Interest Check - European Poker Group buy Round 2

Klopsch · 20 Aug 2011, 02:51

I´m interested.

I would buy on with MX blue ones.

wupi · 20 Aug 2011, 03:55

Can you post some pictures of the differences?

Ekaros · 20 Aug 2011, 08:10

ISO, with reds...

Now to find blues for my newish doubleshots...

komar007 · 21 Aug 2011, 10:40

I'm interested in 1 Cherry MX Brown, ANSI.

grasshopper · 21 Aug 2011, 12:14

Daniel Beardsmore wrote:
TheSoulhunter wrote:Can they be plate mounted this time? :3
What would you consider to be a fair price for the keyboards if the redesign and retooling is taken into account?

I'd be happy if the top-left key was Esc normally and ` with Fn (matches normal Windows usage with the ease of cancelling things but with the need to enter ` in Linux as well at times), and if the keycaps are elegant. And of course ISO. Ideally windowed lock keys – I think iMav is ordering PBT sets without the nice windows in the keys, which is really sad.

I also realise that I'd lose numpad * (expand all child nodes in Windows) but that's a problem with any tenkeyless keyboard.

The lack of plate mounting is also a serious issue for me. It's almost a deal breaker. I'd be willing to overlook the lack of a metal plate only if they were significantly cheaper. I understand the appeal of a compact layout. But it's possible to buy a brand new full size cherry board for about the same price.

grasshopper · 21 Aug 2011, 12:19

I've just had a thought. Would it be possible to supply the keyboards without keycaps? That could potentially reduce the price and the shipping costs. Most of us seem to be replacing some or all of the keycaps anyway. So we could source the keycaps separately.

Also, how about offering the boards as a kit with some or all of the switches not yet soldered into place. This would enable the user to choose between ISO and ANSI layouts.

Daniel Beardsmore · 21 Aug 2011, 15:09

My technology teacher at school had an interesting name for bad solder jobs: Dolly Partons … (which applied to most of my attempted soldering)

My only fear is that I won't be able to whack Esc single-handedly without losing the ` character. I've never used a PCB-mounted Cherry or ALPS so this would be my first, as well as my first Cherry red.

The snag with third-party keycaps is that they won't be labelled with the secondary functions of all the keys. Replacing the caps once you're familiar with the board is one thing, but starting out without a reference would be a pain, although you could of course put sticky labels on all the keys until you've memorised everything – a keyboard with training wheels. It would of course spoil the look of your brand new keyboard, just like you'd look ridiculous learning to ride a bicycle with training wheels as an adult!

Ekaros · 21 Aug 2011, 15:28

Daniel Beardsmore wrote:My technology teacher at school had an interesting name for bad solder jobs: Dolly Partons … (which applied to most of my attempted soldering)

My only fear is that I won't be able to whack Esc single-handedly without losing the ` character. I've never used a PCB-mounted Cherry or ALPS so this would be my first, as well as my first Cherry red.

The snag with third-party keycaps is that they won't be labelled with the secondary functions of all the keys. Replacing the caps once you're familiar with the board is one thing, but starting out without a reference would be a pain, although you could of course put sticky labels on all the keys until you've memorised everything – a keyboard with training wheels. It would of course spoil the look of your brand new keyboard, just like you'd look ridiculous learning to ride a bicycle with training wheels as an adult!

Still some of us are looking for other layout, like Finnish or German and so on. So it's blank or have some of our own keys, might go with blanks...

Daniel Beardsmore · 21 Aug 2011, 15:41

It could be like a Majestouch Ninja, with front lettering just for the Fn layer … That would be awesome.

wupi · 22 Aug 2011, 00:02

Nice idea.

CeeSA · 22 Aug 2011, 10:16

only ISO layout if available.
1 or 2

Daniel Beardsmore · 22 Aug 2011, 19:49

grasshopper wrote:Also, how about offering the boards as a kit with some or all of the switches not yet soldered into place. This would enable the user to choose between ISO and ANSI layouts.

I wonder how well that would work with left shift in terms of it being either one or two keys, in such a small space, and whether or not you'd put a stabiliser in (which I preusme you would for the full-size ANSI shift, but not for the teeny ISO shift).

Are you Dutch? I don't know how many European countries use ANSI, but the Netherlands is one (and Geekhack won't ship to Europe). That said, for ANSI countries, no additional work needs doing (well, unless you want it plate mounted); it's only ISO countries where we need to convince KBC to redo the PCB for us …

pederlol · 23 Aug 2011, 11:17

If ISO is available, I'd be in for a MX Blue.

The Solutor · 23 Aug 2011, 11:46

Ekaros wrote:ISO, with reds...

Now to find blues for my newish doubleshots...

+1

runeazn · 23 Aug 2011, 13:55

Im in for another board if it has Jp layout

Which is available I think, atleast thats what the poker manuals says,
Available layout:
US USA
JP US - English/ Japan
KR US - english/Korea
other countries on request

Or do they require a insane MOQ?

