Convince me to not buy the Filco Ninja Majestouch 2

Stalast

23 Mar 2013, 18:06

The Filco Ninja Majestouch 2 UK Layout - with Cherry MX Brown key switches.

So I'm looking to purchase my first Mechanical Keyboard. I've done a lot of research over the months (yes, months) and I think I've finally made a decision. I will be using the keyboard for typing quite fast (100+ WPM) and also FPS gaming, I don't need media keys or macro keys because my mouse can provide that. Does anyone have this keyboard and have anything negative to say about it?

Tell me even the slightest things you don't like about it. The only bad thing I've heard about it so far is that the stock keycaps can become shiny over time.

Pic of it:
Image

User avatar
huttala

23 Mar 2013, 18:12

Brown switches feels like broken red switches. Otherwise the keyboard itself is one of the best on the market. :)

User avatar
Peter

23 Mar 2013, 18:13

The only bad thing I've heard about it so far is that the stock keycaps can become shiny over time.
That happens to nearly all default key-caps that see any serious use..

There is no reason, other than price maybe, not to buy that board, it's an excellent choice,
not least because it is one of the few almost 100% Cherry-keycap compatible boards !

User avatar
kbdfr
The Tiproman

23 Mar 2013, 18:13

Stalast wrote:[…] Tell me even the slightest things you don't like about it. […]
It is black :lol:



Welcome to Deskthority and good luck with your first mechanical keyboard.
And then with your second one.
And then...
And finally with selling for just a fraction of what you had paid all that stuff you will have been hoarding over time :lol:

User avatar
Peter

23 Mar 2013, 18:22

btw :
Aren't the Filco Otaku caps POM or PBT ?
Those plastic-types tend to go blank at a much slower rate than ABS .

Stalast

23 Mar 2013, 18:29

kbdfr wrote:It is black :lol:

Welcome to Deskthority and good luck with your first mechanical keyboard.
And then with your second one.
And then...
And finally with selling for just a fraction of what you had paid all that stuff you will have been hoarding over time :lol:
Thanks for the warm welcome!

And thanks to everyone else for their replies! I think I'm going to order it.

User avatar
Peter

23 Mar 2013, 18:38

And finally with selling for just a fraction of what you had paid all that stuff you will have been hoarding over time :lol:
If you hoard the right stuff.. Your hobby can become almost 'self-sustainable' !
Except for the stuff that you can't get yourself to sell :)

User avatar
pheo

23 Mar 2013, 18:39

Hi! If you can afford it go for it. I just bought my first mechanical like 2 weeks ago, maybe 3, and it was a filco tkl withoud numpad but with blues instead of brown. And it is incredible. And the first thing I did was a test typing the one from 10fastfingers. And I went from 240-250 cpm from my usual rubberdome to 340-350 cpm, I dont remember wpm. Mechs really improves the fast of typing.Before buying it I didnt thought it would a big difference.
The quality of build is very good. It is really heavy for a tkl. I spent several months to review and learn about mechanical boards too. I thought mechanical boards extinguished on the 90s and it was a rediscover when recently I dont remember where I learnt that there was still a market of mechanical boards.
Sadly here in Spain there is only little offer. Just a few months ago I started to see on regular e-shops mechanical boards for gaming just with the only option of cherry mx black. And sadly for my wallet and my wife last week I bought new pure pro with reds and spanish layout, still expecting this to be shipped as it was a GB.
When I have more time of using it I will try to make a review.
And welcome.

User avatar
dirge

23 Mar 2013, 18:54

Stop now. Visit keyboardco get a topre in uk ISO. Just save yourself lots of hassle and get one.

Stalast

23 Mar 2013, 19:06

Peter wrote:btw :
Aren't the Filco Otaku caps POM or PBT ?
Those plastic-types tend to go blank at a much slower rate than ABS .
I tried searching and I think they are ABS plastic. So that's why people have been complaining about the shine. I still don't think it will be too much of an issue, unless of course another brand can provide the same great quality and layout and brown switches with POM or PBT caps at the same price, or less.
pheo wrote:And welcome.
Thanks for the info!
pheo wrote:Stop now. Visit keyboardco get a topre in uk ISO. Just save yourself lots of hassle and get one.
Uh, what hassle would I be saving?
The price of those topre keyboards are really only something I would consider if I had plenty of money to spend. I don't have plenty of money to spend.

