As with so many things in life: Less is more.snacksthecat wrote: ↑08 Jan 2022, 07:00Another thing I just learned: you can decimate the mesh down quite low and still preserve almost all the detail. I'm doing a lot more trial and error comparisons with different settings and it's really been helpful to see clear examples of the differences.
I wanted to try what I had mentioned (using the opaque images for the meshing) but I didn't want to start the whole thing over. So I used "refine mesh", which in my prior experience took forever. What I finally realized is that you're supposed to decimate down very low before running that tool. Whatever it's doing, it results in a massive number of faces compared to the input. In that way it makes sense why having a small input would be better.
I did this process a few times. Here's the best I can muster:
https://skfb.ly/o8vAN
Keyboard Photogrammetry
- Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
Spoiler:
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
Here's a more in-depth overview of this workflow.
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
I scanned another one of the weird Alps switches that I got on ebay a few years ago and I think this turned out better than any other scan that I've done!
https://skfb.ly/osMSn
https://skfb.ly/osMSn
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
Here's a video of how I captured the images:
- kbdfr
- The Tiproman
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Main keyboard: Tipro MID-QM-128A + two Tipro matrix modules
- Main mouse: Contour Rollermouse Pro
- Favorite switch: Cherry black
- DT Pro Member: 0010
You did a really excellent job with that Alps switch.snacksthecat wrote: ↑22 Feb 2022, 03:37I scanned another one of the weird Alps switches that I got on ebay a few years ago and I think this turned out better than any other scan that I've done!
https://skfb.ly/osMSn
[…]
I would urge everyone to click your link, it is amazing how one can rotate the switch with such an utmost precision to look at it under every possible angle.
Highly professional equipment. Especially the cat and the plastic box
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
Thank you kbdfr! You're too kindkbdfr wrote: ↑22 Feb 2022, 07:05snacksthecat wrote: ↑Yesterday, 20:37
I scanned another one of the weird Alps switches that I got on ebay a few years ago and I think this turned out better than any other scan that I've done!
https://skfb.ly/osMSn
[…]
You did a really excellent job with that Alps switch.
I would urge everyone to click your link, it is amazing how one can rotate the switch with such an utmost precision to look at it under every possible angle.
snacksthecat wrote: ↑Yesterday, 21:44
Here's a video of how I captured the images:
[…]
Highly professional equipment. Especially the cat and the plastic box
As you can see, we run a pretty tight ship in the studio!
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
- CaesarAZealad
- Location: Boston, MA
- Main keyboard: NCR80
- Main mouse: Logitech G502 Hero
- Favorite switch: Zealios V2
Did you take the textures straight from a loose switch? Looks so grimey!
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
Yes, the texture was generated from the same set of photos that I used to generate the mesh. The switch came from a grimey keyboard, but it itself didn't look horrible. I gave it a quick rinse before shooting the pictures but didn't take the time to clean it down with a q-tip or anything. Some scans look cool with the natural dust and dirt that's on them. This one I think would have looked better if I took the time to clean it down. The macro lens really picks up every detail and imperfection. Here's a representative picture from the set.CaesarAZealad wrote: ↑13 Mar 2022, 21:41Did you take the textures straight from a loose switch? Looks so grimey!
One thing I wanted to mention about this scan is that I went back after the mesh was generated and made all of the cut-outs and holes. The software typically wants to generate something solid, so I felt that this step was necessary to make it more true to the physical thing.
I also played with a bunch of settings in Sketchfab, which may make things look a little off. I need to figure out why there's such a difference in quality between viewing the finished model in the photogrammetry software vs. how it renders in Sketchfab. Always a bummer to sink the time into getting the model as perfect as possible only to find that it looks weird when I upload it.
- CaesarAZealad
- Location: Boston, MA
- Main keyboard: NCR80
- Main mouse: Logitech G502 Hero
- Favorite switch: Zealios V2
You're doing gods work man! God bless
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
One problem with scanning a keyboard using the turntable workflow is that as it rotates, the edge of the keyboard moves closer to the camera, bringing the close parts out of focus. I finally tried to address this with a new technique that I thought of, which was to put the camera on a rail slider. So now as the board rotates closer, the camera slides back; then slides forwards again as the board becomes perpendicular.
I tried this new method on an NEC PC-8801 yesterday and am working on processing it now. It's probably not going to turn out great based on what I've seen so far. But I believe in theory that it has potential to yield a better result if done correctly, especially with texturing.
Here is a video of the capture process. I ran into a lot of issues at first (camera would suddenly stop triggering), but eventually worked through those problem. If nothing else it was a fun addition to implement, even though it really slowed things down. Anxious to try it again (but probably not any time soon!)
I tried this new method on an NEC PC-8801 yesterday and am working on processing it now. It's probably not going to turn out great based on what I've seen so far. But I believe in theory that it has potential to yield a better result if done correctly, especially with texturing.
Here is a video of the capture process. I ran into a lot of issues at first (camera would suddenly stop triggering), but eventually worked through those problem. If nothing else it was a fun addition to implement, even though it really slowed things down. Anxious to try it again (but probably not any time soon!)
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
I ended up shooting the photos again using some of the lessons I learned earlier. Final product turned out great though! Couldn't be happier after struggling so much with the first set of pictures.
https://skfb.ly/ouPuW
Here are all of the photos, where you can see the camera moving forwards and backwards as the board rotates.
https://skfb.ly/ouPuW
Here are all of the photos, where you can see the camera moving forwards and backwards as the board rotates.
