23]

Hello there,

i wanna remove the click/tactile leaf of the Black Alps and make them linear.
Now my question is, are the Black Alps without click leaf build similiar to the Green Alps? Or do the Green Alps differ significantly?
thx

[darkcruix]

Hello there,

i wanna remove the click/tactile leaf of the Black Alps and make them linear.
Now my question is, are the Black Alps without click leaf build similiar to the Green Alps? Or do the Green Alps differ significantly?
thx

I am not an expert, but they are similar when linearized. Green Alps have a different spring (lighter weighted). Other difference is the lubricant, but there are some debates around it. From my tests linearized black alps are just a bit heavier weighted (as long as they are clean therefore not scratchy or binding).

[Maledicted]

Does anyone know if Datacomp DSK119 used complicated Alps?

Datacomp still makes boards with Alps clone switches. I have never even heard of a DSK119 but their DFK119 is still made, and mine has complicated Alps (white). If the DSK119 uses Alps switches at all, and it was made for any length of time throughout the 90s, its age would determine what type.

[amigastar23]

Hello there,

i wanna remove the click/tactile leaf of the Black Alps and make them linear.
Now my question is, are the Black Alps without click leaf build similiar to the Green Alps? Or do the Green Alps differ significantly?
thx

I am not an expert, but they are similar when linearized. Green Alps have a different spring (lighter weighted). Other difference is the lubricant, but there are some debates around it. From my tests linearized black alps are just a bit heavier weighted (as long as they are clean therefore not scratchy or binding).

Thank you, yes the Black Alps are heavier weighted indeed but other than that i think they are similiar to the green alps when the Tactile leaf is taken out i believe.

[amigastar23]

So i've bought me a DELL AT102W with Black Alps
The FCC ID is GYUM90SK Made in Malaysia REV A01
I found out that these are Bamboo Black Alps.
Should i Linearize the Bamboo Black Alps since they are not as good as Pine Black Alps?
Would be there a big difference between Linearized Bamboos and Linearized Pine Black Alps?

I guess these are Bamboo Black Alps

[amigastar23]

So i got my Dell AT102W with Black Alps today.
I really like it and it would be my primary Keyboard if i wouldn't have a White Alps Keyboard.
But it's very nice so far.

[Scarpia]

I was digging around in the part of my keyboard collection that’s been boxed up for years and found a Silicon Graphics “Bigfoot” granite with white (damped?) Alps that I originally bought to use the keycaps in my SKCM Brown TKL; but as I eventually wound up using the Signature Plastics DSA Granite keyset for Alps instead, the SGI board ended up in storage.

I always knew it was down there, but I haven’t actually held it in years; what a striking keyboard — to me, every bit as cool as any Northgate, Leading Edge or Wang! I am debating myself whether I should keep it and try to bring it into rotation or just sell it.

[engr]

Datacomp still makes boards with Alps clone switches. I have never even heard of a DSK119 but their DFK119 is still made, and mine has complicated Alps (white). If the DSK119 uses Alps switches at all, and it was made for any length of time throughout the 90s, its age would determine what type.

The seller uploaded some pictures, looks like pine white Alps with double-shot keycaps.

[Maledicted]

Datacomp still makes boards with Alps clone switches. I have never even heard of a DSK119 but their DFK119 is still made, and mine has complicated Alps (white). If the DSK119 uses Alps switches at all, and it was made for any length of time throughout the 90s, its age would determine what type.

The seller uploaded some pictures, looks like pine white Alps with double-shot keycaps.

Yup, looks like you're right. I wonder if they're all brand new like that. It is a shame it has those weird arrow keys.

[hellothere]

Yup, looks like you're right. I wonder if they're all brand new like that. It is a shame it has those weird arrow keys.

That's not a shame at all. While the keys might not work on Windows 10, other than the left, right, up, and down, they're are lots of people who think that more keys = better. Further, you may be able to wire up or buy a Soarer's, TMK, or QMK adapter and make those keys do something. Macro action!