User avatar
Jmneuv

23 Mar 2013, 19:12

cm storm and filco keyboards are almost identical and afaik from the same oem; keycaps you are going to want to replace after a couple of days anyway, so those are out of the equation;
I've yet to hear a solid rationale as to why the up to double price of filcos would be justified.

Stalast

23 Mar 2013, 19:42

Jmneuv wrote:cm storm and filco keyboards are almost identical and afaik from the same oem; keycaps you are going to want to replace after a couple of days anyway, so those are out of the equation;
I've yet to hear a solid rationale as to why the up to double price of filcos would be justified.
I just don't like the look of the full mechanical keyboards they have to offer. I like the look of their new unbranded QuickFire Rapid (TKL), as long as you change the keycaps. But I need the numpad, I use it all the time.

User avatar
tlt

23 Mar 2013, 20:30

The keycaps has a nice coating that feels really good under the fingers but it goes away pretty fast and leaves perfectly fine shiny surface. I don't think it's eider cheep or easy to get hold of better keycaps for ISO keyboards especially if you want the correct legends.

User avatar
Daniel Beardsmore

24 Mar 2013, 00:06

Why you should not buy it? MX Brown switches are incredibly light. I have no issue with their (admittedly very weak) tactility, but the lightness takes a lot of getting used to, and you might be in pain for a months while you get used to not slamming your hands into a board that only takes the gentlest of strokes. It's a very soft-touch board (as is MX blue and red) that can have a long acclimatisation period after years of using high force boards.

(After a few years of use I really enjoy MX brown now, but I was tempted to pack in the Filco for a Dell dome board just to get some feeling and resistance back.)
Stalast wrote:Uh, what hassle would I be saving?
While you're simply accepting cheap keyboards for what they are, you live with whatever you end up with.

Once you go down the path towards quality, you tend to find yourself becoming more critical. Since many people consider Topre to be the ultimate switch, they advise that you save yourself a lot of worrying, time and expense and jump straight to the keyboard that you will inevitably end up using.

If only it were that easy. Topre switches don't click. Topre has a new challenger: Matias switches — the Quiet Pro is significantly cheaper than a Realforce, and the switches are far more tactile than Cherry switches (and a much better force curve than MX clear). Unsilenced Topre switches have a nice, unique metallic pitter-patter sound that the silencing ruins, but if you're an aural junkie, you'll be pitting Topre up against plate-mounted Cherry MX (e.g. the Filco), PCB-mounted Cherry MX (my G80-3000 with clears has a fantastic metallic sound) and Alps and clones (especially when the Tactile Pro for PC comes out).

Topre is a great switch, but I've settled in with my Matias Quiet Pro faster than any other keyboard I've used. The layout is poor, but they're good switches once they break in. My only complaint is that it's far too quiet :-P Really it should be the Quiet Pro (damped), Tactile Pro (tactile), and Click Pro. I would go for the Tactile Pro, which would be the spiritual successor to the AT102W, but with far, far better switches than the dreadful black Alps.

helix

25 Mar 2013, 11:59

Stalast wrote:
Peter wrote:btw :
Aren't the Filco Otaku caps POM or PBT ?
Those plastic-types tend to go blank at a much slower rate than ABS .
I tried searching and I think they are ABS plastic. [...]
Hello! I own a standard Filco and a ninja Filco keyboard and noticed a difference in the keycap materials. I tried the water test of misterinterface ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4rE5OAGTKM ). Result: The keycaps of the standard filco keyboard float, the ninja keycaps sink. So, I assume that the ninja keycaps are not made of ABS.

I haven't been using the Filco ninja not long enough, but it seems that the keycaps don't get shiny as fast as the standard filco ABS keycaps. But that's very subjective.

User avatar
Muirium
µ

26 Mar 2013, 22:39

Daniel Beardsmore wrote:Once you go down the path towards quality, you tend to find yourself becoming more critical. Since many people consider Topre to be the ultimate switch, they advise that you save yourself a lot of worrying, time and expense and jump straight to the keyboard that you will inevitably end up using.

If only it were that easy. Topre switches don't click.
I'm still sitting on the fence before buying my first quality keyboard, too. Apparently not alone here! I share this sentiment exactly. I want to get something I've a fighting chance of loving for the long haul. And while I came here in search of MX-Blues, the more I've delved into the details, the more I'm liking the HHKB.

