What choices are there for printed black keycaps for the model M are there?

[daemonspudguy]

Are there any choices left, or do you just have to get lucky with an ebay search?

[Seirin-Blu]

You’ll either have to get lucky on eBay or made them yourself.

M13’s have them but the legend will wear off.

You could buy a black blank keycap set from Unicomp and then then paint on legends.

You could also buy some blank white ones, get stickers, apply said stickers and spray the caps black, remove stickers and then clear coat over them.

Either way it’s gonna require time or digging through the internet. Good luck.

[daemonspudguy]

It really is a shame that Unicomp stopped printing black keys, as when it comes to painting my skills are non-existent

[Seirin-Blu]

I mean honestly I’d get a fully set of blank white and some small enough stickers you like the font of and then spend some time aligning them and spray paint the keys black with the sticker still on. You may have to sand beforehand to get the paint to stick well, but I think this should work pretty well.

[Muirium]

Meant to stop at black, but found it was too fun.

Spoiler:

As an ABS melter of some renown, and a PBT shiner too, I would never paint caps I had any expectation of using in earnest. Might as well cut the middleman and just dob it straight on my hands. At least the caps wouldn’t get wrecked that way.

[daemonspudguy]

Meant to stop at black, but found it was too fun.

Spoiler:

As an ABS melter of some renown, and a PBT shiner too, I would never paint caps I had any expectation of using in earnest. Might as well cut the middleman and just dob it straight on my hands. At least the caps wouldn’t get wrecked that way.

That's why I won't do it. I care too much about my Unicomp Ultra Classic keyboard to think about painting keys. It's been my main keyboard since I got it and is a limited edition dual tone white-and-grey keycaps model from when Unicomp launched their Amazon store.

[Seirin-Blu]

TBH this would actually be a pretty fun project to take on. I don't own any of the newer black Unicomp model M's but if someone were willing to buy the caps, I'd be willing to put in the hours to sand, sticker, paint, and clear coat them.

[SunshineRag_DT]

Or you could go crazy and do this...
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=26455&p=494877

[daemonspudguy]

Or you could go crazy and do this...
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=26455&p=494877

I don't know where you got the keys to do that.

[wobbled]

The only boards that came with them are the M13 & an early 2000s Unicomp Model M.
Other than that you can either buy Dark Grey printed keycaps from ModelFkeyboards.com or ask unicomp if they have any black keycaps left (likely will not have a black right shift so you'd have to dye it yourself with iDyePoly and it wont be printed)

I don't know if Unicomp ever actually printed any black keycaps or if they just made use of all the spares they got from IBM / Lexmark

[SunshineRag_DT]

I don't know where you got the keys to do that.

I had planned to do a write-up on that. I might try to post something in the next week. Hint there are a couple of vintage rubber dome boards that exactly match the Model M profile. And if you hollow out the stems from the 1U caps they also exactly fit on over the 2 piece buttons. And it is a pain in the behind. Although I did the modifiers I would use the blue modifier set next time as it was really not worth the work.

[daemonspudguy]

The only boards that came with them are the M13 & an early 2000s Unicomp Model M.
Other than that you can either buy Dark Grey printed keycaps from ModelFkeyboards.com or ask unicomp if they have any black keycaps left (likely will not have a black right shift so you'd have to dye it yourself with iDyePoly and it wont be printed)

I don't know if Unicomp ever actually printed any black keycaps or if they just made use of all the spares they got from IBM / Lexmark

I did ask Unicomp if they had any left, they said they didn't

[Seirin-Blu]

I think when I get some extra money I’m gonna make my own set of black ones using the process I’ve described and then sell them to whoever inevitably wants them. It’s so bizarre that unicomp seems to love its black cases but not make black printed caps.

[daemonspudguy]

I think when I get some extra money I’m gonna make my own set of black ones using the process I’ve described and then sell them to whoever inevitably wants them. It’s so bizarre that unicomp seems to love its black cases but not make black printed caps.

I might be that person.

[Crizender]

It’s so bizarre that unicomp seems to love its black cases but not make black printed caps.

From my understanding, they would have to outsource it as they most consistent way of doing it for IBM WoB caps was pad-printing, which unicomp does not have on site.

It's a shame they did stop, but obviously they weighed the cost vs demand for it and decided it wasn't worth it anymore.

If you do go the custom route, you could do the same thing done here: viewtopic.php?t=26455 - edit, just realised sunshine already linked this

[LambdaCore]

I've sought them out, I even found a lead from a Mercari listing of a blue badge M with black keycaps. I made a thread about it on here actually. Never did find them, but they were likely from a rubber dome or dome with slider board using a similar two piece keycap design, looks like pad printing as you can see in the listing the letters were already wearing off.

