A new US Republican thread 2016

[jacobolus]

His male children are spoiled incompetents who have gone through life in the shadow of their horrible abusive father. The two sons have repeatedly said unbelievably stupid (bigoted, clueless, etc.) things, but only a fraction of what the big cheeto himself has said. They don’t seem like inherently evil people, but I certainly wouldn’t want them anywhere near the levers of power.



Ivanka is smarter, but she’s long ago sold her soul for a piece of future inheritance.

[seebart]

I believe all that...sad golden cage life those three lead. Old Don knows how to control the people around him including his children. I thought it was sad and funny when Leslie Stahl asked Mrs. Trump if and how she criticises her husband...

[andrewjoy]

His male children are spoiled incompetents who have gone through life in the shadow of their horrible abusive father.

Can i ask, what bearing does Trump Jr have on his fathers ability to do his job ?

This is not the Klingon Empire, one persons miss deeds does not rub off and dis honour the rest of the family.

[002]

This thread is salty as fuck now
On the surface his kids seemed OK in that 60 minutes interview. Definitely Ivanka comes across as the smartest and most well-adjusted but who really knows how the others are. They are all super defensive and seem genuinely proud of their dad though and honestly I am finding it pretty hard to believe that Don is just iron fist mode all the time with his kids. Has anyone else seen Faherty's interview of Donald?

There are some bits there that give me a bit of insight into how Trump acts when he's a bit more relaxed...I think he's just a bant-lord and likes to joke around and swear and make lewd jokes like most guys do. None of this throw-away comments have ever really offended me personally -- even his really "risqué" comments would be mild compared to the stuff my work colleagues and I joke about on a daily basis. I don't agree with all of his policies but I don't understand the raging hate-on's that a lot seem to have for him as a person.

[vivalarevolución]

His male children are spoiled incompetents who have gone through life in the shadow of their horrible abusive father.

Can i ask, what bearing does Trump Jr have on his fathers ability to do his job ?

This is not the Klingon Empire, one persons miss deeds does not rub off and dis honour the rest of the family.

Because the president-elect values greatly what his children have it say about matters, that was covered during the campaign.

Overall, the male children just remind of a bunch of white, East coast finance bros that have lived in a bubble their complete life and are absolutely clueless about the lives of everyday Americans, but are pretty good at manipulating them to vote for them. I would love to have ride around with me for a day in my favorite urban neighborhoods just to see how they react.

[vivalarevolución]

This thread is salty as fuck now
On the surface his kids seemed OK in that 60 minutes interview. Definitely Ivanka comes across as the smartest and most well-adjusted but who really knows how the others are. They are all super defensive and seem genuinely proud of their dad though and honestly I am finding it pretty hard to believe that Don is just iron fist mode all the time with his kids. Has anyone else seen Faherty's interview of Donald?

There are some bits there that give me a bit of insight into how Trump acts when he's a bit more relaxed...I think he's just a bant-lord and likes to joke around and swear and make lude jokes like most guys do. None of this throw-away comments have ever really offended me personally -- even his really "risqué" comments would me mild compared to the stuff my work colleagues and I joke about on a daily basis. I don't agree with all of his policies but I don't understand the raging hate-on's that a lot seem to have for him as a person.

It's because the things he says have inspired a great deal of hate speech and hate crimes directed at people already, and many of the groups he has spoken ill about are genuinely scared that they will be further targeted. His rhetoric is having very real effects for very real people. It's the fact that white supremecists feel empowered and emboldened by this election, that this is their man. Hate speech, misogyny, vague racism, and various other hateful tactics are becoming normalized. One thing I have noticed is that people not a part of the groups that were a subject of his rhetoric don't seem to understand how others are scared or have already been targeted.

As clichéd as it is, with great power comes great responsibility. And I don't have confidence in his or the people around him ability to hold himself responsible and accountable.

[002]

What has he said specifically that is making people scared?

[vivalarevolución]

What has he said specifically that is making people scared?

I'm not sure if you're serious or haven't paid much attention to the rhetoric during the campaign or what.

[002]

Just say what it is, mate.
Don't give me the Carl the Cuck response which is "r u fucking kidding me!?"

I can't believe that people are quaking in their boots over anything Trump said...I don't remember him ever pointing out that he was going after innocent, law-abiding American citizens...but I am happy to be proven otherwise.