Unlike Stalast, for me less is most definitely more. The HHKB has really caught my eye with its thoughtful layout and mesmerising all-white style. Minimalism, stark and brutal! Yes, it costs twice the £100-£120 a Filco, Ducky, or even a KBT would for me here. But the caps are already just the way I want them. Blank and PBT. It's Mac compatible in a way the asymmetric modifier layouts of its competitors are not; seeing as I've a decade of key combos and scripting keystrokes already wired around Command and Option on either side of the space bar. Even the arrow keys, via function layer, look to make sense to me. Yes, I'm in self-salesman mode, evidently.

Just a pity it's not Bluetooth. (And the mod seems in hibernation.)

Right now, before I've the pennies to send one my direction, my last doubt oddly enough is Topre. The HHKB isn't silent, but its no buckling spring either. Is Topre enough tactility for my taste? And is the feel really as reassuring as a board of blues? Here's to hoping.

Time for the switch try bag, right?

User avatar
Jmneuv

26 Mar 2013, 23:59

Have you seen the GH60 group buy? It's coming in hhkb layout too. It's fully programmable and cheaper. MX switches though. You can have it community built if you're not into tinkering. Will require patience though.

User avatar
Muirium
µ

27 Mar 2013, 01:38

Jmneuv wrote:Have you seen the GH60 group buy? It's coming in hhkb layout too. It's fully programmable and cheaper. MX switches though. You can have it community built if you're not into tinkering. Will require patience though.
Sounds promising. Programmable you say? More investigations await…

Travellerr

06 Dec 2013, 19:32

Okay, I am glad I found this thread, as in I know that many mechanical keyboard user's newer and more experience can come to the same question of what keyboard to buy. I currently have two mechanical keyboards, the first being the cooler master xt with cherry mx brown switches, and the second being the cooler master rapid with cherry mx blue switches. I have enjoyed both of these keyboards, and as far as a clear favorite with switches is concerned I have no flipping idea. I know that I will be getting a topre switch keyboard. The tenkeyless mini Leopold, firstly because it is more affordable then the couple other keyboard I saw that have topre switches excluding the type heaven( which I would prefer pbt key caps with a tenkeyless design if I am dropping over 150 usd on any keyboard). I have read a lot about the Leopold, but I know longer have my cooler master xt with brown mechanical switches, because wife, who happens to talk constant stream of crap about my keyboard collecting hobby, used it and fell in love with it. So I am considering buying before and or after the leopold, because I really do a tenkeyless layout seeing as I do not use the number I think ever and the brown switches were the first type of switch I used as far a cherry mechanical keyboards go. Is the Filco really worth 60$ more than the cooler master rapid and or stealth, because I can currently get a Ficlo majestouch 2 ninja for 140 after shipping is added in. I can also, get a cooler master rapid or stealth for about 75-90 after shipping is added in with the same switch type that is...being in this case browns. I probably will wait on my final choice as far as picking the right tenkeyless layout as far as which brand to buy... they both use costars stabilizers, which I seem to like, and cm rapid does have a solid build quality at the price lvl especially. So, if anyone who is reading this thread has and or has used both a filco majestouch and a cooler master rapid or XT I would really appreciate some feedback. I am on the fence whether or not I will be buying a mechanical board with browns after receiving the leopold fc660c, but in a way I am leaning towards the Filco not really because I have doubts about the rapid stealth, but more as in to have a bit more of a variety. so please get back to me if you understand my issue.-travellerr

User avatar
Muirium
µ

06 Dec 2013, 23:19

Once you get a Topre switch keyboard, you might find everything changes. You wouldn't be the first to sell off the rest of his collection just to afford a Realforce or HHKB…

Travellerr

06 Dec 2013, 23:33

lol, no. Do not say things like this too me, actually I will be honest that is why I haven't gone to crazy about getting 6 cherry switch mechanical keyboards...because I knew I was going to be buying a topre switch keyboard. And granted, if I do not like the feel after a few weeks I will just man up and try to make some of my money back. It is also why I am not buying the Filco first on the list of what keyboard I want to buy. I think if I was to go to a another topre switch board after the leopold 660c it would probably be the Realforce tenkeyless with the 55g resistance, because I think it would feel nice with the more medium resistance, and my friend who has been helping me with feedback when it comes to keyboards. So, we will see I will be honest I hope that I like the keyboard that much, that I want to stick to topre type of keyboards...only because this is the only gift I am really allowing myself this xmas, other than maybe getting some spare key caps, which with some keys with the leopold is hard to do, but I think I would go with something simple like a red escape key a wasd cluster of red or green and maybe get a cloth braided cable in multi color for the usb connection. Or they have some really nice cloth hand woven filco minila usb to mini usb cables, which are nice and long. You know anywhere else that has nice braided usb to mini usb cables?