I can't see any problems with this keyboard, unless the other units aren't in good shape.

[Maledicted]

Yup, looks like you're right. I wonder if they're all brand new like that. It is a shame it has those weird arrow keys.

That's not a shame at all. While the keys might not work on Windows 10, other than the left, right, up, and down, they're are lots of people who think that more keys = better. Further, you may be able to wire up or buy a Soarer's, TMK, or QMK adapter and make those keys do something. Macro action!

I can't see any problems with this keyboard, unless the other units aren't in good shape.

To each their own. It would bother me that the arrow keys aren't inverse-t and if I were to go through the trouble of remapping the whole thing with a converter (which certainly will work since this is AT/XT switchable like the DFK191) either none of the legends would match or I would be trying to swap in Tai-Haos since I don't believe in harvesting caps unless the donor is totally unsalveageable, and that would end up looking bad too.

The manual does list some jargon about configurability of the f keys, but I don't know if that even means they send different scan codes without layering. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[phinix]

I was digging around in the part of my keyboard collection that’s been boxed up for years and found a Silicon Graphics “Bigfoot” granite with white (damped?) Alps that I originally bought to use the keycaps in my SKCM Brown TKL; but as I eventually wound up using the Signature Plastics DSA Granite keyset for Alps instead, the SGI board ended up in storage.

I always knew it was down there, but I haven’t actually held it in years; what a striking keyboard — to me, every bit as cool as any Northgate, Leading Edge or Wang! I am debating myself whether I should keep it and try to bring it into rotation or just sell it.

I'm interested if you decide to sell - it would be my first alps keyboard - finally to find out what is all the fuss about
Are those white alps close to your brown ones? Like similar to topre?

[Scarpia]

I was digging around in the part of my keyboard collection that’s been boxed up for years and found a Silicon Graphics “Bigfoot” granite with white (damped?) Alps that I originally bought to use the keycaps in my SKCM Brown TKL; but as I eventually wound up using the Signature Plastics DSA Granite keyset for Alps instead, the SGI board ended up in storage.

I always knew it was down there, but I haven’t actually held it in years; what a striking keyboard — to me, every bit as cool as any Northgate, Leading Edge or Wang! I am debating myself whether I should keep it and try to bring it into rotation or just sell it.

I'm interested if you decide to sell - it would be my first alps keyboard - finally to find out what is all the fuss about
Are those white alps close to your brown ones? Like similar to topre?

I’m afraid not; the brown Alps design was only used in those switches, all the other Alps have a completely different keyfeel, as their force curves show. Lots of people think white alps are some of the best clicky switches ever made, so they’re not a bad choice for a first Alps board, but they won’t be anything like Topres

[phinix]

I was digging around in the part of my keyboard collection that’s been boxed up for years and found a Silicon Graphics “Bigfoot” granite with white (damped?) Alps that I originally bought to use the keycaps in my SKCM Brown TKL; but as I eventually wound up using the Signature Plastics DSA Granite keyset for Alps instead, the SGI board ended up in storage.

I always knew it was down there, but I haven’t actually held it in years; what a striking keyboard — to me, every bit as cool as any Northgate, Leading Edge or Wang! I am debating myself whether I should keep it and try to bring it into rotation or just sell it.

I'm interested if you decide to sell - it would be my first alps keyboard - finally to find out what is all the fuss about
Are those white alps close to your brown ones? Like similar to topre?

I’m afraid not; the brown Alps design was only used in those switches, all the other Alps have a completely different keyfeel, as their force curves show. Lots of people think white alps are some of the best clicky switches ever made, so they’re not a bad choice for a first Alps board, but they won’t be anything like Topres

Still, I think I could start my alps adventure with this one - would you call it a good example of alps experience?
Is it 9500900?
Maybe you're right, to fully enjoy and experience alps like it should be done, I should hunt for other ones. That brown alps will be really hard to find...

