New Macbook Pro with Touch Bar

[axtran]

Haha I'm at a conference right now and Office 365 via Google Chrome is sufficient for my use. Still hate it heaps too.


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[face]

Who the hell wants to use office 365 ? Whats wrong with the combination of libreoffice and google docs.

I don't. I actually prefer TeX. But the phd stud I am working for wants me to use a Word template they set up for that corporate identity stuff. They are using some special setting e.g. concerning the quotation behaviour and style (we use something like [QUDA, S.9] rather than the usual number stuff). I wasn't even able to get this to work with Word on Mac, so I won't even try it on Linux.

So yes, there are reasons where you HAVE to use it. Unfortunately. Same applies to photo scanners and stuff (photography is my other hobby and I have analog cameras).

I could of course use a virtual machine. But since nothing of the stuff I want to use (iCloud photo sync, CAD programms...) works on Linux and has to be done in a vm, I can rather use Windows without vm.

[Findecanor]

I wish there was more, interesting competition for it like in the old days, when WordPerfect was available. OpenOffice/Libreoffice are just aping off an older version of Microsoft Word. The only real competitor I can see is Google Docs and that's because it is on the web.
I much prefer writing documents in a more structured way like how it is done in LaTeX or FrameMaker. The UI in MS Word (I won't call it "Word" because that is not the proper name for it) encourages unstructured formatting.

Whatever happened to Apple's word processor Pages? Is it still around? Does anyone use it?

[andrewjoy]

Its still around and its still shit.

[chuckdee]

Who the hell wants to use office 365 ? Whats wrong with the combination of libreoffice and google docs.

There is a reason you should not transfer documents in a format like .doc .docx .pages .odf or whatever, you don't know how they will look on another computer, the plague of muppets who transfer word processing files around is so annoying , i mean would you send somone a photo in photoshop format , or send a normal user the sorce code for there app and say good luck ?

No you would not , so why do people do it with documents ? If somone asks for .doc or .docx i ether ignore them and send a pdf or simply refuse to send it .

There is something called pdf, this is what its for .

Maybe that's an option for you, but for many of us, it's not. Story submission is in docx for many publishing companies. My company has standardized on O365. Editing a PDF is fraught with problems, on the other side. And I used both - our company was originally on the google platform, and I tried libreoffice at home. I found both lacking in comparison to the Office offerings.

[face]

Nah, not completely shit. It's like every Apple program: ok for occasional use, not intended for professional usage.

I did my CV in Pages and I regularily write letters with it. You could do that on every word-processing application of course. Yet it is comfy for arty things (like a special birthday card for my girlfriend where I collaged pictures of the location I wanted to travel to with her). It's generally speaking comfy for everything you want to do quick and without hazzle.

Reminds me of "damn it" I have to do my CV in Word now. Uah...

[Rimrul]

The experience of Windows is like Stockholm syndrome. If you’re coming to it fresh, nothing makes sense and the whole thing is and endless frustration. Nothing quite works the way it logically should. The rough ideas seem to be there, but the every detail of the implementation is somewhere between ill-fitting and completely broken. It’s like it was designed by a team of thousands of autistic sadists who all hated each-other.

After decades of bad experiences you just learn to live with it. But like any battered spouse, you’d be better off if you ran away and never looked back.

To me it's that way with OS X. It feels like someone tried to make a nice linux, but got most details somehow wrong. I'd say it's a bit like a film set of a town. Most houses are just fassades and even those that are a little more have doors that are just painted on the walls or lead nowhere. In a bathroom or kitchen you might even find nice porcelain, but don't ask for plumbing.

[chuckdee]

The experience of Windows is like Stockholm syndrome. If you’re coming to it fresh, nothing makes sense and the whole thing is and endless frustration. Nothing quite works the way it logically should. The rough ideas seem to be there, but the every detail of the implementation is somewhere between ill-fitting and completely broken. It’s like it was designed by a team of thousands of autistic sadists who all hated each-other.

After decades of bad experiences you just learn to live with it. But like any battered spouse, you’d be better off if you ran away and never looked back.

To me it's that way with OS X. It feels like someone tried to make a nice linux, but got most details somehow wrong. I'd say it's a bit like a film set of a town. Most houses are just fassades and even those that are a little more have doors that are just painted on the walls or lead nowhere. In a bathroom or kitchen you might even find nice porcelain, but don't ask for plumbing.

That's exactly the way I felt in OSX. And the worse part was the fact that every time I found a way around my frustrations, they'd patch them out of existence.

[vivalarevolución]

The experience of Windows is like Stockholm syndrome. If you’re coming to it fresh, nothing makes sense and the whole thing is and endless frustration. Nothing quite works the way it logically should. The rough ideas seem to be there, but the every detail of the implementation is somewhere between ill-fitting and completely broken. It’s like it was designed by a team of thousands of autistic sadists who all hated each-other.

After decades of bad experiences you just learn to live with it. But like any battered spouse, you’d be better off if you ran away and never looked back.

To me it's that way with OS X. It feels like someone tried to make a nice linux, but got most details somehow wrong. I'd say it's a bit like a film set of a town. Most houses are just fassades and even those that are a little more have doors that are just painted on the walls or lead nowhere. In a bathroom or kitchen you might even find nice porcelain, but don't ask for plumbing.

Isn't Mac OS basically a nice BSD (albeit heavily modified)?

Mac OS lost me when they started integrating more element of iOS into Mac OS. I know the big tech companies like to have a consistent, integrated ecosystem, and most consumers don't care, but the desktop is losing in this trend to integrate desktops with mobile devices. We've lamented about this trend before.