[jacobolus]

002, What in the world is a “bant lord”, and what is a “Carl the Cuck response”?

I feel like you must be either (a) living in an extreme bubble with almost no contact with any mainstream media or the outside world in general, or (b) just trolling us at this point. You clearly haven’t bothered to read what anyone has been writing in this thread, so I’m not sure why we’re bothering to keep trying to get through to you.

Trump bragged about how he could sexually assault women because “When you’re a star you can do anything. Grab ’em by the pussy. Anything.” Turns out that bragging wasn’t just idle chitchat. He really has sexually assaulted dozens if not hundreds of women over the course of his life. Without any consent he has groped them, kissed them, made creepy passes at obviously uninterested married women, publicly humiliated them for just doing their jobs, made jokes about dating young girls, etc. He has called women pigs, dogs, etc. There was the infamous “blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her ... wherever”. After he got a bad scalp reduction surgery (to cover up his balding) from a plastic surgeon his first wife recommended, he went home and started screaming at her, ripping handfuls of hair out of her head, and then raped her.

He has suggested that women should be punished for having abortions, something even the strongest anti-abortion activists think is a horrible idea. (During the presidential debate he made it clear that he knows absolutely nothing about pregnancy, childbirth, or abortions. The man has several children, but he has apparently never bothered to learn even the barest minimum about how birth works.)

Mike Pence believes in “gay conversion therapy”, hateful torturous bullshit which leads to a high suicide rate among the people who go through it. As governor, he has presided over an incredible assault on gay people and reproductive rights in his state.

Trump started his campaign by suggesting that Mexican immigrants are “rapists” and “criminals”. He followed that up with a long campaign of hate aimed primarily at American Muslims, Hispanics, and blacks, but extending to various other groups as well. He attacked the family of a fallen soldier because they were Muslim, attacked a federal judge because his parents were Mexicans. He either doesn’t know, or pretends to not know, the barest minimum about life in cities, despite having lived in NYC his whole life. His campaign revolved around being a “law and order” candidate, which seems to basically be code for “harass and oppress all the brown people”. He apparently doesn’t know or pretends not to know the most basic facts about the historical trajectory of crime rates or police practices. He called for nationwide expansion of unconstitutional racial profiling. He suggested we should put Muslims in a national registry (can you think of any past parallels??!). He suggested we should institute an unconstitutional (and ridiculously impractical) religious test on anyone entering the country.

Steve Bannon, who will be one of Trump’s top white house staffers, is an anti-semitic white nationalist. If you spend a few minutes reading about him, you will come away disgusted.

Trump has made supportive comments about fringe conspiracy theorists with right-wing radio shows and websites.

He has praised Hussein, Gaddafi, Kim, Putin, the Chinese crack-down on Tiananmen Sq. protestors, etc.

During the presidential debate he explicitly said that if he were elected, Hillary Clinton would go to jail.

He has called for silencing journalists who question him, said we should change libel laws so he can more easily sue the media into submission, spent his rallies encouraging supporters to harass the journalists in attendance to the point that they needed armed police support to do their reporting jobs.

He made physical assaults on protestors at his rallies a kind of ritual, making plenty of comments about how in the good old days they’d get beaten to a pulp, said don’t worry he’d pay the legal fees of anyone who assaulted a protestor, etc. He kicked a black supporter out just on the presumption that any black person at his rally must be up to no good. He egged his followers on as they chanted about jailing or executing Clinton.

[vivalarevolución]

Just say what it is, mate.
Don't give me the Carl the Cuck response which is "r u fucking kidding me!?"

I can't believe that people are quaking in their boots over anything Trump said...I don't remember him ever pointing out that he was going after innocent, law-abiding American citizens...but I am happy to be proven otherwise.

The refrain that he has not gone after law abiding American citizens is one I hear often and somewhat irrelevant, because one man can only do so much, but in a position of power he can have a lot of influence over others. Many acts of hate or violence or property damage are being conducted against law abiding American citizens, inspired by his election and rhetoric. It's the same sort of thing we saw after Brexit.


There are people, especially young people, that are influenced by the words of our most prominent leaders. That's why leaders often are so careful with their words, and should be held responsible.

