F104+SSK+122+62+77+50+Ergo orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards

[Ellipse]

Yes confirmed ngnx.

Pad printed keys update - also I have been looking into pad printing a small batch of the black key sets with white text as a number of people have asked me about it. This is reminiscent of the IBM Model M 13H6705 keyboard, the only one with pad printed black keys to my knowledge. This is of course very low priority for this year. Pad printing can look nice but tends to wear down with usage.

If interested in black pad printed Model F / Model M keys please sign the interest form here: https://forms.gle/qnUATUrng8bX9Qxt8

Also I am sending out the email newsletter today and tomorrow, in batches (not to everyone at once) - here is a web copy for those who may not receive it by email: https://mailchi.mp/c84fd8bca891/brand-n ... 022-update

A summary for those who have not been following the updates as closely:
Production on the latest batch of keyboards and accessories finally finished this month.  All the remaining orders were loaded into a shipping container this week and will be arriving to me in early March, when I will then be spending months to go through the remaining backlog, personally testing and mailing each order.  The backlog will remain through mid-year in my estimate.  See the newsletter for details on what this means for your orders.

[I0IParzival]

Got so excited with the email update saying "Shipping your New Model F Keyboard!", but it is not shipping to me yet, it was a news letter update :brokenheart:

[Muirium]

Subject: Great News! Everyone else is having fun! Wooo!

[AnnoyedWalrus]

Got so excited with the email update saying "Shipping your New Model F Keyboard!", but it is not shipping to me yet, it was a news letter update

Yeah, that was my reaction as well. Oh well, it is always nice to get updates.

Subject: Great News! Everyone else is having fun! Wooo!

Story of my life!

[Liopleus]

The factory has noted that all keyboard assembly is finishing up tomorrow and everything is being packed into the pallets! The freight forwarder says they have reserved a container that will be leaving before Chinese New Year, to avoid losing a few weeks while everyone is on break. If all goes well the container shipment arrives in early March and then is delivered to me in mid-March.

Once again thanks to everyone for their patience as the factory wraps things up.

The schedule for this year is that after the backlog is done, the Brand New Beam Spring keyboards first round will go out, and then we still have the final round later this year for the F62/F77. After that will be the slightly more costly beam spring keyboard round with the case redesign and increased sound dampening).

If I have signed up for the first batch of Brand New Beam Spring keyboard but I prefer to have the one with redesigned case and increased sound dampening in new round, could I cancel my reservation and order the new round when it come out?

Thanks.

[Ellipse]

Liopleus the beam reservations are for the project in general - everyone needs to sign up if they prefer the second round too.

When we get closer I expect to put up some videos of the sound and operations to help folks decide. The advantage of the first round is not having to wait a year - having everything in stock, plus the full sound quality (extra reverberant and snappy) while the advantage of the second round will be more dampened sound quality like the original, as well as the redesigned more expensive case. Another consideration - the second round is expected to cost a bit more than the first given it has the extra case and because prices have gone up for a lot of manufactured goods over the past year, so it is likely that these won't be able to be manufactured at the same cost.

Currently we are up to more than 900 reservations for the beam project! The cutoff point for the first round will all depend on how many folks choose the first round vs. the second round.

[AlpsComeback]

Hello, been a while since I've participated in this thread. Do we have an ETA on when the Model F QMK support will be put into the official version? I just cloned pandrews repo and noticed I had to get an older version of QMK. Since it's been almost two years since it's had QMK support I was hoping it'd be added to the official project by now.

[Ellipse]

pandrew has been working on that - please PM pandrew as I'm not sure. I get the official version from the QMK github and then put in the folders that pandrew created and that works fine so we can use the latest QMK version with the xwhatsit controller.

[Ellipse]

The first batch of 200 front print keys arrived! These are just the pearl F1-F12 US front printed keys. I will be sending these out over the coming days to all those who are just waiting on these keys to complete their orders.

The keys came out well. As a note the alignment for the front printing is not as strong as the top alignment - this was true even for the IBM sublimated keys. The front printing has proven to be extremely difficult to even get to this point. The Industrial SSK blue 12 key sets and all the other front print sets will be completed over the coming weeks after the factory returns from their break.

New Model F production keys are on top of my IBM F122:

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This photo shows two example IBM-sublimated keys on my F122 - note the varying angles and thicknesses of the front printing even for IBM:

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[Muirium]

Nice work. They look pretty accurate. The “Test” legend is a bit heavier than my Kishsaver here but the other one is just right (if the OG actually had that key).