[andrewjoy]

I will give apple one thing , there are more "mobile" apps in windows than in OSX , sure you can never use them but they are there .

The settings menu is a big one , 1/2 of it is in stupid touch screen o' vision and 1/2 is in old control panel , useless.

Then again in OSX you cannot even change the volume for each application on its own , all or nothing.

[axtran]

I feel like we keep going back and forth on hating macOS more than we hate on the MacBook Pro. What are we trying to hate on in this thread? Let's be consistent! [FACE WITH TEARS OF JOY]

That being said, I still love macOS so, so much. I just don't like the pricing and the design details of the MacBook Pro.


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[vivalarevolución]

I feel like we keep going back and forth on hating macOS more than we hate on the MacBook Pro. What are we trying to hate on in this thread? Let's be consistent! [FACE WITH TEARS OF JOY]

That being said, I still love macOS so, so much. I just don't like the pricing and the design details of the MacBook Pro.


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Haters gonna hate, bro.

We hate Apple because they are so successful. We jelly.

[chuckdee]

I don't hate Apple or MacOS. It is a tool like any other, and the time I spent in it- both old school and the newer stuff- was nice. Just not for me, and I chose to go back to windows and a windows machine because it was best for me.

[matt3o]

honestly if windows had a decent terminal I wouldn't have problems using it. they say the latest version added some linux flavor (much like wine for linux). I got to try that.

[axtran]

honestly if windows had a decent terminal I wouldn't have problems using it. they say the latest version added some linux flavor (much like wine for linux). I got to try that.

I installed it recently on a desktop! It is Ubuntu that can interface with the w32 kernel. It's rather great!


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[matt3o]

you mean that it's 32bit only?

[ohaimark]

honestly if windows had a decent terminal I wouldn't have problems using it. they say the latest version added some linux flavor (much like wine for linux). I got to try that.

I've heard from several Linux users that it's fairly well integrated.

[andrewjoy]

Haters gonna hate, bro.

We hate Apple because they are so successful. We jelly.

I don't hate apple at all , its beacuse i like macs and macos that i get so pissed off at the crap they have been up to recently.

If i hated them i would ether not care , or laugh.

[Stabilized]

Haters gonna hate, bro.

We hate Apple because they are so successful. We jelly.

I don't hate apple at all , its beacuse i like macs and macos that i get so pissed off at the crap they have been up to recently.

If i hated them i would ether not care , or laugh.

I totally agree: for me it's come to the end of what I am bearing to stand in terms of hardware and pricing from Apple, which is such a shame as I have been a Mac OS X fanboy for some years now.
BTW does anyone know about the rumour that Apple is planning to move away from its BSD base in future macOS softwares? I heard it from my Dad while chatting and forgot to ask for a reference.

[matt3o]

I heard a rumor about that few months ago, but I'm pretty sure it's just a rumor.

[chuckdee]

honestly if windows had a decent terminal I wouldn't have problems using it. they say the latest version added some linux flavor (much like wine for linux). I got to try that.

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/commandline/wsl/about

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/comman ... tall_guide

https://github.com/Microsoft/BashOnWindows

[alh84001]

And even before that, there was cygwin. And powershell, but that's a wholly different story.

[matt3o]

And even before that, there was cygwin. And powershell, but that's a wholly different story.

I tried powershell and it's a joke. cygwin is an option but it also has its fair share of issues. the best you can do is to install linux on a VM and work from there

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/commandline/wsl/about

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/comman ... tall_guide

https://github.com/Microsoft/BashOnWindows

I'll check that out, thanks.

there's also the new privacy (or lack of) policy of win 10 to take into consideration, but that is another story.

[alh84001]

I tried powershell and it's a joke. cygwin is an option but it also has its fair share of issues. the best you can do is to install linux on a VM and work from there

Powershell can be pretty, well, powerful, but the issue is that we are not looking just for powerful shells. Instead we are looking for a full POSIX environment with bash/zsh and all the useful UNIX programs and utilities that are usually there. Cygwin has served me well in that capacity.

Shell in a virtual machine won't be the shell for the actual machine, and if you just need to have Linux, I think it's better to do vice-versa - install Linux/BSD on the machine and virtualise Windows for specific tasks.

[matt3o]

Instead we are looking for a full POSIX environment with bash/zsh and all the useful UNIX programs and utilities that are usually there.

totally agree.

Shell in a virtual machine won't be the shell for the actual machine, and if you just need to have Linux,

in my experience it's the closest you can get without any compatibility issues.

I think it's better to do vice-versa - install Linux/BSD on the machine and virtualise Windows for specific tasks.

Only reason for me to use Windows is to access software like rhino3d, video edition software or other very advanced and power hungry applications that only exist on windows and really don't work on a VM.

[matt3o]

I tried the ubuntu subsystem. It is really amazing, should be on by default but... also still buggy and lacks some features. Hope they keep developing it.

[chuckdee]

I tried the ubuntu subsystem. It is really amazing, should be on by default but... also still buggy and lacks some features. Hope they keep developing it.

Yeah... I thought the same, which is why I just gave you the links. It speaks for itself. It is still under development - one of the links is to the github for the issues. I suggest you report what you see. And the fact that it is sponsored by MSFT is pretty amazing. Extend and Extinguish? Maybe. But I don't think that's what this is...

[vivalarevolución]

What is this, why aren't we bashing Apple anymore

[matt3o]

they don't even have a right mouse button!

[vivalarevolución]

they don't even have a right mouse button!

Seriously, that probably is the number two reason people don't switch from Windows to Mac (number one reason being the price tag).