On making "great finds" private to registered users only

[kbdfr]

Fair enough! Let's put it to a vote among the club members.

Mu, please wait with that
Even if I support the idea, I think a vote should follow an extensive discussion not restricted to those who happen to read here and now.

[Halvar]

Restricting visibility to registered users does not make a lot of sense to me because everyone who is willing to spend money on keyboards will of course register. You can register and in fact still be a lurker.

Maybe we could keep this thread as it is and open a second one that is only visible to club members? That way, every poster who's a club member could decide on their own whether they want to share their finds with the world or just with some people they know a bit better. If we made this very thread here secret that wouldn't stop non-members from opening a second one anyway.

[Redmaus]

Well, lets go ahead and open up a club member topic, if we want to vote on it.

I don't think it should be club members only, even though I am a club member. But I think only registered users with 1 month and 50 posts maybe?

[Muirium]

Nice idea. I'll propose a ballot for now instead of charging straight in! I'd like to test support for both options. Perhaps let people have 3 votes from a selection of 4 items:

Make this thread visible to Registered Users only
Make this thread visible to Club Members only
Make a new Great Finds for Club Members thread, leaving this one untouched
No change

Look good to you guys?

We can open another thread to discuss this, but if we make it a Club thread, only Members can speak! (Everyone can read it, however.) I'm unsure of the best place then to put it.

[stratokaster]

Okay, I guess it's time to become a club member

[Dernubenfrieken]

As a relatively new member, and someone who primarily goes on this forum to look at this thread and a handful of others, I'd be sad to see it go club member only. To be honest, I'm not looking for deals on this thread, but for interesting/unique boards along with information on unique switches and such.

Also this seems to be the most active thread on the whole forum, not allowing new members to see it will make this forum seem even less lively.

[webwit]

Personally I'm against it, our open nature is what made this community and this is like opening Pandora's box. Elecplus for example would have been stopped at geekhack by all their closed sections, rules and limitations (not enough posts, commercial vendor, etc.) And Beardsmore would have been banned for telling a mod (s)he is stupid. This is one the best viewed topics, which is good for deskthority.

Note that if it would come to a vote, please be aware that phpBB doesn't allow to restrict topics on a permission basis, only subforums. So that would mean a subforum not readable by non club members or guests, to which the topic should be moved or in which a new topic could be started.

[kbdfr]

Nice idea. I'll propose a ballot for now instead of charging straight in! I'd like to test support for both options. Perhaps let people have 3 votes from a selection of 4 items:

Make this thread visible to Registered Users only
Make this thread visible to Club Members only
Make a new Great Finds for Club Members thread, leaving this one untouched
No change

Look good to you guys?

We can open another thread to discuss this, but if we make it a Club thread, only Members can speak! (Everyone can read it, however.) I'm unsure of the best place then to put it.

Hey, wait with the ballot!
We should discuss the matter intensively first, including non-club members of course, and then start a vote.

[Redmaus]

Stopping randoms from reddit that just steal the deals and don't contribute is my concern.

[stratokaster]

I must admit that I have never bought anything based on information in this thread, but I read it all the time because of links to rare/interesting boards.

[Muirium]

That's mostly how I use it, too. Bought an AEK II once from here, and helped Halvar with an SSK, but I'm a very infrequent ebayer so this thread is really about looking rather than buying for me. It's a nice daily log of new stuff beyond DT.


@Kbdfr: Aye. Fair enough. Where should we put such a discussion? Must be outside the club section so everyone can speak.

I'd actually already written my suggested ballot (on the iPhone no less) by the time I found your objection waiting for me after hitting Submit! I should have guessed.

[kbdfr]

I find it ridiculous that when I find something well-hidden that I am really, really interested in,
I have to PM the "usual suspects" asking them to refrain from posting it (not from bidding on it, of course)
to make sure not everyone in the world will know about it and I have a fair chance of seeing my searching efforts rewarded.

It should be the opposite. Make the thread visible only to club members!
With their financial contribution they prove that they are not just casually interested, but genuinely participate.

[Blaise170]

If it was club members only, we wouldn't have nearly as many posts from people who aren't club members. However, I do think it would be wise to hide this thread so that only registered users can view it. This wouldn't stop those who are truly determined, but then, neither would making it DT Club only.

[Spikebolt]

Deskthority is a worldwide, open, free speech forum, wiki and irc community where all registered members can freely participate without a hierarchical nature.

