Nothing about ergonomic (mechanical) keyboard ?

[appie747]

Nah, if an alien would land or Charles Manson would be released, the Datahand would appear the logical device and your habitual standard keyboard a freaky device. You are lost, Sir. I advise a Microsoft Natural keyboard. Your neighbors might approve of it. It is hardly ergonomic, but exactly aimed at the kinds of persons who want unergonomic keyboards labelled as ergonomic as long as they can wrap their head around it, and willing to pay for such a visual yet non-solution. There is a whole market out there for people who want an ergonomic keyboard but don't want an ergonomic keyboard.

Why do you advise a MS natural? I already made clear that I don't like the staggered keys! Not to mention the rubber dome switches.
I work at a school. If there was a TE keyboard in my classroom, a co-worker could operatie it, if they saw a datahand they wouldn't. Just a normal looking keyboard without the 19th century characteristics, you see? Also a plus: operating backspace with your thumb! Ik like that.
Having said that: the mighty Datahand rules! (I don't agree with TE that it is less ergonomic than their board, that's nonsense)

[appie747]

TrulyErgonomic seem to have a production model out of the factory!
http://www.trulyergonomic.com/gallery.html These pics look to be real, not rendered like the ones before...

[webwit]

I really don't know why people are so eager to give this guy money. He has been lying for over a year about the progress. First of all, he is a he, not a they. Why do people keep revering to TrulyErgonomic as "they"? All the reviews, names, addresses he made up. Hello? He fabricated these. He made up various production deadlines. He lied about quality problems when there was clearly no production started. More complete fabrications. Clearly he has no respect at all for his potential customers. Yet he throws a bone at the dogs, and the dogs forget all what has happened and joyfully follow again. What you do with these kind of people is, you don't give them your money.

[Input Nirvana]

Exactly what webwit said x2

[appie747]

I really don't know why people are so eager to give this guy money. He has been lying for over a year about the progress. First of all, he is a he, not a they. Why do people keep revering to TrulyErgonomic as "they"? All the reviews, names, addresses he made up. Hello? He fabricated these. He made up various production deadlines. He lied about quality problems when there was clearly no production started. More complete fabrications. Clearly he has no respect at all for his potential customers. Yet he throws a bone at the dogs, and the dogs forget all what has happened and joyfully follow again. What you do with these kind of people is, you don't give them your money.

Dear Webwit,
You should read and try to understand my and other peoples comments here and on GH, there you can find the reasons. But that won't convince you because you mistrust the whole thing. But a last try: It's a great design!

[7bit]

I really don't know why people are so eager to give this guy money. He has been lying for over a year about the progress. First of all, he is a he, not a they. Why do people keep revering to TrulyErgonomic as "they"? All the reviews, names, addresses he made up. Hello? He fabricated these. He made up various production deadlines. He lied about quality problems when there was clearly no production started. More complete fabrications. Clearly he has no respect at all for his potential customers. Yet he throws a bone at the dogs, and the dogs forget all what has happened and joyfully follow again. What you do with these kind of people is, you don't give them your money.

Dear Webwit,
You should read and try to understand my and other peoples comments here and on GH, there you can find the reasons. But that won't convince you because you mistrust the whole thing. But a last try: It's a great design!

Dear appie747,
except that I find its layout retarded. It seems that pre-orders have to be paid initially and not when they really started production. If I where you, I would wait until these keyboards really show up and got reviewed. Those 'reviews' on his^wtheir page are more pre-views done by fortune tellers.

[webwit]

Dear appie, yes I mistrust him, he lied repeatedly and by design. Hello? Hello?? Are you some kind of idiot that you are actually picking the side of the scam artist? Really, I don't understand people. It probably explains the shitty companies and shitty politicians we have, thanks to the appies in this world who love the people who try to scam us.

Let's start here: he fabricated the reviews and obviously wrote them all.

Why on earth would anyone give such a guy money? You deserve to lose your money, and deserve to be scammed. This guy's empire deserves to go down violently and in flames. He is a lying cunt.

Maybe we should continue how he fabricated all his company info, including addresses that don't exist?

[7bit]

Dear appie, yes I mistrust him, he lied repeatedly and by design. Hello? Hello?? Are you some kind of idiot that you are actually picking the side of the scam artist? Really, I don't understand people. It probably explains the shitty companies and shitty politicians we have, thanks to the appies in this world who love the people who try to scam us.

Let's start here: he fabricated the reviews and obviously wrote them all.

Why on earth would anyone give such a guy money? You deserve to lose your money, and deserve to be scammed. This guy's empire deserves to go down violently and in flames. He is a lying cunt.

Maybe we should continue how he fabricated all his company info, including addresses that don't exist?

Why don't we ask him for a free of charge prototype, to write a real review?