Here is just a primer of his speech against certain groups: http://www.latimes.com/nation/politics/ ... story.html

Also, the number of individuals he has insulted simply for being who they are has got to be some sort of record:
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016 ... sults.html

Then I can point my personal observation of citizens of Hispanic and Muslim origin feeling scared, LGBT and women scared that some of their rights might be threatened (some by the Republican agenda, in addition to Trump's rhetoric).

If you are interested in understanding how law abiding American citizens simply are scared, rather than working off your current assumptions, there is ample evidence to support my statement if you want to poke around the Internet a bit.

[seebart]

I can't believe that people are quaking in their boots over anything Trump said...I don't remember him ever pointing out that he was going after innocent, law-abiding American citizens...but I am happy to be proven otherwise.

They are doing so now in particular since he will be chief in commander at least the next four years, oh look here he is getting his first ideas...

1f2c3cc081fbde7d.jpeg (34.42 KiB) Viewed 4789 times

[002]

Should have known I'd get a wall of text from Mr Facts (aka jacob). You focus a lot on peoples beliefs and opinions and little on their actions. I don't care if Pence is delusional enough to think that gay conversion therapy works, or Trump hurt your fragile little feelings because he said he'd grab a pussy or says he's going to do this and that...

You live in a democracy to prevent such things from getting traction. If you were president elect, there would be a million and one things that make you *WRONG*, and a cunt to somebody with a different opinion.

[jacobolus]

In other words, when you say “please tell me why ...” that is really code for “don’t bother trying to talk to me, I’m not listening anyway”

Why are you even here, Mr. “Carl the cuck bant lord fragile little feelings cunt to someone else”?

[fohat]

oh look here he is getting his first ideas...

Is that Ollie North in the background?

- - - - -

Donald Trump, Jr in his triumph. Neither clothes nor knife is soiled.

[jacobolus]

That’s a magic blood-proof knife. The kind doctors use when they rip the baby out of a woman and ritually sacrifice it.

[jacobolus]

Then I can point my personal observation of citizens of Hispanic and Muslim origin feeling scared, LGBT and women scared that some of their rights might be threatened (all by the Republican agenda, in addition to Trump's rhetoric).

And not just.

One of my wife’s acquaintances, a Chinese–American, was shouted at by a man in a pickup truck to “go home to your country” in a Silicon Valley supermarket parking lot.

More seriously, there have been numerous attacks on Sikhs, Hindus, Jews, etc.

[seebart]

Is that Ollie North in the background?

Could be.

That’s a magic blood-proof knife. The kind doctors use when they rip the baby out of a woman and ritually sacrifice it.

That's a disturbing picture in more than one way...what a looser.

[cookie]

That elephant picture is fucking disgusting... I'd love to punch that sucker right in the mouth!

[XMIT]

jacobolus, you're up early for CA time.

Recall that I'm ethnically Puerto Rican, all of my grandparents were born on the island. I don't advertise this often because it's just plain not relevant. I don't come here to talk about race, I come here to talk about keyboards.

I've been fortunate to not hit much racism. It helps to sound like an educated native English speaker with a neutral accent, and it helps that I'm good with math and computers. But every now and again, I do.

A few months ago I was outside elecplus's recycler contact in the Dallas area. I locked myself out of the car and was waiting on roadside assistance. It was about 1pm on a weekday. Some morons yelled at me to get back to work and stop being lazy. They must have assumed that I was a day laborer or something.

When this happens I'm not angry. Usually, I'm sad for the attackers. They are the victims of their own incompetence, their own poor decisions, and a system that does nothing to break the cycle of poverty and poor education. I realize how fortunate I am for the good things that have happened to me, and how they're not guaranteed for everyone.

The recent elections have served to embolden those more hateful members in our communities, yes, but the real problem is that they were created in the first place, and that they never want away. They've been quiet for the last eight years. Not gone, simply biding their time.

I focus on decisions and actions that I can make, and factors that I can control. I can instill my values in my offspring and lead by example for others around me. What are you doing?

[jacobolus]

> What are you doing?

These days mostly feeding a 3-month-old baby and reading math books.