[SunshineRag_DT]

I've sought them out, I even found a lead from a Mercari listing of a blue badge M with black keycaps. I made a thread about it on here actually. Never did find them, but they were likely from a rubber dome or dome with slider board using a similar two piece keycap design, looks like pad printing as you can see in the listing the letters were already wearing off.

LambdaCore, FYI that Mercari seller was me. That was the prototype set testing the process for my Mini M that was referenced above. And yes the caps are from a curved backplane rubber dome cap glued over the bottom of a 2 piece button. Several keyboards *perfectly* match the Model M profile for 1U caps and once you remove the stem they are exactly like a button cover but someone noted you have to glue them on. Coring out the stems was not an easy task and I have really found no good way to do the stablized keys (as of course they would not fit over a stabilized Model M key), requires alot of trial an error fitting.

I don't think doing the modifiers were worth it (and you only have 1.25U bottom row, not 1.5U that unicomp uses) and would just use the Blue modifer set from Unicomp next time. And there is possible key destruction getting the stems outs, odds are you will need 2 boards. The thin ABS plastic doesnt take well to high speed cutting (melting, accidently cutting through, pressure marks) and very likely you might trash a cap or two. I got kinda good at it but there was a learning curve.

My intent was just that I realized it could be done and wanted to try making some for my Mini M. Can't say it was good idea, just another interesting project. I wanted to see if it would work but if you value your time as money it makes no sense, too much effort.

[timw4mail]

I guess double-shot keys would be the only good solution...if there were double-shot Model M keys.

[fohat]

A not-perfect solution is to dye regular caps either dark gray or black. The dye doesn't go all the way and the legends are still barely visible in good light, but at a glance it looks decent.

Post #14 in this thread is informative:

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35 ... #msg664178

[thefarside]

Ellipse had an interest check form for pad printed black caps. Not sure which post it was but you might be able to search for it.

[JCMax]

What about doing a reverse dye sub job? Start with a blank white key-cap and then dye the area around the legend black? I've heard of it being done before but have never seen any on the market, let alone anybody who makes them. I hear it's more complicated tooling wise and for that reason is beyond what most hobbyists can do.

[Muirium]

Reverse dyesub is real. And has real shortcomings.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=26842

[JCMax]

Reverse dyesub is real. And has real shortcomings.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=26842

Thanks for clearing that up.

I think when I get some extra money I’m gonna make my own set of black ones using the process I’ve described and then sell them to whoever inevitably wants them. It’s so bizarre that unicomp seems to love its black cases but not make black printed caps.

Yeah, Unicomp are good but they make certain decisions that are perplexing. If you do sell those I might sign up for a set. Has anyone also thought about trying water decals for the legends? How would they hold up?

[Ellipse]

Yes I am looking into pad printing keys. One factory is looking into this for me as they still make the old pad print type tooling for keyboards. Please do sign the interest form if interested: viewtopic.php?p=498535

[Seirin-Blu]

Would spray painted and then clear coated not hold up better than pad printed? I'm all for someone manufacturing more options, but I feel like pad printed ain't gonna last a super long time.

[SK-8K]

PBT doubleshots for Cherry switches are a thing now. Could we (possibly partnered with a keyboard vendor) commission new molds for doubleshot buckling spring keycaps? It seems like a new keycap profile is made every year anyway.

Crazy idea, but I thought Tai-Hao Cubic in Alps-mount was crazy too and it's actually happening now.

[Muirium]

The thing to bear in mind is that in buckling spring, the cap is itself a moving component of the switch. You aren’t just adding something on top of the mechanism. You are adding an integral part of the mechanism. So the plastic will really matter.

Also bear in mind that two-piece caps will need to be far too thin for double shot.

[Shorle]

Also bear in mind that two-piece caps will need to be far too thin for double shot.

I wouldn't generalize that, for most doubleshot keycaps the DS part is the top face that the legend is on. If we are open to increase the overall height of the switch (see SA or other vintage looking profiles) Doubleshot is an option ...
if designing new molds for keycaps is an option at all. For oldschool M and F I bellieve the market to be too small for this to be a viable option, even hyped up cherry keycaps are having trouble hitting MOQ and that's for existing molds.
That being said there is a madman 3D printing keycaps for F and M atm and it's looking great. So even if that is a slow process maybe it's posisble to rent out a 3D printing factory and create more than super small scale batches.

[Muirium]

For mixing with existing caps, you'd need to match that paper-thin top profile.

For more costly complete replacement keysets, sure, you've more room to manoeuvre. You're still dealing with a curved backplate, though, which puts the squeeze on taller caps.



Flat backplate Cherry can take extra tall caps like SA and Matteo's beamspring homage profile. Buckling spring's curve does not support unlimited extension like that. Though we have a far easier time with language kits due to all rows being interchangeable at least!

[SK-8K]

Single-piece doubleshot PBT seems like the way to go then, since PBT is what the original caps are made of.