[webwit]

Not me. He lied repeatedly, I give him the finger. It is as simple as that. Even if he brings them to market tomorrow, he can put them where the sun doesn't shine. It is called self-respect. I advise other people to try it.

The most hilarious part is that he has been obviously lying about fake production dates. Like I have predicted several times. Really, you can't order a production line in October with production ready in December. It doesn't work that way, it takes many more months, in preparation, in tooling, in construction and capacity planning of production lines, in transport. He lied. Since a couple of hundred keyboards don't travel by air, you need this time for transport alone. He repeated that lie several times. Then he finally comes up with some airbrushed photos of a single model, and people forget everything. There were no quality issues, he made it up, he never tried to get these into production. It's not like you order a product at some factory, they make a couple of hundred, and then together decide the quality is not satisfactory, and you end up with one prototype. A convenient lie, because people were asking for refunds, and he had to explain the delays. But people are still fast asleep.

[appie747]

Dear appie, yes I mistrust him, he lied repeatedly and by design. Hello? Hello?? Are you some kind of idiot that you are actually picking the side of the scam artist? Really, I don't understand people. It probably explains the shitty companies and shitty politicians we have, thanks to the appies in this world who love the people who try to scam us.

Let's start here: he fabricated the reviews and obviously wrote them all.

Why on earth would anyone give such a guy money? You deserve to lose your money, and deserve to be scammed. This guy's empire deserves to go down violently and in flames. He is a lying cunt.

Maybe we should continue how he fabricated all his company info, including addresses that don't exist?

Dear Webwit,
go ahead and mistrust everyone you want! I don't blame you. But some people have different opinions, how great is that? But don't call me a person who "loves people who try to scam us". I don't know where you get that idea. Now I'm also responsible for "shitty politicians and shitty companies". Wow, sorry folks!
To answer your question: I'm not an idiot. A question for you: could you be a bit more polite, and not call people names like that?
Albert

[webwit]

Well, I presented a load of arguments why this guy is not ok. You have zero arguments. You just say you trust him, and that I am someone who mistrusts everyone. So, to prevent people from thinking you are an idiot, could you provide us with two lists? 1. A list of arguments why the way this guy does business is actually ok, 2. A list of counterarguments to my list of arguments why the way he does business stinks.

For example, for the second list:

I say: his reviews are fake, so you can't trust this guy
You say: xxx

So far it has been:
I say: his reviews are fake, so you can't trust this guy
You say: Oooh but I think he can be trusted, you just hate EVERYBODY

That doesn't count.

[Brummell]

Until anyone is able to actually order and receive one of the shitty looking things, the point is rather moot anyway, isn't it? It's vaporware at best. It would be one thing if it were a company with a track record of honesty, but that doesn't appear to be the case.

[Brummell]

What are the designer's credentials in ergonomic design, anyway? Perhaps if the guy has impeccable credentials in ergo design that might mitigate the rest of the fraud to some small extent, but the site doesn't reveal much. If this is just some guy's personal ideas about what would be awesome, that's another thing entirely.

[appie747]

Well, I presented a load of arguments why this guy is not ok. You have zero arguments. You just say you trust him, and that I am someone who mistrusts everyone. So, to prevent people from thinking you are an idiot, could you provide us with two lists? 1. A list of arguments why the way this guy does business is actually ok, 2. A list of counterarguments to my list of arguments why the way he does business stinks.

For example, for the second list:

I say: his reviews are fake, so you can't trust this guy
You say: xxx

So far it has been:
I say: his reviews are fake, so you can't trust this guy
You say: Oooh but I think he can be trusted, you just hate EVERYBODY

That doesn't count.

Dear webwit,

Show me a post of mine here or on geekhack where I said: "I trust this guy".
Show me a post of mine here or on geekhack where I said: "Webwit hates everybody". What I said was: "webwit mistrusts the whole thing"

It was me who found his identity and adress somewhere on the web, I still have serious suspicions and reservations about this guy. I didn't pre-order. But If it checks out in the end I will probably become a customer.
I'm not a fan of the "reviews" section of the TE site, by the way. You are completely right about that.

Albert

[ripster]

Both my kid and I think the Truly Ergonomic is the nicest looking ergo keyboard out there.

[runeazn]

there needs to be multiple enter keys
and a any key

[7bit]

there needs to be multiple enter keys
and a any key

Right!

Also, those key caps in the middle are crap, because there exist no replacements in the repertoire of Signature Plastics!

[webwit]

I especially like the lack of Windows keys on the version above, I heard ripster hates the Windows key.

The Marquardt is one of the best looking "ergo" boards. I quoted ergo because it sucks. You know, like the far out of reach function and esc keys on the TrulyErgonomic, and all the modifiers on the pinkies. Visual style over function.

