Sadness, infinite

[Hypersphere]

And BTW, there are always the CAD and CAM issues that run on windows only anyway.

CAD is overrated.


Why not make it yourself? It is just simple R^3 vector graphics. No need to visualise. Visualisation is for people without an abstract mind.

Genius quite often involves the ability to visualize abstract concepts that others have not been able to see. Examples include Newton, Einstein, and Feynman.

[matt3o]

well anyway I don't mind changing tools once in a while... I've always jumped from one system to another. Simply windows makes me feel sad.

[Findecanor]

I don't know how I will survive without the command line and bash.

Install Cygwin or MINGW.

Not a good solution, but at least a step in the right direction.

[Muirium]

Genius quite often involves the ability to visualize abstract concepts that others have not been able to see. Examples include Newton, Einstein, and Feynman.

Sure, but I bet none of those guys had to hold a whole physical design in their head! CAD isn't very abstract at all. It is to concrete material what a text file is to its print.

[matt3o]

actually in this case "visualization" is very important. I don't want to make this too long, anyway a very important aspect of the whole process is the simulation of the milling. Consider that there are softwares (that I don't use) exclusively forged for CNC preview/simulation, these softwares are often more expensive than the CAD itself.

A simple example: thanks to the integrated simulator, I found an error in the setup (even if the model was structurally correct). This simulation saved me a broken end-mill (and they are expensive) and a lot of time.

So, yes, I could parametrically create the object but I would still need to visualize the simulation.

[Halvar]

First world problems...

You are talking about using software here that is GUI-based anyway, right? I don't see a big difference between if you boot Windows or Linux to start these programs. Sure, it's annoying to pay MS tax to just run one or two programs, but everything else ... really? What command-line stuff would you want to do on the machine where your CAM software runs?

[Hypersphere]

It would probably make my life easier just to run Windows as my primary OS, but I prefer to run Mac OS X, where I can also access unix by just opening a terminal. I also run linux boxes, mainly because it is fun, but also because there are some programs that are linux only or with which I can do more using the linux version. When I need a Windows-only program, if it won't run using Crossover/Wine, I use a VM in VMware or Parallels.

[matt3o]

You are talking about using software here that is GUI-based anyway, right? I don't see a big difference between if you boot Windows or Linux to start these programs. Sure, it's annoying to pay MS tax to just run one or two programs, but everything else ... really? What command-line stuff would you want to do on the machine where your CAM software runs?

I have scripts for all sort of things actually, image resize and compression, backup, upload to server, upload to imgur, file conversion, ... but yeah first world problem. stop talking about it, actually let me sell all my PCs and go save the whales!

[Muirium]

Save a whale: sink a whaling boat!

It would probably make my life easier just to run Windows as my primary OS…

Easier? Guess it depends on what software you need. It used to be harder, especially back in the PowerPC years. Nowadays, all the good stuff (besides games and niche stuff like the CNC control Matteo requires) is on OS X, and developers tend to be ditching Windows, if anything.

[Hypersphere]

I'll send you one of my whale-saving algorithms.

[matt3o]

just to be clear:

- nah I'm not really infinitely sad, that was an exaggeration
- I don't care what OS you use, I'm perfectly fine with all of them, I do not make crusades pro/against an OS. I chose linux for various reasons, it has its good share of problems but I prefer that to the alternatives
- I can always go back to Linux. The good about windows is that you can replace it with linux. For mac OS you need a Mac (I KNOW it's not entirely true because you can build a hackintosh, but please, just stay with me on this)

[Hypersphere]

@matt3o, I admire your healthy attitude about OSs. All too often, people react illogically and emotionally in discussions about OSs and launch into tirades and crusades. Each of the major OSs has positive and negative points. Moreover, as you pointed out, the main thing is having something to operate one's system and to launch and support the applications we use.

I like the Apple/OSX system because I like the OS and I like the hardware, but it runs deeper than this. Speaking of being illogical and emotional, I feel an emotional attachment to my Mac that I don't have with my PC. I've sensed this reaction from time to time in relation to certain other pieces of hardware. For example, before I finally bought a HHKB, I noticed in many reviews that people seemed to have an emotional attachment to this hardware akin to what I had seen with people and their Macs. They didn't merely like their HHKBs or Macs, they loved them.

I can relate to preferring linux, because using the Mac with its unix foundation led me to linux -- there is a continuum there that is less apparent to me from using Windows and DOS and then struggling with CygWin. For me, the OS that is the most fun to use is linux, but I have been unable to adopt it as my primary OS because I depend on some applications that will run only on OS X and/or Windows.