If anyone wants a break from politics, try forgetting the multiplication table and forgetting you know how to write Hindu–Arabic numbers and then computing the square root of two in base-60 with nothing but some lines in the sand and a pile of pebbles. http://ethw.org/Ancient_Computers

[vivalarevolución]

Should have known I'd get a wall of text from Mr Facts (aka jacob). You focus a lot on peoples beliefs and opinions and little on their actions. I don't care if Pence is delusional enough to think that gay conversion therapy works, or Trump hurt your fragile little feelings because he said he'd grab a pussy or says he's going to do this and that...

You live in a democracy to prevent such things from getting traction. If you were president elect, there would be a million and one things that make you *WRONG*, and a cunt to somebody with a different opinion.

Alright tough guy. Beliefs and opinions often lead to actions. That's the underpinning of the idea of a thought crime, and it's very successful in influencing people's actions (for example voting decisions). Pence's discriminatory actions as a politician support his beliefs, and the dozens of women allegedly assaulted by the president-elect may also have suffered from his actions. I suppose that women subject to assault should simply brush that off and vote differently.

We live in a flawed representative democracy that seems to have lurched towards a plutocracy and allows money and power to influence the discourse and policy more than the views of the majority or even protect basic individuals rights for certain groups against the government or mob. It's easy for a voice to feel drowned out when we have a few hundred price representing 320 million.

It's not about right and wrong, nobody can know it all or be right 100% of the time or say nothing deserving of criticism. It's about a worldview that is pervading in the country that basically reduces individuals to subhuman deserving of quick judgment, hate, ridicule, violence, stripping of rights, etc.

And that is directed at all individuals engaging in insulting, mocking, and hateful discourse or dialogue that basically does not foster greater understanding. Unfortunately, the left is unaware when they do this and hate seems to be emboldened by the current president-elect.

[Findecanor]

That elephant picture is fucking disgusting... I'd love to punch that sucker right in the mouth!

You will have to get in line behind me.

[andrewjoy]

Trump is racist: Wanting to deport people who are in your country illegally is not racism, he also said some illegal immigrants are criminals this is a fact, just like some home grown US people are , or tourists from europe are , stating fact is not racism.

Trump is sexiest: At worst he is an asshole, he brags that people let him touch them because he is rich, and that prob true there is no evidence whatsoever that he sexually abused anyone

Trump is homophobic: Whist his running partner does have some insane views on electrocuting the gay away, trump himself has never said anything like this.

Trump is transphobic or does not support LGBT ( QPOZDFG whatever else) rights: He is actively on record as supporting the rights of trans people to use whatever bathroom they want , whist this is a small thing it indicates tolerance in this area.

Trump is a complete arsehole, a terrible businessmen, a uneducated, anti vaccination creationist fool. But please be accurate with your criticism.

For people to be in genuine panic beacuse he has won , thinking peoples rights with disappear and that anyone who is not a white straight American will be rounded up is insane, thats is NEVER and i repeat NEVER going to happen.

I will bring up my point again.

For an asshole like trump to win the biggest job in the world via an election shows you how absolutely terrible his opponent was, sure there will be people who vote for trump who are racist or sexist or transphobic or whatever else, not everyone who voted for trump is.

Rather than talking about the positives of a Clinton administration, all she did was insult people who voted for Trump call them everything under the sun, racist sexist whatever, she sounded like she was preaching to a regressive left echo chamber, not the best way to run a campaign. If you constantly abuse people , tell them they are racist beacuse they are white or sexist beacuse they are male you are stereotyping them you are doing to them what you claim they are doing to everyone else.

Normal people are sick of this , they are sick of being lied to by politicians , the media and everyone else. They are sick of being told how terrible they are and you are surprised that they voted for change ( terrible change yes ) but change none the less.

The left need to look in the mirror and see how terrible they have become, there echo chamber has been infected with marxism in the form of social justice, where no discussion is allowed , no decent is tolerated and there view is the only one, don't agree with them , then your a <insert insult> and we will no platform you.

We need a world where people can discuss , can present evidence , can have differing views even express terrible views so that we can show how wrong they are not just say how wrong they are. We need a world where there is a platform where we can show how terrible people like trump are , but the people in power ( the left) have things set up so this cannot happen. Its sad, so so sad.

The right when they get into power will be no different, its a shit system but its the one we have, and for now its the best we have come up with.

[seebart]

For an asshole like trump to win the biggest job in the world via an election shows you how absolutely terrible his opponent was...