[JBert]

Well, I think they do gained a few points by taking some ideas of the µTron keyboard. The Esc key being out of reach is only a true annoyance if you use the key regularly like Vimmers do.
If the keyboard ever comes out, having the keys reprogrammable might be a saving feature.


DISCLAIMER: I didn't pre-order it. There's not enough info on where the money's going.

[hoggy]

I like the TEs legend placement - the letters on the right side of the board are on the left and vice versa.

[Findecanor]

TE was apparently not designed with other languages than English in mind ...
That disqualifies it for me.

[webwit]

Both my kid and I think the Truly Ergonomic is the nicest looking ergo keyboard out there.

There are some things very seriously wrong with this picture. I can tell from some of the pixels and from seeing quite a few shops in my time.

[nesiax]

Hi Guys, i am designing my own keyboard, an open community keyboard with ideas from posters of geekhack.org / deskthority.net / overclock.net websites.

i decided to call it the godlike keyboard, which this ideas in mind:

1. Open (Design, Specifications, Software)
2. Ergonomic
3. Compact
4. Reachable *
5. Software programmable

Right now i need to buy the keycaps for make this thing real, it seems that http://www.keycapsdirect.com/index.php keycapsdirect.com sell what i am needing but i will like to ear about more options, there should be keycaps compatible with cherry mx keyswitches.

For a protopype it seems that the cherry mx with pcb mount option is the way to go, digikey.com sell them by a minimum order of 250 pc, somebody know about a better option to buy this reference : MX1A-G1DW ?

For now i am going to build the PCB and attach the controller ( it will be a teensy++ 2.0 controller ) the case will be on wood at the begining, that will be the fast to get ready custom made keyboard for me.

Here there are some images of what i am going to build:





and the thread is located here:

http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?1643 ... post335326

[Findecanor]

I don't like the TE at all, from an ergonomic standpoint. Yes, the key layout for each hand is more natural than symmetric staggering, but only if the hands would be separated more from each other and slanted.
I think that the key layout used by TE (and the M-system, flat Maltron and the "Godlike keyboard" among others) invites the hand to be straighter against the keys than a symmetrically staggered keyboard would.
I think that the wrist angle on the TE is worse than on a symmetrically staggered straight board with equal hand separation.
Therefore, I think that the TE would lead actually to a higher risk of carpal tunnel syndrome and a higher risk of RSI in your forearms and shoulders.
I am comparing to symmetric staggering, because that is almost what a QWERTY keyboard is, if you type fast and don't touch-type, but only almost. The left hand uses the same fingers for W-Z, E-X etc.

Myself, I have finally decided on the layout for a split ergo keyboard that I am going to build. I am going to make it a middle-way between the M-system layout, the µTron and the Maltron. Slight curve and a slightly dished 3D-shape.

[daedalus]

But a last try: It's a great design!

Try what? It doesn't exist. It's a non-keyboard! There is nothing to try!

[Input Nirvana]

Hi Guys, i am designing my own keyboard, an open community keyboard with ideas from posters of geekhack.org / deskthority.net / overclock.net websites.

There are some very nice and well thought out features there, congrats! I like it so far
I saw your posting on GH as well.
I believe embedded layers are the way to go, without question.
Will this be 2 halves?

[Input Nirvana]

Myself, I have finally decided on the layout for a split ergo keyboard that I am going to build. I am going to make it a middle-way between the M-system layout, the µTron and the Maltron. Slight curve and a slightly dished 3D-shape.

Any renderings yet or---?

[nesiax]

There are some very nice and well thought out features there, congrats! I like it so far
I saw your posting on GH as well.
I believe embedded layers are the way to go, without question.
Will this be 2 halves?

Thanks for your answer it will be just one piece, i do support on site for some of my clients, since i changed to colemak this year i prefer to carry with my own keyboard.

So the layout is it, what do you put on every single key is up to you, i have some minor changes to the meaning of keys, the idea is to make a better use of the numeric keypad, so i will put on the center the following keys:

del - numlock
tab - enter

This way the numlock is better located for switching it on / off.

and change Fn on the left to be the Alt-Gr ( i am a spanish speaker, so i need some i18n characters)

So it is a three layer keyboard, colemak, colemak-i18n (AltGr), standard-extra-keys (Fn).

and put the backspace where the left thumb is, so the botton of the keyboard in my custom configuration will be:

backspace , alt-gr | | Fn , Space

Also i will swap the arrow keys with the home,end,page* , i borrow the first placement from the kinesis but i use a lot the arrow keys with the tab when programming so i will put them on the right.

[nesiax]

I decided to change the keyboard name to KEY64, and set up a new website for his develpment at http://www.key64.com/

You can use an open id to post comments on this website if you want to.

[Input Nirvana]

Very sweet!