An interesting find: NIB IBM Model M blue Alps(?) Keyboard

[snuci]

A couple months back there was a likely counterfeit IBM computer and keyboard posted from an ebay listing, and that one was very obviously built from generic clone pieces.

I wanted to bid on that but for some reason, I was either not able to or got outbid. I don't parerticularly like clones but some are interesting. This one was as it had fake IBM labels. I also have several Apple II clones (such as the Basis 108 shown here). That's why I like this keyboard. They tried to make it look identical, if it is a clone.

[fohat]

Personally I don't collect any clones or "fakes"

I am somewhat indifferent to the status of "legitimacy" since my keyboards are tools that intended for actual use.

A pure ANSI keyboard with blue Alps in the "one true keyboard" configuration is pretty much the Holy Grail for many Alps lovers, in my opinion, but goofball key stems and pad printing are big minuses, unfortunately.

[neozhou]

Thank you so much, everyone.

Although I have tried to find out useful information from Japanese Yahoo, there is nothing about this Blue Alps "IBM" keyboard. As you may know this type of copy is only available on Asian market in the 1980s, so I'll keep eyes on this particular keyboard and contact some of my friends living in Taiwan and Hongkong.

PS. the new blue Alps switches are really good

[clickykeyboards]

Thinking about this a little bit more.

I think many people have equated the terms "IBM Enhanced Keyboard" with "IBM model M keyboard".

wiki/IBM_Enhanced_Keyboard

The IBM enhanced keyboard was a design change from the earlier 83-key keyboards used with the IBM-XT and the 84-key keyboards with the IBM-AT. The primary design features of enhanced keyboard layout are shown here.

"To accomplish this, IBM included separate cursor and screen control keys, making it easier for users to dedicate the numeric keypad and numeric input when working with number-intense applications. Plus, the keyboard can still be used for cursor and screen control when not in the num/lock mode.
IBM also increased the number of function keys from ten to twelve, arranged across the top of the keyboard. This gives users two additional keys for increased automatic operation".

IBM Enhanced Keyboard The Right Touch

the-right-touch.jpeg (249.77 KiB) Viewed 4072 times

source: (1986) "Hardware News: The Right Touch" In Read Only, A review of the IBM Personal Computer Family, Vol 3., No. 1.
http://www.clickeykeyboards.com/model-m-buyers-guide/

While the IBM model M keyboard is in the "IBM Enhanced Keyboard layout" with buckling-springs in almost all cases (*exception is 71G4644 with rubber domes)

The example of the original poster, may show that the IBM Enhanced Keyboard may have included early design options to use other key switch technologies in the same keyboard layout, such as the blue Alps keyswitches. The back label of the OP's keyboard is blank and does not indicate any label info that it is an IBM model M or any specific part number.

However, over time the buckling-spring design became the preferred design and evolved as the dominant standard for the keyboard that was bundled with the IBM PS/2 personal computer line. IBM model M keyboard had become the IBM enhanced keyboard that we are familiar with.

[Chyros]

That's an excellent point. I still think this is just a contracted job for Alps by IBM. The two have a well-known collaborative history together. It seems perfectly legit to me that Alps were contracted to produce these keyboards for IBM for the Asian market. I don't know how well the PS/2 did in Asia; if it did poorly, it might explain why we've seen so few.

[JP!]

That's an excellent point. I still think this is just a contracted job for Alps by IBM. The two have a well-known collaborative history together. It seems perfectly legit to me that Alps were contracted to produce these keyboards for IBM for the Asian market. I don't know how well the PS/2 did in Asia; if it did poorly, it might explain why we've seen so few.

You would think there would be some Alps logos printed on the pcb or something.

[Daniel Beardsmore]

You would think there would be some Alps logos printed on the pcb or something.

Whoever made this was pretty shady, as they left no trace. Even the random cheap keyboards usually have some kind of PCB model number, and Alps-made keyboards always had a 12KC or 56AAA (or similar) code even if there is no Alps branding (there are a few oddities with the code but no branding, possibly from Gold Star Alps).

[FXT]

Would IBM have used pad printed legends?

[Menuhin]

Someone sent me a piece of dismantled corpse last year, and the PCB really had not much information to provide. Now I know the sender was truthful (that it was an "IBM" keyboard) and I have better clues about the corpse's true identity.

