Identifying an IBM keyboard

[komodo]

Hi,

I've been using the database here and browsing the forums for a while, and I thought this could be the place to help me identify an IBM keyboard I bought the other day. I've never posted before, so I apologise if I've put this in the wrong place or there's a dedicated thread for identifying keyboards I've missed.

Its currently being shipped to me, but I have a couple of photos, the model number and the "birth date" to go on.

It has replaceable keycaps (a couple are missing), the model is 6110625, it was made on 16th of April 1984 and it is a 122-key terminal keyboard. It was made in the UK. I've looked around but can't find this model number in any of the keyboard databases, and was hoping someone could tell me a bit more about it, and whether I could make it work with Soarers Converter?

Here are the pictures.

View of keyboard with side view of connector

Front of Keyboard.JPG (313.7 KiB) Viewed 8018 times

Birth Certificate of keyboard

Rear of Keyboard.JPG (262.57 KiB) Viewed 8018 times

Thanks for any help.

[Muirium]

Looks like a Model F 122 key to me. The underside isn't beige plastic like the later, less sought after 122 key Model M. And the label down there looks more like my (Model F) XT's, which is another good sign.

I'm no expert on 122 key Model Fs. But it looks to me like you lucked into one! Well done. Very hard to find them in Europe.

[daedalus]

122-key Model F, UK 3270 layout.

[fohat]

Cool find. That is an early date.

The cable plug looks odd. If there is an additional metal piece screwed onto the main plug, I would be curious to see what it looks like by itself.

[andrewjoy]

you lucky man that is very nice.

I would be interested to see if it has dip switches on the back my 3270 did

a picture of the controller would be cool too to see if its the same revision as mine

[Muirium]

Oh yeah, your second question: it's very likely indeed to work with Soarer's Converter. And if not, then Xwhatsit's replacement controller board has you covered.

Being a Model F, it is full NKRO of course. So much better than Ms!

I've heard these are rare indeed to see on eBay here in Europe. Wherever did you find it?

[quantalume]

The cable plug looks odd. If there is an additional metal piece screwed onto the main plug, I would be curious to see what it looks like by itself.

That looks like the standard 240-degree, 5-pin DIN connector with a sleeve that screws into a connector like this:

5pinDIN.JPG (21.36 KiB) Viewed 7949 times

[andrewjoy]

it is but the outer sleeve is missing

[komodo]

Wow a model F! I am very happy!!! It was on an ebay auction, bought it and another similar one with beige bottom for £60 for the two including postage (I got two so I could have a full set of key caps and spread my bets on dead controllers). The beige one has no stickers so I thought it would be harder to identify, but someone earlier said beige ones are model Ms?

It should be arriving early next week, I can add more photos then. From the dirt on it I'm worried about the state of the internals, how easy is it to restore these? I've had a look around and can't find model F springs for example.

[quantalume]

These keyboards clean up quite nicely. Even if the plate under the key caps is very dirty and rusty, chances are the board still works just fine. If you need some extra springs, I'm sure someone around here will be happy to help (myself included).

Unfortunately, the controllers are not interchangeable between Models M and F as the switch technology is completely different. The caps, however, are. I think you got a great deal on the pair of them!

[Muirium]

Spare parts are harder, but you may find the F is in good shape. They're proper tough. Easier to take apart (no bolt mods to worry about having to do…) and the caps are compatible, so that M was a smart move!

As Quantal says: the controllers aren't compatible. But they hardly ever go wrong, and Xwhatsit's controller is the one you really want as it's USB native and programmable. Much like Soarer's converter.

[andrewjoy]

I do have a few spare hammers and barrels if you get stuck, they are XT barrels but if its just 1 or 2 just cut off the pin and it will work ok.

[komodo]

I figured the controllers weren't compatible, I thought they were the same model when I bought them!

Xwhatsits controller is better than Soarers is it? or are they much of a muchness? I know you can program soarers with macros and media keys which will be very useful in assigning the spare keys, and getting back a windows key.

Its amazing that a bit of technology celebrating its 30th Birthday can be made to work on a modern machine with a tiny chip.

Here are the photos of the second keyboard, which I'm pretty sure is a standard model M terminal

IBM Terminal

Front of Keyboard 2.JPG (324.27 KiB) Viewed 7882 times

Rear IBM Terminal

Rear of Keyboard 2.JPG (249.83 KiB) Viewed 7882 times

[andrewjoy]

Xwhatsits is a whole controller Soarers is a converter. I think that a whole replacement controller is a better solution where you can. You can assign anything you want to any key and lucky for you i have already done this so you can nab my config file. this assigns everything where it should be on a uk layout moves the arrows into an inverted T and uses the extra arrow at the bottom for windows key PF1 -PF24 are F1-F24 the normal navigation keys are where they should be and on the left are print screen scroll lock pause and escape and 6 unassigned keys.

Oh and the extra number pad key ( the one directly above enter) is a tab key all the cool kids have tab keys on there number pads, you will wonder how you lived without it.