[markvanlan]

I just got a compact F77 from my boss, and he sent it with the disclaimer "I've sent it in for repair, and it arrived back with keys not working". My goal is to get it working!

The switches that aren't working are 2,Q,W,A,S,Z,X, and Left Alt. This is all of column 2. I have taken all the caps off, gently stretched the spring, made sure the spring is properly turned on the shaft, tilted the keyboard space key up, and put the caps back on. I have done that part multiple times, to ensure all the caps are seated properly and nothing is stuck.

I have also opened up the board and tried to add solder 3 times to the proper connection. I will post photos where you can see there is now too much solder in my attempts to get this column functioning.

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I think there may just be an issue with the controller; does anyone have any more suggestions on what I should do next? Thanks!!

[Ellipse]

Very strange; I fully test every key before mailing it. Did you apply solder to both the controller side (apply to the side with components not the bottom side) and the capacitive PCB side?

Did you test it outside of the case? With the inner assembly upside down, I would push the controller's ribbon area downwards away from the bottom. Also it is missing its polyimide tape-that might cause some columns not to work if it is touching the bottom of the metal case.

As a last resort, remove all keys and separate the top and bottom inner assembly plates, and then run the pandrew utility linked to in the manual. Click signal level monitor and show the screenshot. Sometimes one improperly installed key or some debris inside the keyboard causes an issue with the per-column auto-voltage level sensing in QMK.

[markvanlan]

Yes, I did apply solder to both the controller and the PCB side. You can kinda see in my pictures that there is more/fresh solder on both sides.

All tests were done outside the case. I did misplace the polyamide tape, so I'll have to cover that up before putting the back case on, but it is not causing the issue at hand.

Unfortunately I think I have to go with the last resort option. I'll let you know how it goes.

[markvanlan]

With everything removed, the signal level monitor shows super low signal for that column. This is plugged in, not touching any of the capacitive areas. I assume this means there is a bad connection in the ribbon cable, solder joint is bad, or there is just something wrong with the controller?!

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EDIT

I resoldered the PCB side one last time and it worked!!! Going to reassemble now.

[pandrew]

@markvanlan

Hey,

Do you have a multimeter?

if yes, open up column tester (in util.exe), put only button "2" in the pressed state,
and measure the voltage to ground of various points where that column is available.
Start at the chip pin directly:

chippin.png (892.78 KiB) Viewed 17656 times

If you see 5V on it then go down step by step and see where the column is broken.
If you don't see 5V on the chip pin, then put "1", "2" and "3" in the pressed state and check again.
If with 1/2/3 in the pressed state you now see 5V then you might have a short between two columns (although I don't think you have that, cause that would also bother the other column)
If you see 0V on the pin no matter if 1,2,3 are pressed then you probably have a short to ground. You can double-check by disconnecting the keyboard, and using continuity mode on your multimeter.

Andrei

[Ellipse]

Great, glad you fixed it! Sometimes you can fix the issue by taking it out and soldering the top capacitive PCB side that is now accessible. Be sure to apply a couple layers of polyimide or electrical tape to the bottom of the controller.

Thanks pandrew for the troubleshooting steps. Sometimes two ribbon connectors bridge each other when I am resoldering and I have to separate them to avoid a short.

[pandrew]

Oh, it's fixed? I didn't see the Edit of markvanlan's last message

[Muirium]

They were motivated to fix it pronto. It belongs to the boss!

[markvanlan]

Hahaha no, I get to keep it!!

[Liopleus]

I'd like to share my configuration on F77 HHKB with VIA:





I remap CapsLock and right Ctrl keys to fn (MO(1)).

When accessing the function row keys, I press CapsLock (now fn) with my left pinky and use another finger of my left hand to press QWER for F1~F4, ASDF as F5~F8, ZXCV as F9~F12. I found it quite convenient to access those keys when configured this way and mispress is also rare.

When accessing the numpad keys, I press the right ctrl (also fn) with my right thumb and use the rest of my right fingers for the numpad keys.

With this configuration I think it's almost as convenient to access all the keys as the standard PC104 layout while the keyboard is much more compact.

[Ellipse]

As an update the shipping container has departed on the container ship as scheduled and is now at sea! It should arrive early next month but who knows how long it will take to unload and deliver the goods with port congestion and all.

Thanks for sharing your Via configuration Liopleus.