Travellerr

06 Dec 2013, 23:36

Oh, but if by chance I end up disliking the Leopold, and the topre switches all together then I will definitely be getting a Filco majestouch 2 with cherry brown mechanical switches, and I am going to drop money on some nice set of side printed pbt caps, a nice cloth sleeve to go over the cable, and some other little mods and what not because then it would be my daily driver... but thanks for response btw

User avatar
Muirium
µ

07 Dec 2013, 00:20

Paranoid does some wonderful cables. I can vouch for his stuff, it's top notch:
http://deskthority.net/post135465.html#p135465

Pexon's look quality too, and he makes them to order:
http://deskthority.net/marketplace-f11/ ... t4583.html

Travellerr

07 Dec 2013, 01:30

he said to someone else he no longer taking order's, do you know if he is still selling the ones he has? because I saw a couple I liked a lot. I have pexxon's page in my bookmarks, and have looked at his work before. He has some solid cables it seems so maybe I can go through him to get a new usb to mini cable for the leopold fc660c. Man I am so excited to get this board, and I am just worried I am going to log on my pc next wednesday to order this keyboard and it is going to say out of stock, no back ordering available...:-/ I hope that karma has my back this time around is all. Anyways if you don't mind me asking Mu what is your main keyboard from day to day?

User avatar
Compgeke

07 Dec 2013, 06:06

Or you can just save time and get a Model M! :D

Alright, you don't have to, a lot of people don't like how loud they are. They don't, however, loose their legends or get shiny and are fairly cheap.

Regarding the original question, I wouldn't worry too much about the shine. Unless you work in the middle of the street or you have some severe obsession with taking pictures of your keyboard I wouldn't worry too much about it. Most rubberdomes are just shine a lot quicker anyways and if you like the board keycaps aren't that much compared to what the board itself costs.

Travellerr

07 Dec 2013, 06:16

Yeah I actually am planning on getting an model m eventually, because it is the first mechanical keyboard that I had learned to type on, so I have been keeping an eye on the prices on ebay and few other sites that have them. I will definitely be getting one even if it isn't for me now since I am older than I was when I typed on it I am sure it will still be enjoyable, and the I type on blue primarily, yes I do prefer browns for playing games and few other things because the blues have helped me become more accurate. So, it is strange because of the slight difference in resistance between the brown mechanical switches and blue switches I swear when I go and type on the brown switches again I am much faster and more fluent than I was before. Imagine if I went to greens for a bit then went back to browns.

User avatar
vometia
irritant

13 Aug 2016, 15:27

Apologies for the grotesque thread necromancy, but a lot of stuff that's been going through my mind was discussed here and I figured I'd belatedly resume the discussion rather than retread old ground (which I'll probably end up doing anyway. :D )

After years of curiosity about the MX switches, not really satiated by getting one of those little key-testers, I've ended up with a Filco Majestouch 2 tenkeyless with MX Blues. I'm trying to qualify that with a reason, considering I've been happily using my Unicomp SSK for years. Erm... because I like keyboards is about the best I can come up with. Ultimately I'll probably go back to the Model M, but I fancied a change.

First impressions are that the Filco seems better made than the Unicomp: there's no flex at all and it's very heavy and solid. I'm not quite so convinced about the sound, though the gentler clicking is probably easier to live with than the CLUNKCLUNKCLUNK you get with buckling springs. Key feel... dunno, there's a bit of an apples and oranges thing going on they're: they're just different. I'm pleased that the blues are a little weightier than expected, I was a bit nervous about having a similar experience to "that Philips terminal" I used 25 years back with the real hair-trigger keys: dunno what switches it used, I suspect some sort of linear Cherry types possibly, but that is just a guess. Anyway, the Filco is nothing like that. Which is a huge relief.

Other nice things are that I'm not condemned to a world of beige, and it's nice that it's as small as it's possible to get while still having a regular, full-size layout, although I now realise I had a habit of resting my left hand on the surround of the SSK where it now just finds a pointy corner digging into it! But "less is more", especially as it'll involve less chance of my mouse colliding with the keyboard when I'm gaming, a bad habit I've never managed to get out of.

