Which key switch next?

[snarfarlarkus]

So I am just trying to find my most preferred switch for typing but I just can't as of yet. I have an IBM Model M 1390131 and a RealForce 87U 55G. I have tried cherry blues, reds, blacks and browns and out of all those switches, mx browns are my least favourite and the buckling springs are my favourite.

I was pretty underwhelmed with my topre tbh, coming from a Model M, the switches although are the 55g variation are plenty light and I am a heavy typist (always bottom out buckling springs and blacks). For some reason with the 55g topre, if I rest two of my thumbs on the spacebar which is flipped, it will register the key which means the switch is a bit too light but thats just the spacebar itself.

I am thinking of trying a Model F although I do not like the layout of them or some alps switches which I've yet to try. Any suggestions? Thank you so much!

[andrewjoy]

Go for the model F. If you can get an AT the layout is not so bad. Better if you can get a 122 they can be made very close to win-keyless ISO, 107 is close too without F keys.

If you find one with missing bits i have spare barrels and flippers and the likes to fix up a 122.

EDIT

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IBM-Model-F12 ... 463a3e1a1c

There you go , just need caps.

[jacobolus]

Can you tell us a bit more about what you like or dislike about the switches you’ve tried?

Other fun switches I’d recommend trying:
Alps (especially orange or blue, but white Alps are also pretty nice and are cheap and easy to find in good condition)
Matias (both quiet and clicky)
Clicky SMK (“monterey blue” Alps mount, or white MX mount)
Clicky black Hi-Tek “space invaders”
IBM beam spring (if you can find one)

In all cases, try to find the best condition switches you can; with used keyboards switches can be a crap shoot, but even the most wonderful switches are terrible to type one when in poor condition.

[seebart]

I was pretty underwhelmed with my topre tbh, coming from a Model M, the switches although are the 55g variation are plenty light and I am a heavy typist (always bottom out buckling springs and blacks).

This specifically suggests to me that IBM Model F may be something for you. Like Andrew said the AT is most tolerable in terms of layout. Have you tried Cherry MX greens?

[andrewjoy]

AT is tolerable

122/107 is THE layout for a large model F

[seebart]

Of course both are rather rarish to come by. 107 is alomst unobtanium. He may have more luck finding an AT.

[andrewjoy]

there are 2 107s on ebay right now , one is not assembled so if you want to try other layouts ( like unix layout) its spot on !

[seebart]

links Andrew, links. I wanna see. Gimme gimme.

[andrewjoy]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Original-IBM- ... 41960397e8

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/107-Key-IBM-M ... 463802af7c

There where 3 but you know there is not anymore , the guy is on the forms send them a PM.

[seebart]

Hmm nice...107 is such a battleship.

[andrewjoy]

nah , its long but its not as big or as high as a 122

[snarfarlarkus]

Woah, thanks for all the replies!

I spent $430 on my Model M. It is a late 1988 Model M 1390131 that was brand new in original box with no discoloration, stains or tears in the box. Immaculate condition but the price was definitely whopping. So I don't really want to spend too much on another keyboard as I just bought a topre a couple weeks ago. I also hear the early 1390131 Model Ms are crisper than the later 1390141 Model Ms but I do not know for sure.

I have a couple of questions regarding the Model F if you guys could please help me out???

1) How will they work with a modern PC with usb? I see they have a vga/dvi-looking connector?

2) I heard Model Fs are lighter than Model Ms due to the metal plate instead of the rubber sheet in the Model M? I don't really want a lighter switch as I am a heavy typist.

3) How does Model Fs feel against the Matias switches? I almost bought a Matias Clickly instead of the RF 87U 55G as it was cheaper and seemed highly praised like the Topre. I also kind of find the topre to feel tooooo similar to a nice rubber dome keyboard.

Cheers!

[ramnes]

That's kind of an elliptical price.

[andrewjoy]

the model F is a little bit lighter than the M but not that much in it, its more the tactile bump is more delicate , the force needed to bypass that is less but the total force is almost the same.

107 and 122 XT and so on need an active converter or a replacement controller .

122 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-Soarers-C ... 3f3f4cbdd4

XT http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-XT-AT-to- ... 41894d6dc1

107/62/77/122 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Xwhatsit-IBM- ... 4190e26e12


The AT can be used with a passive AT to PS/2

[jacobolus]

I spent $430 on my Model M. It is a late 1988 Model M 1390131 that was brand new in original box with no discoloration, stains or tears in the box. Immaculate condition but the price was definitely whopping. So I don't really want to spend too much on another keyboard as I just bought a topre a couple weeks ago.