• One problem is that not only "all registered members", but anybody who happens to read here, member or not, benefits from the finds posted in this thread.
• I would deny that "freely participate" also includes simply taking advantage.

I search quite intensively (not with keywords like "Cherry", of course ) and when I find something well concealed I am interested in, I always fear someone who is not will post it here, giving everyone information they wouldn’t have found otherwise.
I find it just silly.
It rewards those who are too lazy (or not knowledgeable enough) to search by themselves,
allowing them to compete with those who invest much effort in doing their homework.

Make the bloody thread visible only to club members!

I am in favor of making this thread (or even subforum) to logged members only but not club members. Taking advantage is such a relative term. Today someone gets something you shared, tomorrow you take advantage of something you weren't looking for but that someone shared. I understand your underlying concern that others would get for free what you worked to search for yourself but then you are actually against the existence of this thread, not against who can see it.

When I joined DT I did so because I was fed with GHs elitism and unspoken rules. DT seemed to be a place where everyone could have free speech where everyone was treated equally. Making this thread exclusive to club members is against what DT represents to me, and it creates the worst kind of elitism: pay to win.

[Muirium]

Yeah, there's definitely an argument on all sides of this topic. I think it comes down to a judgement call. I don't see this as a slippery slope, but others do (and others still are against the existence of this thread entirely, as they've said many times in the past).

I've asked Webwit about moving the discussion off this thread (spilling over multiple pages now in an already epic length topic) and into one of its own. Open to all, of course.

[tigpha]

Hi DT'ers,

I'd be wary of restricting access. The reason I began to participate here, which is unusual for me, is because so much is voluntarily shared by all. I really appreciate the generosity I find here. No matter what policy is proposed and however it is enforced, we will continue to see freeloaders, speculators and downright thieves that piss us off. It's just human nature. We can't prevent that. But please don't try to over-protect and risk corroding what treasure we already enjoy here.

[seebart]

I think this is just about the right thread to make visible only to DT Club members. Seeing as this issue keeps coming up, why not put a limit on it? At least DT will benefit from the opportunists! We might make community members of them yet.

We have had this discussion more than once here, if we can agree on a possible change we could vote on one. I changed my mind on this BTW, I don't believe that locking down this thread / limiting access will make any difference in any way whatsoever.

Anyone know what switches this might have?

Those stepped caps look like it might be Fujitsu leaf spring.

[guk]

Leave this thread as it is, create a club only one like Halvar (and others) suggested.
Every club member decides on his/her own where to post an item. Can't possibly blame DT for that if someone rather shares the finds with people who actually have some presence.

[XMIT]

I think this is just about the right thread to make visible only to DT Club members. Seeing as this issue keeps coming up, why not put a limit on it? At least DT will benefit from the opportunists! We might make community members of them yet.

We have had this discussion more than once here, if we can agree on a possible change we could vote on one. I changed my mind on this BTW, I don't believe that locking down this thread / limiting access will make any difference in any way whatsoever.

I agree. Keep it open.

Anyone know what switches this might have?

Those stepped caps look like it might be Fujitsu leaf spring.

Almost certainly, yes, looking at the Enter key too.

[gogusrl]

First need to decide exactly what the problem is and what we plan to gain from changing the current system.

I don't think moving this to club only would solve this, the problem aren't only random passerby's with a deeper wallet than yours, the other club members can be just as much. Imagine this scenario : I find something like the greek Schneider keyboard from a week ago, as long as photekq (sorry dude, you're the best example I got) is a club member I'm in the same danger and I still have to spam "the usual people" to not post it just in case (and by doing this opening myself to further exposure).

On the other hand, I'm (or I used to be) one of the "usual people". When I discovered this hobby I couldn't imagine anything more fun than browsing ebay for hours looking at keyboards I can't afford or were to much trouble to get my hands on them. Since I wasn't going to buy them, the least I could do is pay-it-back (or forward) to the people that got me into this hobby. I still have ebay watch list full of keyboard related keyboards and if I see something interesting in the daily ebay spam my first instinct is ofcourse to post it here.

TLDR : I don't think we can fix human nature and I got no solution.

[kbdfr]

A (fictive ) eBay listing.
Category: Keyboards and keypads.
Title: "Old keyboard".
Text: "Found this keyboard in the attic. It is untested."
Photo:

old keyboard.jpg (57.76 KiB) Viewed 12845 times

That’s all.