[Scarpia]

It is a 9500900. The white Alps are pretty good but not perfect — which I guess is a pretty good example of the typical Alps experience:-D

[phinix]

It is a 9500900. The white Alps are pretty good but not perfect — which I guess is a pretty good example of the typical Alps experience:-D

I see, thanks. Please PM me if you decide to sell it, I may be interested. I think its easiest for me to get a full keyboard, than getting switches separately and trying to put things together.

[engr]

I see, thanks. Please PM me if you decide to sell it, I may be interested. I think its easiest for me to get a full keyboard, than getting switches separately and trying to put things together.

I have several Alps and Alps clone boards (FK-5001 with SKCM white Alps, FK-8000 with white Alps clones, KBParadise V80 with Matias clicky switches, Dell AT101W with black Alps) that I am looking to sell or trade, unfortunately shipping costs between US and UK tend to be pretty brutal...

[Scarpia]

Yes, the shipping makes it a bit silly. If the goal is to try Alps then it should be pretty easy to find a decent Alps board locally, maybe an AEKII or a Dell AT101, or even something more high end. Paying £30 for international shipping is a bit wasteful when you can probably get a great Alps board for £50.

[engr]

Paying £30 for international shipping is a bit wasteful when you can probably get a great Alps board for £50.

Unless you are into blue Alps, in which case £50 will get you 10-20 switches...

[phinix]

This one is so nice, are these rare?

[doomsday_device]

yes, ax dell with ae made 2shots is pretty rare

[hellothere]

Yup, looks like you're right. I wonder if they're all brand new like that. It is a shame it has those weird arrow keys.

That's not a shame at all. While the keys might not work on Windows 10, other than the left, right, up, and down, they're are lots of people who think that more keys = better. Further, you may be able to wire up or buy a Soarer's, TMK, or QMK adapter and make those keys do something. Macro action!

I can't see any problems with this keyboard, unless the other units aren't in good shape.

I bought one. Quoting the seller:

They are brand new, never been opened and in original packaging

I should get it pretty quickly.

[hellothere]

This one is so nice, are these rare?

Do check wiki/Dell_AT101. I've said before that if there isn't a picture of the switches, you're probably going to get the lowest value ones in the Wiki. That means black Alps.

I owned an old Logo Dell with salmon / pink Alps. The only thing that was "odd" was that it didn't like some of my PS/2 to USB active adapters -- i.e. the ones you can buy on Amazon for around $8. I don't know if it's a "thing" that you need to worry about. Again, you can always build a Soarer's ...

Good white Alps switches can easily rival good blue Alps switches.

While I've linearized more than a few Dells with black Alps, I think they don't feel as good as green and yellow doesn't feel good as green, either. That being said, I've enjoyed playing with both yellow Alps and green Alps. However, if you want linear, you want Hall-Effect or opto-electric.

[Muirium]

Given that he’s after something akin to Topre, I’d say aim for brown. Don’t have a board of those myself, so don’t know how they really compare. For what it’s worth, though: I expect a very different feel to Topre’s rubber roundness, yet strangely just as compelling. Complicated Alps seldom disappoint.

[engr]

Given that he’s after something akin to Topre, I’d say aim for brown.

They say that neon green Alps are closest to Topre, but given their rarity... it's easier and cheaper to just buy Topre.

[Muirium]

.. it's easier and cheaper to just buy Topre.

Words of wisdom.

Alps are their own thing, and their own whole world, not just a cheapo knock-off of something else. Explore them and enjoy them for what they are, not what they resemble, kinda sorta and not really.

My advice for Phinix is just to aim for tactile complicated Alps, as he's into tactility. Linear Alps are just as boring (to us tactile and clicky types) as every other linear out there. Similarly, if he's not into clicky switches, blue Alps etc. aren't his jam. (No matter how I love them!)

[Scarpia]

Mu is right. Find a board with tactile Alps (brown, orange, salmon, white damped, cream damped, black — in roughly that order of preference IMO, but don’t worry too much about it) and look to spend between £30-£100. That budget will get you a full board of all but browns and oranges, but condition is more important than colour; a clean cream damped will feel miles better than a scratchy orange.

