Split ergonomic keyboard project

[mSSM]

If we split up the group-buy into chunks, shipping costs would blow up massively. As much as I want to have the keyboard myself, I don't think this is too reasonable.

I would love to see an update from the big guys though.

[bpiphany]

The PCBs are a bit on the heavy side, but they are flat and quite sturdy. I would be able to ship them within the EU for $8 or so, completely uninsured. ($10 outside EU) But I'm really not interested in doing any of the administration involved in that =P I totally understand people only wanting the PCB though. And I think that is a very reasonable thing to wish for as well. I have no insight to what is going on behind the curtains as well. I only drew the PCB up in KiCAD =)

[dirge]

Know what you mean, its the collecting money part I can't do.

[JesuswasaZombie]

Dox, etc, correct me if I'm out of line but this is a community driven project so why is everyone treating the people involved like they have to ask permission for everything? That isn't at all how the original Dox project went, it was just a wiki/ thread.

[lowkey144]

@Jesus

I think that is comes from 2 things: there is not certainty that the project is "done" and hence the hesitancy to begin, the pcb configuration is not even available on the project page, so naturally people would want to hear from the project's namesake. Second, collecting money and organizing shipping is a tall order and I think that deferring to those with forum seniority, or whatever, is a way of ensuring that the group buy will be successful.

That all being said, this recent activity here seems to indicate that all modules of the keyboard are in a finished state, so if a core of people who are knowledgeable about group buys is ready to take the reigns, then let's rumble.

[litster]

Dox, etc, correct me if I'm out of line but this is a community driven project so why is everyone treating the people involved like they have to ask permission for everything? That isn't at all how the original Dox project went, it was just a wiki/ thread.

Looks like JesuswasaZombie is ready to start the group buy. Go! Go! Go!

[bisl]

Looks like JesuswasaZombie is ready to start the group buy. Go! Go! Go!

IT BEGINS

[AloisiusFauxly]

If we split up the group-buy into chunks, shipping costs would blow up massively

Depends on how much kit you want, where you're located, and what you mean by "massively".

Teensy is $3.75 to ship to Can/US. DigiKey to Can was $8, probably the same or cheaper to US. PCBs are ~$10 from Europe to US/Can, maybe cheaper if they start in the US. The case is going to be the most expensive part to ship, and adding other parts to that shipment should only bump the price up $5-10.

So if you're not getting a case, the parts are all going to be $22 shipping from separate sources, vs an extra $5-10 if you ship them with the case, probably around $10-15 if you shipped them without the case.

That's not "massive" to me, living in Canada.

[JesuswasaZombie]

Looks like JesuswasaZombie is ready to start the group buy. Go! Go! Go!

That's more like it!

[dirge]

Who's doing this side of the pond? Thought zombie was just handling the USA side.

[litster]

Looks like JesuswasaZombie is ready to start the group buy. Go! Go! Go!

That's more like it!

By no means that it was an endorsement from me. All I have done so far is I made a case for myself. I am not even part of the ergodox project team. I actually don't know how you would start this group buy. Really, how are you going to do it? Are you starting one?

[dirge]

You up for doing more cases litster? Would mean people could buy a complete kit.

[bpiphany]

Parts and PCBs really wouldn't be hard to do a group buy for. The PCB design is pretty much set, and the parts are easy to get, and both PCBs and parts benefit greatly from larger numbers. Shipping from DigiKey/Mouser is free if you hit their pretty low threshold as well. Someone just got to do it ;)

[lowkey144]

The PCB design is pretty much set

This is what I thought, but the kicad file for it is not on the ergodox.org.

Is this process as simple as submitting the full bill of materials to the service of choice, along with the number of orders + addresses? How exactly does the money flow?

I assume that tooling costs incur a higher initial cost, but would pretty much be subsumed by an order greater than 100 units?

I guess most importantly, who does know how to do all this without screwing something up?