P.s. The point is, OP's is not the only IBM blue alps instance. There are more, at least one more here:

Spoiler:

[Polecat]

That's an excellent point. I still think this is just a contracted job for Alps by IBM. The two have a well-known collaborative history together. It seems perfectly legit to me that Alps were contracted to produce these keyboards for IBM for the Asian market. I don't know how well the PS/2 did in Asia; if it did poorly, it might explain why we've seen so few.

The box says "Personal Computer XT Model 286", and if I remember correctly that was not a PS/2 model. I believe it was a 286 motherboard in an XT form factor and case, like many/most clone boards available at the time. That's why the recent ebay "fake" IBM came to mind, although it's probably not related. There were several PS/2 models - Model 25, 30, and so on, with a proprietary all-in-one case and monitor, 3.5 inch floppy drives, and of course a keyboard with the smaller PS/2 connector (6 pin mini DIN). This keyboard almost certainly did not come with a PS/2 model; it would be a bit earlier than that.

[Polecat]

The box says "Personal Computer XT Model 286", and if I remember correctly that was not a PS/2 model. I believe it was a 286 motherboard in an XT form factor and case, like many/most clone boards available at the time. That's why the recent ebay "fake" IBM came to mind, although it's probably not related. There were several PS/2 models - Model 25, 30, and so on, with a proprietary all-in-one case and monitor, 3.5 inch floppy drives, and of course a keyboard with the smaller PS/2 connector (6 pin mini DIN). This keyboard almost certainly did not come with a PS/2 model; it would be a bit earlier than that.

XT Model 286 photo gallery (no keyboard pictured):

http://www.supervinx.com/OnlineMuseum/IBM/5162/02/

Wikipedia says this was called a Model 5162, but no specific info on its keyboard(s).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Personal_Computer_XT

They do mention a 101 keyboard for the XT (not the XT 286), "...essentially the IBM Model M, but in a modified variant that used the XT's keyboard protocol and lacked LEDs..." A different version, or at least a switchable or rejumperable one, would have been needed for the XT 286 model, assuming it spoke AT protocol.

[Starfoxes]

It has got Korean components on the PCB, and in the 80's, Korean electronics were of very bad quality. This speaks volumes towards it being a "fake" keyboard.

[Mr.Nobody]

When this item was listed, I contacted the seller and asked him to show more detailed pictures of the switches, he didn't respond, and before long the item was sold. Glad to know the board went to you eventually, and I am confident to say, in this case, the "fake" is going to be even more valuable than the original.

[E3E]

I can verify that the caps used on this keyboard are the same make as the Tai Hao FAME TH-5539-9 keyboard, which is styled after the model M.

Having owned a blue Alps M clone and this FAME, I was able to directly compare at one point. Sorry for the lack of pictures; I am often too lazy to chronicle my finds and thoughts on keyboard stuff these days. I really should change that.

[daedalus]

That's an excellent point. I still think this is just a contracted job for Alps by IBM. The two have a well-known collaborative history together. It seems perfectly legit to me that Alps were contracted to produce these keyboards for IBM for the Asian market. I don't know how well the PS/2 did in Asia; if it did poorly, it might explain why we've seen so few.

The PS/55 from IBM Japan was the counterpart to the PS/2 in the far eastern markets, the keyboards of which were produced by Alps, but were of a different design. The Multistation 5556 was IBM's offering from the PC/XT/AT era, which was yet another different design with an Alps keyboard. Keep in mind that the oldschool IBM machines did not support anything other than the latin alphabet, which meant they weren't super-useful for the Asian market.

[Pumaeggs]

Probably indeed a clone, but the only thing that niggles me is that it's too good. Is the case the same as original IBM or different? Any molding differences? If they're the same, it might be a refurbishment issue, maybe drop-in replacements. That would explain the different dates. Like, a school makes a deal with IBM in 1986 for a number of keyboards with 10 years refurbishments, the same part numbers. Then IBM sells to Lexmark. Then keyboards break in the school and they want the contract fulfilled. And IBM does, but uses a cheaper supplier instead of Lexmark.

holy shit this makes so much sense! this would also explain the model numbers being wrong too. in the other thread, one of the things that pointed towards it being a fake was that the model number was already in use by a standard model M.

[flowerlandfilms]

1. Alps might be big, but IBM was bigger, if they demanded a board with no Alps markings, they could get it.
2. Big Blue with Alps Blues is awesome.
3. If cloning an IBM product makes it "Fake" or "Not Real" then no one in existence today owns a real computer or keyboard.