Although it is a bit harder to run linux on a Mac than on a PC, it can be done, and I can certainly run Windows on my Mac, either in a Bootcamp partition or in a VM. Thus, the Mac as a primary platform is rather versatile, but the main thing for me is that I like it.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

I feel an emotional attachment to my Mac that I don't have with my PC.

For me I think it was the fact that the Mac was so logical. Automatic file type registration, that worked no matter what I called the program or where I put it; being able to drop something into a folder instead of scrutinising SYSTEM.INI; the fact that Apple credited me with the intelligence to remove files from the Wastebasket without nagging me about whether I really wanted to delete files …

In fact, Windows has or at least had a really nasty defect: if you disable the "are you sure? are you sure? are you sure?" prompt for putting files into the Recycle Bin, it would also disable the warning when permanently deleting files off network shares where there was no Recycle Bin. I think this might be fixed now.

I fell in love with the level of engineering on the Mac. Notwithstanding the fundamental defects at the low level (API sanitisation, protected memory etc) so much of the OS just made sense in a way nothing else ever did before or since. If I opened an Open dialog box, I could drag a file or folder into it to select it, without having to navigate to the folder that's open right beside it. I worked that out for myself one day by simply making a logical assumption that, since Apple take drag and drop so seriously, that would be the most likely outcome, and it was. (Granted, I also take advantage of the ability in Windows to move an item into an Open dialog …)

However, there's also a lot of native technicality in Windows that I love too, such as the intelligent way you can now control file association (8 and 7 and probably Vista too), as well as file type verbs and right-drag.

[Halvar]

... but yeah first world problem. stop talking about it, actually let me sell all my PCs and go save the whales!

I think you know what I mean... And no, I wasn't serious either.

bt6f2.jpg (56.75 KiB) Viewed 4097 times

The good about windows is that you can replace it with linux.

The good about windows is that you can get ALL kinds of software for it. Believe it or not, you can even script image processing, server up-/downloads and various kinds of other stuff with it!

[jacobolus]

CAD is overrated.

Why not make it yourself? It is just simple R^3 vector graphics. No need to visualise. Visualisation is for people without an abstract mind.

Writing G-code by hand is great fun.

Or if you wanna get fancy, use python:

[Muirium]

If I opened an Open dialog box, I could drag a file or folder into it to select it, without having to navigate to the folder that's open right beside it. I worked that out for myself one day by simply making a logical assumption that, since Apple take drag and drop so seriously, that would be the most likely outcome, and it was.

I use that so regularly that its absence alone makes Windows drive me berserk. What's the effing use of an open dialog that doesn't take a dropped folder or file? I have a mouse, I have a selection, I have the file right here, not there, here you motherf**king piece of awwww goddamn it I'm turning green again!

(Granted, I also take advantage of the ability in Windows to move an item into an Open dialog …)

Pop! What the? You're back to being a madman, Daniel. And it was so beautiful for a moment there…

[Madhias]

In the Windows open dialog you can copy files, delete files, move files, etc. You can do everything you could do with a normal Explorer window. You can even type, to connect to a network share for example. Also: you open up a file, and when you want to save it, the dialog is always in the same directory. Things that are for me much more important than to drag and drop files into that window.
[EDIT] But (i) stop it now, all computer stuff is nice to master! That's the challenge

[matt3o]

... but yeah first world problem. stop talking about it, actually let me sell all my PCs and go save the whales!

I think you know what I mean... And no, I wasn't serious either.

bt6f2.jpg

LOL

The good about windows is that you can replace it with linux.

The good about windows is that you can get ALL kinds of software for it. Believe it or not, you can even script image processing, server up-/downloads and various kinds of other stuff with it!

I like windows for its versatility and mac for its coherence. My attachment to linux is motivated by other factors.

Surely the customizability of linux is unparalleled and I love it. KDE for example is the best desktop environment ever created. The file manager is simply fantastic. You can have tabs, you can have panels, you can mount directly an SSH partition. Integrated multiple clipboards. And most importantly... global and local shortcuts. For each and every software you can define your own shortcut, and the local ones override the globals. If you don't like KDE there's gnome, awesome wm, openbox, cinnamon, xde, etc etc...

But all that has little to do with the reasons that led me to use Linux. My motivations are more ethical, but again I do not make it a crusade. I'm perfectly fine with any OS.

[7bit]

KDE is shit! Especially since they changed so much that old programs based on it, did not work anymore. So I dropped KDE-based software altogether.

BTW: When I save a file in emacs it also lands where I got it from and not where it has been started, so nothing special. Even better: Emacs has buffers where more than one directory listing is stored, so you don't have to wait for ages until it builds up again and don't have to navigate through the whole shit again to get where you where before. Just select the buffer with the directory you want.