[bpiphany]

I guess I am the only one with access to the current PCB files ;D

You can look yourself at the digikey links on ergodox.org to see prices for the components in different quantities.

PCBs should probably come at <$20 each ($40 per pair)

[lowkey144]

PCBs should probably come at <$20 each ($40 per pair)

You already got a stack didn't you? Where did you get them from? Can we piggy-back your tooling costs? I imagine we can't but it would be neat if we could. I would be in immediately for a pair of PCBs for $40, and I might still hop on the planned larger group buy. Besides, the other components are rather easy to come by, and there are group buys on switches all the time 'round these parts.

[bpiphany]

I got 8 pairs, and I promised them all away already. I don't feel very eager on starting another group buy. I've got enough to take care of with my controllers at the moment. I could help someone else get the PCBs from the manufacturer. But the idea is really to go as big as possible to drop prices as much as possible. Ordering everything at once that is, including people wanting a case as well. On the other hand it would be sad if this never condensed into something solid...

[bpiphany]

The LP family is not for MX switches. And there are no 1.5X vertical keys in the DCS family. DSA is the only one wich would look consistently good. It would also be a bit cheaper since there are fewer key shapes in total.

[AloisiusFauxly]

And there are no 1.5X vertical keys in the DCS family

I didn't see any 1.5 verts in any set, and they would look janky as they wouldn't match the profile. Yeah, the flat profile of the DSA would make it cheaper, more consistent, and lend more flexibility to layout changes (assuming legends).

I think we all realize that entrusting someone with all the capital required to make an Ergodox is a bigger deal than buying $2 custom keycaps

Yeah, that is the big sticking point here. I think it would have to be a group-managed escrow/bank account or something similar where 4-6 core people would have to sign off on any payments. We're still relying on a group of people to manage the money and not thief it, but it would be more trustworthy that way.

[dirge]

Furthermore, as noted in the thread, the Ergodox has more >1.0x keys than your average bear. We can do the same thing with SP for the wide keys at the very least, perhaps even in a variety of colors depending on how polling and negotiations go.

1 x vote for a spherical key set in there
(how far along is the cherry legending?)

[OrangeJewce]

I try to keep GH up to date. Let's see what Dox has to say, although I would be surprised if he disapproves of this idea.

Dirge: Still prototyping. You'll know when it's done because the Dolch Replica buy will have started.

Cheers,

[JesuswasaZombie]

The Dolch replica set has almost taken a year now from when I started the project, so hopefully we'll get them soon. Here's hoping for a Colemak variant

[AloisiusFauxly]

The Dolch replica set has almost taken a year now from when I started the project, so hopefully we'll get them soon. Here's hoping for a Colemak variant

I want them now, touching my face while I sleep. That's how smitten I am with their look.

[JesuswasaZombie]

Dude, I trust Hash's judgement, when he thinks they look good enough for production we'll know.

[AloisiusFauxly]

Dude, I trust Hash's judgement, when he thinks they look good enough for production we'll know.

Oh, I'm not saying to rush them. Just that I want them.

[webwit]

I can't find info on dropbox, I must log in first, I don't have an account. I'm not making an account somewhere without knowing if I like them and find them trustworthy. I find this very strange. Also, if the first thing people point out is "immense value in the rate negotiation" then the first thing I'm going to point out is "bullshit" and wonder if what else is claimed is bullshit too.

[Icarium]

I'm in favor of a PCB only group buy to get things started. I don't necessarily need a case right away and can get everything else somewhere else. bpiphany: What would it take to convince you to do for the Ergodox what you did with your Filco replacement controller? I could help with reshipping and such, of course.

[dirge]

Would love to know if litster's cases could be priced up. They look fantastic, so good they may be copied in the far east!

[Icarium]

I thought he was pretty clear about not wanting to make them for everybody.

[dirge]

Damn missed that . Ah well we could ask nicely if he'd make his work public so others could get them made. (Crosses fingers)