That unfortunately is true, Clinton ran her campaign like a conceited winner from the beginning. But that's not what killed it for her, rather all the political "skeletons in her closet" and Bill's shit on top of that. She was one of the single most self-handicapped candidates ever, so jaded that a clownish fat disgusting uneducated businessman with zero political experience could win. Now if Bernie would have been the democratic candidate...

[andrewjoy]

For an asshole like trump to win the biggest job in the world via an election shows you how absolutely terrible his opponent was...

That unfortunately is true, Clinton ran her campaign like a conceited winner from the beginning. But that's not what killed it for her, rather all the political "skeletons in her closet" and Bill's shit on top of that. She was one of the single most self-handicapped candidates ever, so jaded that a clownish fat disgusting uneducated businessman with zero political experience could win. Now if Bernie would have been the democratic candidate...

I said this , i said that in the old thread and it was implied i was sexist beacuse i did not think she was good , sanders would have been far far better, i said that from the start.

[chuckdee]

This thread is salty as fuck now

Yeah



And I'd talked about the quality of the conversation just a couple of pages ago.

[jacobolus]

All the “left bla bla bla” is nonsense, pure distraction from any real problems. The cancer in our society is the intransigence of the “Tea Party” led GOP, who have a heap of conservative groups with ideological purity litmus tests (Koch Brothers on climate change, NRA on gun background checks, Grover Norquist’s tax pledge, etc. etc.) they must pass or be primaried out, which means they can’t do absolutely anything productive for fear of losing their jobs. The last three Congresses are quite literally the least productive in modern history. They’ve tried to block the basic functioning of the government at every turn.

Obama has tried indefatigably to push for legislation to relieve people’s economic troubles. He wanted massive infrastructure spending and more money to help out struggling state governments, a single-payer healthcare system (or at least a public option), deals to reduce prescription drug prices, university debt relief, stricter financial regulations, restoration of workers’ rights stripped by previous administrations, campaign finance reform, etc., and in general a shift of the tax burden from the middle class to the super wealthy by raising top marginal tax rates, closing tax loopholes, etc. (through changes in the tax code previous GOP administrations, especially the Reagan administration, “redistributed” a massive amount of money from the working and middle class to the wealthy).

All the hand-wringing and finger-pointing about whether the center-left, or the hard-left (doesn’t really exist in the US), or the green party spoilers, or Obama, or Hillary Clinton, or the DNC, or the blue dog Democrats, or the congressional black caucus, or left-leaning opinion writers, or university professors, or ..... did too much to alienate people, blah blah blah, is disingenuous horseshit. The people who are seriously pushing such a line know better, and should be ashamed. In discussions like this one (e.g. andrewjoy’s comments here), it’s mostly just a canned argument heard elsewhere being repeated without much critical thought in between. That’s too bad, but I forgive you. Especially since as a foreigner you can’t be expected to pay attention over the years to details of American politics.

“Oh you leftists keep working tirelessly with your heads down to make my country’s economy, political system, and basic life not suck, but some of you sigh and roll your eyes when you take breaks to read the ridiculous newspaper headlines. I had better vote for Mr. Pussy Grab on his golden throne instead.” Okay then.

In any event, we’ve now all read the same nearly identical argument several times, and it was a lame argument the first time, we don’t need to read it over and over again.

[seebart]

The people who are seriously pushing such a line know better, and should be ashamed. In discussions like this one (e.g. andrewjoy’s comments here), it’s mostly just a canned argument heard elsewhere being repeated without much critical thought in between.

NO ONE needs to be ashamed here or "pushing" any argument! Possibly you should for suggesting so...live with it that you now got a clownish fat disgusting uneducated businessman with zero political experience for president. Of course you could "argue" another 95890234534905683495902 lines but if you have a 3-month-old baby to feed you might want to prioritize...

[jacobolus]

Again, andrewjoy is just repeating a tired argument heard all over the place, and he hasn’t thought much about whose interests it serves or how and why it was constructed.

I don’t think he should be ashamed – as I said, my ire is primarily directed at folks (e.g. professional pundits and the people paying them) who know better. I just think he should give it up, because it’s boring.

There’s no content to it. No direct factual evidence, no chain of reasoning, no proposed solutions to anything, ... it’s just lame whining.