I'm ambivalent about the extra Windows keys: I thought by not having them I was missing out, but so far haven't found a use for them and they've just filled in the spaces I absent-mindedly used for hand-positioning. Maybe I'll figure out how to configure them as additional compose keys or something, so I can more easily produce, say, Greek characters. Not that I ever use Greek, but y'know, sometimes you just need to be able to do something because you can.

The only thing I dislike so far is the key-tops. Well, "dislike" is going a bit far, they just don't seem to be quite up to the quality of the rest of the keyboard, and for some reason I dislike having small legends squashed up in the corner. They're also printed rather than... well, anything that isn't printed, which seems oddly cheap and of questionable resilience. So I've ordered some of the Filco double-shots, as much as dark brown-on-black isn't necessarily the most aesthetic of combinations: they've had good reviews though (provided I don't get a duff set) and are apparently nicely heavy, a bit retro-looking, no bumpy legends and are, well, doubleshots. They should arrive on Monday: key-puller at the ready...

And what of the competition? Well everyone says that Topre is Teh Best™ and I may well put that to the test one day, but that day is not today. Besides, Topres don't click and I like clickiness. Going right back to the days of the early '80s home micro boom, I always preferred the clickier ones like the Acorns (actually I preferred the Electron over the BBC, even though everyone says the Electron is supposedly inferior; but then again I also found the Dragon's keyboard remarkably similar to the BBC's, in spite of everyone saying it was rubbish. I think it was probably the same "everyone" though. But I digress...) over the good but somewhat damped feeling of, say, the Commode 64. I think I found my natural home when I first encountered a Model M, rather curiously on a Dell Optiplex. Maybe I'm just anti-social. Maybe it's because I'm a bass player. I just seem to like loud.

And as far as I can tell, the Filco is as good an example of a Cherry MX as I'm likely to find. There are other examples out there which do fancier stuff, but as much as I kinda like the idea of rainbow backlighting I know I'd get bored of it after about 30 seconds of playing around with it. So Filco it is. The only potential downer is one it shares with the SSK which is that some applications insist on having a numeric keypad and life's too short to spend it doing key remapping, so maybe I'll just have to invest in an external keypad one day; I'm certainly not going back to the days of the LK201 and its descendants that took up my entire desk, though.

PS Oh, and though it's already quite obvious with my whittering about legends, I didn't get a ninja model: that would just be a nightmare. I've been regularly typing for 35 years but I find my touch typing is still too random to get on with something like that.

User avatar
czarek

13 Aug 2016, 15:48

Look at this:
20160729_111656.jpg
20160729_111656.jpg (637.6 KiB) Viewed 30888 times
The board costs around €80 brand new - it's Quickfire XT. Double shot keycaps from Tai Hao (times better than stock OEM, in looks, feels and durability) add around €25 to the price. So for the price of 105€ you have basically unbranded board with decent keycaps (you can choose from many colours available). It also has detachable USB cable and quite nice soft touch finish. Overall, at stock config it's about the same quality as Filco for almost half price. With upgraded keycaps it's much better board.

Oh and before you ask, I do own 3 Filcos, 2 Duckies, 2 CM Storms and 1 WASD Code so I have done some in-depth comparisons.

User avatar
zslane

13 Aug 2016, 18:18

When it comes to full-size MX-based boards, I feel Filcos are the best. I have three Majestouch-2s and they are fantastic. Since any reasonable person will replace stock keycaps with something much more aesthetically pleasing anyway, the particular weaknesses of the stock Filco caps are kind of irrelevant.

Now when it comes to switches, well, I think anyone who goes in for clicky switches is basically swimming in muck to begin with, so being burned by MX blues shouldn't be too surprising. If you love the click, chances are there is a very specific kind of click you are into, and it is rare that something else will satisfy. Good luck with that.

Somebody really needs to revive beam spring switches for modern keyboards. Paired up with Matt3o's beamspring revival keycaps, you'd have a real winning combination.

User avatar
czarek

13 Aug 2016, 18:46

Yep, Filco is better than CM, but not twice better (it costs twice as much), maybe 10% better, but that also depends on what you actually need. If you prefer detachable cable and some media keys (optional, you don't have to use them), CM might be better option. Remember those boards are almost the same. Made on the same production line, by the same people. PCBs are nearly identical, switches come from the same boxes, keycaps (the stock ones) are made using the same moulds, stabilisers are exactly the same (lubed in both cases). Even cases are in fact interchangable between them. There might be debatable difference in QC between the two, but if someone finds faults in their board, there is no problem returning it. You have 2 weeks to do so according to EU law.

Post Reply

Return to “Keyboards”