What I hate with windows is that you can edit a file when you want to click on it. Who thought this bullshit out?


For renaming there is only one true way:

Code: Select all

RENAME(1)              Perl Programmers Reference Guide              RENAME(1)



NAME
       rename - renames multiple files

SYNOPSIS
       rename [ -v ] [ -n ] [ -f ] perlexpr [ files ]

DESCRIPTION
       "rename" renames the filenames supplied according to the rule specified
       as the first argument.  The perlexpr argument is a Perl expression
       which is expected to modify the $_ string in Perl for at least some of
       the filenames specified.  If a given filename is not modified by the
       expression, it will not be renamed.  If no filenames are given on the
       command line, filenames will be read via standard input.

       For example, to rename all files matching "*.bak" to strip the
       extension, you might say

               rename 's/\.bak$//' *.bak

       To translate uppercase names to lower, you'd use

               rename 'y/A-Z/a-z/' *

OPTIONS
       -v, --verbose
               Verbose: print names of files successfully renamed.

       -n, --no-act
               No Action: show what files would have been renamed.

       -f, --force
               Force: overwrite existing files.

ENVIRONMENT
       No environment variables are used.

AUTHOR
       Larry Wall

SEE ALSO
       mv(1), perl(1)

DIAGNOSTICS
       If you give an invalid Perl expression you'll get a syntax error.

BUGS
       The original "rename" did not check for the existence of target
       filenames, so had to be used with care.  I hope I've fixed that (Robin
       Barker).



perl v5.10.1                      2011-06-25                         RENAME(1)

What is drag&drop?

[Daniel Beardsmore]

In the Windows open dialog you can copy files, delete files, move files, etc. You can do everything you could do with a normal Explorer window.

Almost. Unless the calling application advertises that it can accept a multiple selection, you can only work on a single file at a time in an Open or Save dialog. Double-click is also overridden, so you have to use right-click to get Open to view a file.

Apple also grey out files of inappropriate types, while in Windows they are hidden, which is really confusing for anyone transitioning to Office 2007 upwards, as suddenly all their files are "gone"! What's happening is that Office is defaulting to DOCX/XLSX etc, and DOC/XLS etc files are being hidden in Save dialogs because they're not the same file type. So when you try to save a new file, you're looking at what seems to be an empty directory. All your old DOC/XLS files are missing. That's quite scary.

You're back to being a madman, Daniel.

You are quite mistaken. I am always a madman.

[andrewjoy]

If I opened an Open dialog box, I could drag a file or folder into it to select it, without having to navigate to the folder that's open right beside it. I worked that out for myself one day by simply making a logical assumption that, since Apple take drag and drop so seriously, that would be the most likely outcome, and it was.

RISC OS did it first that was all drag and drop, to save you just dragged the file to where you wanted it needed a 3 button mouse however.

I have recently gone back to RISC os on my pi just for nostalgia and whist dated now that OS was way way ahead of its time. Apart form the slooooooowww web browser when running java script the thing is lighting fast.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

I've mentioned RISC OS many times (here and elsewhere), including my RISC OS GUI page, but no-one could give a toss. It's no wonder there's so much abysmal UI and UX in the world today when people so utterly refuse to learn from the vast wealth of ideas the industry has seen over the decades.

Everyone just copies Apple, even when Apple do something monumentally stupid.

[andrewjoy]

Oh I agree bad User interfaces are one of my pet hates, i am sure modern software companies have a council where they work out how to make the worst UI's possible. A bad ui can make your program slow and unusable, and can also effect your performance.

Back when I played Warcraft there is no way i would let anyone who had a UI like this get anywhere near my raid





EDIT

And don't get me started on apples whole mission control thing and windows metro AHHHHH!

[matt3o]

I hate to say that... but... win8 is not that bad after all...

[Madhias]

I prefer 8 (.1) over 7.

[scottc]

Same here.

[Muirium]

Not as calm and modern as the old days, though.



Hot Dog!

I assume you guys are talking about the Classic mode in Windows 8, and not the new Metro stuff, right? Far as I've seen, software for the latter is slim pickin's.

[matt3o]

well I had to install it anyway because win 7 was incredibly unstable on my config (Z97/SSD/i7/GTX970)... but once you get to know it, win8 works pretty well. startup time is amazing.

[Muirium]

You'd think so with an i7 and SSD! Mind, my core gamer friend's similar system (probably quicker, it's way loud as he's an FPS fiend) takes forever to get through BIOS, then it's fairly quick. Given just how large that OS still is.

[matt3o]

no, really it's basically instantaneous (if it doesn't have to install those 54 updates before startup... which almost always has to)

oh and BTW... MSI GTX970... best GPU ever. Semi-passive. Super silent.