- kbdfr
- The Tiproman
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Main keyboard: Tipro MID-QM-128A + two Tipro matrix modules
- Main mouse: Contour Rollermouse Pro
- Favorite switch: Cherry black
- DT Pro Member: 0010
I find all the effort you put into such a futile endeavor addressing just a fringe audience simply amazing.
Spoiler:
- Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
I sense an undisclosed masterplan at work here. Something, perhaps, to do with virtual reality and the Great Keyboard Library of Alexandria. That or the keyboardiest FPS ever!
Mission objective: find the magnetic valve keyboard in this room. This will not be trivial.
<Cutscene reveals a complete, open plan museum.>
Mission objective: find the magnetic valve keyboard in this room. This will not be trivial.
<Cutscene reveals a complete, open plan museum.>
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
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The short and simple answer is along the lines of what Mu said. I hope some day these models serve a purpose to others, but don't really have any specific ideas of what that might be. I would be happy if these models get used in any context for anyone who needs them. It would be rad to see one make an appearance in a video game or something but won't hold my breath. All the models are free and downloadable, though, so not totally out of the question.
Now if you'll indulge me I'd like to further explain myself by drawing an absurd comparison .
I recently watched a documentary called APEX: The Secret Race Across America. The movie is about a duo obsessed with setting the world record time for driving from New York to California.
The movie shows the degree of preparation, ability to execute, endurance to win, effort to document, and feeling of gratification that the team went through to break the record.
Preparation - The team plans every facet of the race they're attempting down to the last detail. They plan their route around speed traps and weather conditions along the way. They outfit the car with tons of tech including multiple GPS units, thermal night vision, cameras, scanners, radios, etc. They even go as far as having a scout plane following them, to warn them of any "obstacles" ahead. Similarly, the photogrammetry process requires planning out every detail to achieve the best results.
Execution - It's one thing to have a plan but a whole other thing to stick to it when the rubber meets the road. It takes discipline not to deviate but also cunning to pivot if an obstacle arises. I generally do my best to keep the plan but sometimes need to "call an audible" and adjust what I'm doing in the moment. Whether or not it works out, I try to learn from my mistakes and improve the next time.
Endurance - Obviously driving over 32 hours straight as quickly as possible is a mental and physical feat to behold. I've found over time that everything turns out best if I take as few breaks as possible and just power through the process. Breaks introduce opportunity for variables to creep in. Variables are really bad when consistency is the key to success. When I embark on the journey, I intend for my grand vision to lead me and anything that muddies those waters should be avoided at all costs.
Documentation - In the case of the race, it was important for them to document everything to prove their time was authentic. They had all the GPS data and camera footage but also saved gas/toll receipts along the way to reinforce this proof. But I suspect that they had an ulterior (more like additional) motive which is: showing what you did is fun and satisfying. Heck, they wouldn't have been able to make their movie without it. I don't really have anything I'm trying to prove, but have a great time putting together videos and sharing tips to others who might be looking for this kind of stuff. The models themselves also serve as their own documentation, which is to say that they try to capture the essence of the keyboards as accurately as possible, so that people in the future can reference them.
Gratification - This comparison is pretty self explanatory. The race team is driven by the gratification they will get by beating the record. I'm a simple man, so my ambitions are just to make the models as good as possible. I won't say that I'm rewarded by the same singular achievement, but my little wins feel good.
Anyways, the movie is fantastic and I'd definitely recommend it to anyone interested based on my description. Unfortunately it's not on any subscription streaming services, but you can buy it on Amazon Prime or Apple TV. Here's the trailer, which doesn't nearly do it enough justice.
For the record, I don't condone dangerous driving and completely disavow this awesome movie on that basis.
Also for the record, my magnetic valve keyboard is no longer in the living room and has moved to "annexed storage", also known as my kitchen closet.
- kbdfr
- The Tiproman
- Location: Berlin, Germany
- Main keyboard: Tipro MID-QM-128A + two Tipro matrix modules
- Main mouse: Contour Rollermouse Pro
- Favorite switch: Cherry black
- DT Pro Member: 0010
Which, sort of, is quite exactly what I meant. So you satisfy both Mu and mesnacksthecat wrote: ↑01 Jun 2022, 01:08The short and simple answer is along the lines of what Mu said. I hope some day these models serve a purpose to others, but don't really have any specific ideas of what that might be.[…]
And then your epic description and above all analysis of the documentary…
It was a real pleasure to read, sir.
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
- depletedvespene
- Location: Chile
- Main keyboard: IBM Model F122
- Main mouse: Logitech G700s
- Favorite switch: buckling spring
- DT Pro Member: 0224
- Contact:
Some (okay, most) of the stuff I write, both about keyboards and about other stuff, is for an audience of one: myself — can't get any more "fringe" than that! Sometimes, some of those things get a much wider audience, and that's awesome.
Whenever I get a youtube notification about a new video from snacksthecat, I pause everything I may be doing and sit down to watch it.
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
Thanks, man! That makes me feel warm and fuzzy.
- snacksthecat
- ✶✶✶✶
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: SSK
- Main mouse: BenQ ZOWIE EC1-A
- DT Pro Member: 0205
- Contact:
Saw this on twitter the other day and couldn't help but admire the man's skills. (not sure if it's a photogrammetry scan or another method).
https://twitter.com/cinnmntographer/sta ... 2163017728
https://twitter.com/cinnmntographer/sta ... 2163017728