Code: Select all

# Base Layer
0x68 0x69 0x6a 0x6b 0x6c 0x6d 0x6e 0x6f 0x70 0x71 0x72 0x73 0x49 0x4b 0x54 0x56
0x3a 0x3b 0x3c 0x3d 0x3e 0x3f 0x40 0x41 0x42 0x43 0x44 0x45 0x2a 0x4a 0x53 0x02
0x29 0x32 0x1e 0x1f 0x20 0x22 0x23 0x25 0x26 0x2d 0x2e 0x01 0x4d 0x4e 0x60 0x61
0x46 0x2b 0x14 0x1a 0x21 0x15 0x1c 0x24 0x27 0x13 0x2f 0x01 0x4c 0x5f 0x5e 0x57
0x47 0x48 0xd0 0x04 0x08 0x17 0x0a 0x18 0x12 0x33 0x35 0x30 0x52 0x5c 0x5d 0x2b
0xa8 0xab 0x64 0x16 0x07 0x09 0x0b 0x0d 0x0c 0x0f 0x34 0x28 0x51 0x4f 0x5a 0x5b
0xa9 0xac 0xe1 0x1d 0x1b 0x19 0x05 0x10 0x0e 0x38 0x01 0xe5 0x50 0x59 0x63 0x58
0xaa 0xad 0xe0 0xe2 0x06 0x2c 0x11 0xe6 0x36 0x37 0x01 0xe4 0xe3 0x02 0x62 0x00

[Laser]

Soarer also made a controller for some F models.

http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/soar ... t6767.html
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=50437.0
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=48950.0 <- Bigfoot support

[andrewjoy]

Cool i did not know that !

[Laser]

Yes
Hope to use it with my future Bigfoot from Cindy!

[quantalume]

I think even xwhatsit himself would recommend a Soarer's converter when the original controller is still good. Soarer's is certainly a lot less hassle to install as xwhatsit's controller requires that you desolder the original controller from the 30-position ribbon cable. Soarer's could even sit external to the keyboard, plugged into the end of the existing IBM cable. Muirium would be happy to post photos of how this is done.

[Laser]

Just to note that AFAIK Soarer's controller (not the converter) can also replace the original controller, or (as for the bigfoot) can act as the controller the board never had. That's my understanding from what i've read.

[Muirium]

@Komodo: Another vote for Soarer's converter, if you can. Xwhatsit's controller is several times the price (he makes a whole replacement PCB) and a lot trickier to install in a Model F; while both of them have essentially the same features, just implemented differently. They are both superb pieces of wizardry.

@Laser: Soarer's support for the Bigfoot is a good and sneaky hack, relying on that board's unusual lack of a fully onboard controller. I don't think it applies to more Model Fs than just that one. But then I thought it was impossible until I saw him prove it!

[andrewjoy]

Whatever conversion solution you chose you have yourself a beast of a keyboard there and the model m will make a nice keycap parts unit.

I always wonder if there was a time when they where developing the model M 101 layout if there was a dev unit deep down in the bowels of IBM with F internals but a model M layout. YOu can see where they got the ideas from looking at the terminal layout its kind of half way between an AT and a 101 layout.

[komodo]

So just to be clear, a soarers converter will work with this and allow remapping and macros?

I was originally going to try putting a raspberry Pi in it as a sort of backup "portable" machine for when I have to work from funny places, and a switch to go from normal keyboard to being a keyboard for the raspberry pi, but as it turns out to be the rarer F I dont think its such a good idea!

[POTV]

Perhaps this little ebay beauty could do the trick regarding conversion for the F-122:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Soarers-Con ... 3f3f4cbdd4

[komodo]

Bother, I wish I'd seen that sooner, when I thought I was getting a Model M I got a teensy 2.0 ++ (it seemed to be recommended for those wanting more macros and key remapping), and that adapter works out at about £5 with all the work already done. Being in the UK I don't really stray onto US ebay much, as shipping costs so much!

[andrewjoy]

It will work, the teensy is a bit expensive , i did my XT with a pro micro.

If you already have the teensy go with that.

[Muirium]

Is there really a Teensy inside that spindly cable, POTV?

@Komodo

Sure, there's reasonable space inside these 122s. You're unlikely to harm it, unless you go chopping new holes. (Don't!)

Here's a naked Soarer's controller, that's small enough to sneak inside the case quite easily:



Note: NOT a Teensy++ 2. A plain Teensy 2. You're wasting pins with a plus.

Then I built a box as I use so many board's with Soarer:



But first, let's see this cable of yours.

[komodo]

Ah, a teensy ++ is a waste then? I remember reading somewhere you might want to use the ++ if you're doing a lot of remapping.

@Muirium

Don't worry I'm not planning on putting any new holes in the case of an F!

Rightly or wrongly I would have been happy to add a small extra hole in an M to allow the USB of a raspberry pi to be accessible, but the F is safe from such tamperings.

[Muirium]

I wrote that before I saw you already have a ++. No worries then. You're right that the ++ has more wherewithal (RAM, flash? I don't remember…) to handle extensive mapping, as well as a bunch more pins which won't get used. But that box of mine above has several keyboards worth of layers, remaps and macros all stored on a simple plain Teensy. Doesn't seem to be a problem in practice. But if you're much more creative than me, then maybe!

[POTV]

@Muirium, I really don't know. I just saw it today. Fortunately Fohat has promised me to build a regular converter for my F-122's like yours. Hope he does'nt mind me saying this...

[quantalume]

Perhaps this little ebay beauty could do the trick regarding conversion for the F-122:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Soarers-Con ... 3f3f4cbdd4

Interesting! It's certainly possible to build a converter into a DIN shell. An Atmel 32U2 in a QFN package is only 5mm on a side, and there's not much additional circuitry needed. I see demand (and prices) for Model Fs rising.