In that case, you were paying maybe $100 for the keyboard (to be generous) and $330+ for the box.

Some people really like collecting unused stuff, but most of us here, even the hard core collectors, want to type on them, so you’ll see a bias toward getting used-but-more-interesting keyboards. Millions of Model Ms were produced, so they’re pretty easy to find in good condition, and while they’re great keyboards and have their die-hard fans, most of us find other boards more fun.

2) I heard Model Fs are lighter than Model Ms due to the metal plate instead of the rubber sheet in the Model M? I don't really want a lighter switch as I am a heavy typist.

Model F has a spring that isn’t quite as stiff (the metal top plate changes the sound but doesn’t really affect the actuation force), but it’ll still take whatever heavy typing you throw at it.

I recommend you try to find some other keyboard fans in your area and meet up to try typing on some of these keyboards.

[andrewjoy]

In that case, you were paying maybe $100 for the keyboard (to be generous) and $330+ for the box.

to be fair the 1390131 is THE model M to have. Thick silver label case, nice and heavy with the extra thick model F style backplate, and a loverly black coiled cable, and NIB very very nice.

[jacobolus]

Sure. As a collector’s item it’s very nice. But you can get a nearly identical typing experience for $80.

[seebart]

Yes the 1390131 is very nice but $430 is a lot even for a NIB one.

Sure. As a collector’s item it’s very nice. But you can get a nearly identical typing experience for $80.

Exactly.

[snarfarlarkus]

So judging from what I've gathered, a Model F AT/XT is the best way to go? I think this layout is the best (Whatever layout it is): http://i.imgur.com/kU3HM.jpg

Yeah $430 was quite a lot but I was new to keyboards at the time so I just plunged on to it.

Do you think I will tell a big difference from Model M to F? And what about the matias switches?

[seebart]

Do you think I will tell a big difference from Model M to F?

Yes you will.

[andrewjoy]

thats the AT. It will be bloody expensive.

You can get a 122 for less with a better layout

The spacebar is also a bit heavy on the AT you can however mod it to a standard model M spacebar + 2 extra mods.

[Muirium]

Expensive? I got my AT for $25.

And I got 3 SSKs, one of them new in box, for less than that insane $430 figure. I'm a Scotsman for goodness sake!

Anywho, I say try MX clear. It's a crappy switch. (Like all its brothers, which range from so-so to positively poor.) But! It might train you out of that terrible habit you have of always bottoming out. If you insist on whacking every key, a lot of the flavour of different switches is drowned out, making your quest a bit pointless. It's like trying new foods… soaked in ketchup.

[andrewjoy]

Back when you got your AT and i got mine ? Yeh but now .... you would have to work at it.

My AT is still very sick , it needs a bolt mod or new barrel plate ...... and i think i would suck donky balls at it and i don't want to kill it.

Where is phosperglows EU brother when you need him.

[Muirium]

Actually there was someone in England who used to offer bolt mod work on DT. Maybe a couple of years ago…

Back to switches: a nice heavy one is black space invaders, of course. A bit heavier than I like, but very satisfying.

http://deskthority.net/review-f45/nmb-r ... t8469.html

[dzhoou]

F122's still come by for say around $85 once in a while on ebey.

[snarfarlarkus]

Where can I get an AT for cheap? I'd like one converted to USB and in at least usable condition.

I don't want to try MX clear because isn't it just an MX brown with heavier actuation force? I've tried the browns and oh god I'd almost rather a good ol' rubber dome.

Hmm thanks for that suggestion, Muirium. Those black space invaders look very interesting after having a read of that thread. How much do they go for?

[pyrelink]

I will add another vote for trying a Model F. I went things a little backwards, I got and started using Model F's before I ever got a Model M. I am now sitting on 3 SSK's (also all acquired under $300 total) and I just wish they were Model F's everytime I use one. I can't explain it, and it doesn't feel like a weight thing, it just plain feels better to type on.

[chzel]

One more vote for F! It's not going to be easy to find an AT for cheap, the are not as common as XTs. Maybe you could first get an XT to try out the switches?

[snarfarlarkus]

Wow 3 SSK's for under $300... I was wanting an SSK but the person who sold it to me asked for over $500 for a brand new NOS SSK new in box so I couldn't afford it at the time.

Will this work with a PC if I get one of those XT to PS2 connectors? It looks relatively clean and good condition but hasn't been tested? http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-IBM-5-P ... 28033b87c8

Anyone selling an AT on the forums?

[snarfarlarkus]

And this one! http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-IBM-5-P ... 3f4fc7a7d7