TheDuke · 24 Aug 2011, 11:19

If ISO will be available, I would like to get one with MX Reds.

rouston · 24 Aug 2011, 20:46

What would really be great would be a group buy of HHKB2 pro

hargon · 24 Aug 2011, 20:55

There is no ISO Layout für the KBC Poker, or should i be wrong?

grasshopper · 24 Aug 2011, 20:56

rouston wrote:What would really be great would be a group buy of HHKB2 pro

It would depend on the price.

When purchased through the usual channels the HHKB2 is insanely overpriced. However, that might be due to middlemen profiteering. It would be interesting to see how much the factory sells them for.

rouston · 24 Aug 2011, 21:37

grasshopper wrote:
rouston wrote:What would really be great would be a group buy of HHKB2 pro
It would depend on the price.

When purchased through the usual channels the HHKB2 is insanely overpriced. However, that might be due to middlemen profiteering. It would be interesting to see how much the factory sells them for.

yes, and Topre switches are very expensive.

Daniel Beardsmore · 24 Aug 2011, 22:03

rouston wrote:yes, and Topre switches are very expensive.

Is there a good reason for this? I mean the whole point of rubberdome keyboards was to make them cheap, so I don't quite get how Topre can make a dome and a spring cost more than an ALPS switch! They must be using some really premium rubber and spring steel brought back from Mars by NASA.

lal · 24 Aug 2011, 22:24

Must... resist...

webwit · 24 Aug 2011, 22:32

I've mentioned before that the rubber is harvested from the trees in 4 to 5 year cycles (depending on the activity of sunspots) in a secret valley on the southern ranges of Mount Fuji, where no humans have been except for a small group of devoted monks who have been initiated in the Arts.

That, and the capacitive nature and the best quality control in the business.

rouston · 24 Aug 2011, 22:36

Daniel Beardsmore wrote:
rouston wrote:yes, and Topre switches are very expensive.
Is there a good reason for this? I mean the whole point of rubberdome keyboards was to make them cheap, so I don't quite get how Topre can make a dome and a spring cost more than an ALPS switch! They must be using some really premium rubber and spring steel brought back from Mars by NASA.

maybe you should stop your trolls about HHKB2 and Topre. The fact that you can't afford them should not push you to keep on calling them rubber domes, implying they are inferior to MX cherry ones, which is actually by far the opposite.

webwit · 24 Aug 2011, 22:38

Beardsmore is a name like a boss though and I am naturally impressed.

TheSoulhunter · 24 Aug 2011, 22:57

Daniel Beardsmore wrote:
TheSoulhunter wrote:Can they be plate mounted this time? :3
What would you consider to be a fair price for the keyboards if the redesign and retooling is taken into account?

+15 Euros

Daniel Beardsmore · 25 Aug 2011, 00:23

rouston wrote:maybe you should stop your trolls about HHKB2 and Topre. The fact that you can't afford them should not push you to keep on calling them rubber domes, implying they are inferior to MX cherry ones, which is actually by far the opposite.

Opinion varies, some people prefer them to Cherry MX, others don't. In recordings they all sound like rubberdomes, and personally I expect keyboards to have a good solid, clear metallic sound to them, not a plasticky rattle (the only metal you get from a Topre is the unnervingly loud spacebar stabiliser, which is exactly the same as my 486's dome keyboard). At home, it's clicky all the way, and Topre will never deliver there. I've considered a Realforce for the office, as it's a quiet switch and my Cherry MX brown is a tad loud, but as Topre have no aesthetic sense whatsoever, it's an awful waste of money to have something that doesn't sound metal and looks cheap at the same time.

I certainly intend to buy a Realforce one day just to see what all the fuss is about, but my focus right now is on clicky keyboards, and nothing on the planet sounds finer than my deeply resonant complicated blue ALPS (except the DOS era 2KRO blocking is truly obnoxious -- ctrl-shift-end for example doesn't work, not ctrl-alt-F12 -- grr).

I'm also curious about linear switches and mini keyboards, so an ISO Poker with Cherry reds seems a better deal than an HHKB for a whopping $300. Even if KBC's quality control is a joke (their idea of an LED is window seems to be jamming random off-cuts of plastic in wrongways into a hole in a key) :)

If there's anything worth the extra money, it's getting Unicomp to retool a modern buckling spring keyboard and some fresh moulds!

/rant ("/" valid for today only)

ripster · 25 Aug 2011, 02:20

They DO feel kinda like springy rubber domes.

Because they ARE!

But what does this have to do with European Poker Group Buy Round 2? And where is this famed EU DISCIPLINE I hear so much about?

TheSoulhunter · 25 Aug 2011, 09:30

Anyway, if the board will be identical to the current one Id get 1 blue and 1 red,
but if they are plate mounted 2 blue / 2 brown / 2red, perhaps more...

rouston · 25 Aug 2011, 10:11

ripster wrote:They DO feel kinda like springy rubber domes.

Because they ARE!

But what does this have to do with European Poker Group Buy Round 2? And where is this famed EU DISCIPLINE I hear so much about?

that was not the point. it was about the way things are said and presented. anyway your post was predictible, that's a good thing.