[Malthus77]

Hi - I ordered an Off-White Kishsaver today with an ANSI layout. Will you have extra inventory to fulfill my order with the current shipment from China?

[Ellipse]

Malthus77 thanks for joining the project! To minimize production lead times for some orders after the container shipment set sail (and the same as with the prior order), I ordered extras of each variation from the factory; the current expectation is that orders can be fulfilled from this batch at least for the current month (Feb.), but no I unfortunately won't be able to check orders from here on out to see if they are in the current container shipment. There is always the chance that the factory made the wrong case colors or that some parts were damaged, which happened in the prior two shipments, and that would affect what could ship. Near month end I expect to do another check but we will probably be moving to the final round soon (these orders will be in a future container shipment).

For those holding out for the final round expecting updated components, please note that the keyboards are going to be the exact same as in the current container shipment of keyboards, which had some slight updates described on the updates page of the project web site. One notable update is that all the keyboards will have a USB-C xwhatsit controller instead of the prior batch which was mixed USB-C and the older Micro-USB standard. So I recommend joining this month if you are waiting for the final production design revision.

[Ellipse]

Here is a high end 3D printed solenoid holder for the F62 zinc case - nice work samcdc6600!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTKwhumwJyk&t=993s

https://github.com/samcdc6600/modelsFor ... noidHolder

[AnnoyedWalrus]

It is always great reading your updates, having been involved in some small series production of a couple of electronics projects myself I can imagine the huge amount of work you must have done the past few years.

I cant wait for my F77 to arrive, whenever that is!

[Runslikeapenguin]

New member here.

I got into a conversation with a kid i know who told me he preordered one of these keyboards and he was super disappointed in it when it came. He said it was non functional out of the box and he gave up trying to fix it. I'm a bit more adventurous when it comes to ripping stuff apart so told him to bring it by. Sure enough it has a bunch of dead keys and periodically on its own accord it will get a key stuck even though the keyboard has not been touched. Some of the working keys will miss direct key strokes as well. I followed all of the assembly directions from the modelfkeyboard.com site and so far i have no been able to correct any of the issues. I downloaded the pandrew xwhatsit app to check the key tester and found the following.

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Whats odd is that one of the times i flashed the keyboard, the number 24 keys (dead keys) turned to 34 and started working for a little while before they reverted back to their original state. The keyboard looks and feels like a million bucks, its a shame that so far the user experience has been so bad. the serial nuber is '0000008' so maybe this is an early model issue.

if anyone could point me in the right direction for correcting these issues i would be most greatful.
I may have missed some of these fixes but the thread is 233 pages long and this is my first visit here so please be gentle.

[Bjerrk]

I followed all of the assembly directions from the modelfkeyboard.com site and so far i have no been able to correct any of the issues. I downloaded the pandrew xwhatsit app to check the key tester and found the following.
[...]
I may have missed some of these fixes but the thread is 255 pages long and this is my first visit here so please be gentle.

Sounds like you've been very thorough for a first time visitor, so don't worry

Could you be a bit more specific about what you've tried? Have you looked for shorts or bad solder joints on the controller, for instance?

[Ellipse]

Runslikeapenguin it is likely an issue with the matrix rows - I suggest touching up all of the first 10 through holes on the controller on the components side, as shown in the photos on the manual.

[Runslikeapenguin]

I followed all of the assembly directions from the modelfkeyboard.com site and so far i have no been able to correct any of the issues. I downloaded the pandrew xwhatsit app to check the key tester and found the following.
[...]
I may have missed some of these fixes but the thread is 255 pages long and this is my first visit here so please be gentle.

Sounds like you've been very thorough for a first time visitor, so don't worry

Could you be a bit more specific about what you've tried? Have you looked for shorts or bad solder joints on the controller, for instance?

So far i have not opened it. I pulled all the keys and make sure they were loaded with the springs in the right orientation.
I pulled up the right JSON file into the QMK configurator and created a hex file to match the keyboard. I wiped the eeprom with the xwhatsit app and uploaded the new hex file using the QMK toolbox. The results did not change anything about the keyboards behavior.

I wanted to get some input from the pros before i started poking around assuming i was looking at a hardware issue.

[Runslikeapenguin]

i just plugged the keyboard into a USB port and a bunch of the keys are working again. The unpressed keys are not working but the number values have changed.

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Seconds later as i was looking at the signal level monitor and they all dropped off again.

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cycling through the keys top to bottom, left to right i was able to spot a couple of random key actuations.

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