The photo reveals it is a Cherry G8X-1800 with doubleshots (not an everyday find),
but spotting it was not a matter of searching for "Cherry", but of scrolling the whole "keyboards and keypads" section and having a look at all pics in the list. Not a matter of a few seconds - hard work.
One can expect three or four bidders and a final price of 15 to 20€.

Now why in the world should everyone be told what it is and where it is
and been given the opportunity to compete with those who made their homework,
overbidding them or raising the final price they will be paying?
Let them do the work themselves. Or join the DT club

[…] Imagine this scenario : I find something like the greek Schneider keyboard from a week ago, as long as photekq (sorry dude, you're the best example I got) is a club member I'm in the same danger

If you find it, you can be sure photekq will have found it without this thread

[…] the least I could do is pay-it-back (or forward) to the people that got me into this hobby. […]

… and to everybody else as well

[seebart]

One can expect three or four bidders and a final price of 15 to 20€.

Not necessarily, that's pure speculation. And moving this thread isn't going to change much either, people who are looking for Cherry G8X-1800 with doubleshots will find this if they search well enough."Old keyboard" isn't exactly a secret insiders' search tip.

[Ray]

Anyone know what switches this might have?

Those stepped caps look like it might be Fujitsu leaf spring.

Almost certainly, yes, looking at the Enter key too.

That return and arrowkeys reminded me of prototopre stuff Hataa posted. Not sure if arrow-keys like that are common on japanese boards though.

On the meta-topic:
I really learned a lot from this topic, before I registered or joined the club. Not sure if I had gone this way if it was hidden. Forcing someone to register is no gain for anything. You don't want to be compared to Massdrop in that direction, do you?

Don't do anything, that requires postcount please. I don't like forced pseudo-spam.

I also don't think a club-only solution is a good one either. Even if it would only have few posts a week.

People should probably consider if someone active in the community might be interested in a very rare item and pm them before posting it here. But don't make that a rule, just a hint to how to make friends

[seebart]

People should probably consider if someone active in the community might be interested in a very rare item and pm them before posting it here. But don't make that a rule, just a hint to how to make friends

That happens every once in a while, I have gotten PM's like that. Not that anyone is forced to abide.

[kbdfr]

One can expect three or four bidders and a final price of 15 to 20€.

Not necessarily, that's pure speculation. And moving this thread isn't going to change much either, people who are looking for Cherry G8X-1800 with doubleshots will find this if they search well enough."Old keyboard" isn't exactly a secret insiders' search tip.

I don’t contest that.
If people search, they will find it.
My point is: don’t serve it on a silver platter to those who don’t.

[guk]

One can expect three or four bidders and a final price of 15 to 20€.

Not necessarily, that's pure speculation. And moving this thread isn't going to change much either, people who are looking for Cherry G8X-1800 with doubleshots will find this if they search well enough."Old keyboard" isn't exactly a secret insiders' search tip.

It's not out of the ordinary though, there have been many listings like that which weren't posted here, resulting in a low if not very low final price.
Recent example: 172082464318

[tentator]

One can expect three or four bidders and a final price of 15 to 20€.

Not necessarily, that's pure speculation. And moving this thread isn't going to change much either, people who are looking for Cherry G8X-1800 with doubleshots will find this if they search well enough."Old keyboard" isn't exactly a secret insiders' search tip.

It's not out of the ordinary though, there have been many listings like that which weren't posted here, resulting in a low if not very low final price.
Recent example: 172082464318

I think cheryos posted that one.. or was it another but similar?

[seebart]

My point is: don’t serve it on a silver platter to those who don’t.

Yes OK, especially unregistered DT lurkers. Or even worse GH users lurking here.

It's not out of the ordinary though, there have been many listings like that which weren't posted here, resulting in a low if not very low final price.
Recent example: 172082464318

Yes I know, I have found a few nice keyobards like that myself. But it's no secret.

[webwit]

I'm sure it happens. Hell I even posted a rare beamspring I found on marktplaats here of which I closed the sale, made an appointment with the seller, and then someone contacted the seller and made him abandon the deal. So let's be clear, yeah this is currently all posted on the Open Internet, and there are bastards out there, reading this as we speak, being annoyed about the noise.

[guk]

@Seebart No, of course not. Just supporting kbdfr's point. After all, you certainly aren't a target of these rants. And you know it!

@Tentator Dunno, might be the case, I didn't notice it being posted here.