To try out the brown Alps, often someone will sell loose Alps switches on eBay, and you can pick up one or two without breaking the bank. It won’t really tell you how they feel in a full keyboard, but it’s how I personally ended up going down the rabbit hole. I just sold my remaining 40 loose brown Alps a few weeks ago or I’d help you out myself.

[hellothere]

Yup, looks like you're right. I wonder if they're all brand new like that. It is a shame it has those weird arrow keys.

That's not a shame at all. While the keys might not work on Windows 10, other than the left, right, up, and down, they're are lots of people who think that more keys = better. Further, you may be able to wire up or buy a Soarer's, TMK, or QMK adapter and make those keys do something. Macro action!

I can't see any problems with this keyboard, unless the other units aren't in good shape.

I bought one. Quoting the seller:

They are brand new, never been opened and in original packaging

I should get it pretty quickly.

Rec'd. Yes, it's new in original box. The plastic "wrap" that was around the keyboard was ripped. Possibly the seller trying to make sure the keyboard actually worked? It does, so no worries. Complicated white Alps, w/block letter logo on the top housing. I didn't desolder any switches. Shiny metal springs, as opposed to dull metal, dull copper-color, or bright copper-color. Double-shot, both white and grey caps. I didn't remove any of the 1.25u to 2.5u caps, though. No yellowing.

So, this is the first keyboard I've had that has brand new white Alps switches. They feel nice. However, I don't think they're necessarily better than cleaned/lubed/polished/etc. white Alps. The feel is arguably more consistent. I've had some blue Alps keyboards that felt worse.

$100 US for a keyboard with brand new white Alps switches? Go for it. The seller has three left. Note that it was shipped to me in just the original keyboard box, which has big styrofoam ends, but that's it. You might want to ask for better packaging.

At some point, I'll try to take some pics for the wiki. No promises.

[hellothere]

Given that he’s after something akin to Topre, I’d say aim for brown. Don’t have a board of those myself, so don’t know how they really compare. For what it’s worth, though: I expect a very different feel to Topre’s rubber roundness, yet strangely just as compelling. Complicated Alps seldom disappoint.

A while ago, I removed the tactile brown Alps switches from a couple old IBM laptops and installed them in a Northgate OmniKey 102-key chassis. IMO, the feel is closest to amber Omron switches. Other than saying that they both felt great to me, I can't really compare tactile brown Alps to Topre. Mind you, my Topres were/are 45g and 55g. Maybe if there's a super-stiff Topre ...

I sold the brown Alps OmniKey for significantly more than a Topre. I think I've seen a total of one neon green Alps keyboard for sale in the last 2.5 or so years. IIRC, it sold for over $1000.

[Maledicted]

Rec'd. Yes, it's new in original box. The plastic "wrap" that was around the keyboard was ripped. Possibly the seller trying to make sure the keyboard actually worked? It does, so no worries. Complicated white Alps, w/block letter logo on the top housing. I didn't desolder any switches. Shiny metal springs, as opposed to dull metal, dull copper-color, or bright copper-color. Double-shot, both white and grey caps. I didn't remove any of the 1.25u to 2.5u caps, though. No yellowing.

So, this is the first keyboard I've had that has brand new white Alps switches. They feel nice. However, I don't think they're necessarily better than cleaned/lubed/polished/etc. white Alps. The feel is arguably more consistent. I've had some blue Alps keyboards that felt worse.

$100 US for a keyboard with brand new white Alps switches? Go for it. The seller has three left. Note that it was shipped to me in just the original keyboard box, which has big styrofoam ends, but that's it. You might want to ask for better packaging.

At some point, I'll try to take some pics for the wiki. No promises.

Does it have a beeper as the manual suggests? Do the different f keys send the same scancodes? The manual had some really poorly written configuration options for them.