SA Dasher & SA Dancer keycap sets (Completed)

[khongthenhuvay]

Do you have a link of a poll for this set on MD?I'll try to spread it.

So happy to have a pro like kingnestea supporting this set.

Maybe you already know but zslane has another great set, currently called "Batgirl". I don't know why and how but I love zslane's sets so much.

The biggest problem with his sets is novelty caps. If they have a few more interesting novelty caps they will attract much more fans supporting them.

@zslane: Don't worry about GB, vendors or any money-related-things else, let communities and pro like kingnestea support you. You just have to cover your designs and make them as beautiful as you can, and spend a bit of time more to let people know, that's all

[zslane]

Unfortunately I am as much in the dark about this as everyone else. I honestly don't know what MassDrop's plans are for the set. I don't know if a surge in interest (or MD survey votes) would have any effect whatsoever because I don't really know how MassDrop decides what to run and when.

All I know is that the set was submitted back on Mar 1st and initially had a tentative Aug/Sep spot in SP's manufacturing schedule. That was later pushed to a completely unknown date for completely unknown reasons (it was suggested by Yanbo that a Christmas drop might happen, rationalized on the basis of a rather oblique interpretation of the set's name).

If you think a wave of interest from Chinese proxies would help dislodge the set from its current state of limbo at MD, then by all means spread the word and let's see what kind of influence that has.

Do you have a link of a poll for this set on MD?I'll try to spread it.

There is no MD poll for it. I don't know that there ever was one. How do I create one?

[zslane]

Maybe you already know but zslane has another great set, currently called "Batgirl".

Unfortunately, the Batgirl design is a non-starter due to copyright and licensing issues. I could rename it to something like "Nightbird", but I'd also have to change the batarang novelty cap to something else, and then it loses its appeal for me.

[kingnestea]

Unfortunately I am as much in the dark about this as everyone else. I honestly don't know what MassDrop's plans are for the set. I don't know if a surge in interest (or MD survey votes) would have any effect whatsoever because I don't really know how MassDrop decides what to run and when.

All I know is that the set was submitted back on Mar 1st and initially had a tentative Aug/Sep spot in SP's manufacturing schedule. That was later pushed to a completely unknown date for completely unknown reasons (it was suggested by Yanbo that a Christmas drop might happen, rationalized on the basis of a rather oblique interpretation of the set's name).

If you think a wave of interest from Chinese proxies would help dislodge the set from its current state of limbo at MD, then by all means spread the word and let's see what kind of influence that has.

Do you have a link of a poll for this set on MD?I'll try to spread it.

There is no MD poll for it. I don't know that there ever was one. How do I create one?

I guess you just have to submit it yourself on MD?Never created any. And another suggestion is to create at least a novelties kit, that helps a lot. It's also a protection for your work since colorway does not receive any copy-right protection only novelties do.

[SL89]

It might be worth it to ask someone who has connections at MassDrop. I'm not sure they have a single point of contact like Melissa at SP.

[chuckdee]

It might be worth it to ask someone who has connections at MassDrop. I'm not sure they have a single point of contact like Melissa at SP.

If he has any idea of when it's supposed to drop, he probably already is in contact. In fact, he says it earlier:

All I know is that the set was submitted back on Mar 1st and initially had a tentative Aug/Sep spot in SP's manufacturing schedule. That was later pushed to a completely unknown date for completely unknown reasons (it was suggested by Yanbo that a Christmas drop might happen, rationalized on the basis of a rather oblique interpretation of the set's name).

[SL89]

See here chuckdee:

There is no MD poll for it. I don't know that there ever was one. How do I create one?

[zslane]

I guess you just have to submit it yourself on MD?Never created any. And another suggestion is to create at least a novelties kit, that helps a lot. It's also a protection for your work since colorway does not receive any copy-right protection only novelties do.

I'll look into putting up a poll on MassDrop.

As for novelties, well, in general I'm not a fan of novelty keys, and novelties certainly do not fit the style of SA Dasher. I am keenly aware that novelties help sell sets, but SA Dasher is simply an exercise in honoring a conventional terminal keyboard from the past. My "Batgirl" design had novelties, and only because the KaPOW! motif uniquely fit that set; and besides, I knew it was never going to be produced so I felt free to be as goofy with it as I wanted.

Re: Protection
This is a touchy subject for some folks, and I've drawn the ire of other designers because of my own views on the matter. I don't believe in "protecting" colorways or keycap designs in general, unless a lot of highly unique novelty keys are involved. In the case of SA Dasher, it isn't even my original colorway design. It is based entirely on a pre-existing product (the Data General Dasher), so I can hardly lay claim to any kind of creative ownership over its dual-blue color scheme.

[SL89]

Re: Protection
This is a touchy subject for some folks, and I've drawn the ire of other designers because of my own views on the matter. I don't believe in "protecting" colorways or keycap designs in general, unless a lot of highly unique novelty keys are involved. In the case of SA Dasher, it isn't even my original colorway design. It is based entirely on a pre-existing product (the Data General Dasher), so I can hardly lay claim to any kind of creative ownership over its dual-blue color scheme.

Well said.

[nafsasp]

Re: Protection
This is a touchy subject for some folks, and I've drawn the ire of other designers because of my own views on the matter. I don't believe in "protecting" colorways or keycap designs in general, unless a lot of highly unique novelty keys are involved. In the case of SA Dasher, it isn't even my original colorway design. It is based entirely on a pre-existing product (the Data General Dasher), so I can hardly lay claim to any kind of creative ownership over its dual-blue color scheme.

I think this is a great stance toward colorways. I definitely think any original designs for legends deserve some protection, but when a set is based on a historical design I think there shouldn't be hard feelings about folks wanting to re-run the colorway later (though I definitely think people should reach out to the original group buy runner/designer to make sure they don't have plans to do so first).

[kingnestea]

I guess you just have to submit it yourself on MD?Never created any. And another suggestion is to create at least a novelties kit, that helps a lot. It's also a protection for your work since colorway does not receive any copy-right protection only novelties do.

Re: Protection
This is a touchy subject for some folks, and I've drawn the ire of other designers because of my own views on the matter. I don't believe in "protecting" colorways or keycap designs in general, unless a lot of highly unique novelty keys are involved. In the case of SA Dasher, it isn't even my original colorway design. It is based entirely on a pre-existing product (the Data General Dasher), so I can hardly lay claim to any kind of creative ownership over its dual-blue color scheme.

I see, I respect your decision regarding the novelties. Anyway, a poll will certainly help dropping this. In the worst case that MD is not willing to drop this, you can still organize a GB on your own, hitting MOQ's shouldn't be a problem while you have the Chinese market backing you up, Jil's SA Valentine sold like 1000+ kits in China, if you will ever consider doing this, I can lay down a connection for you with the same proxy who managed the sub-GB for Jil's SA valentine in China. But yes, sorting and shipping is gonna be a headache.

[zslane]

Thank you, king! I will definitely keep that in mind.

[kingnestea]

You're welcome sir, feel free to contact in the future if you need any information regarding the Chinese market.

[zslane]

I created a poll on MassDrop, for what its worth. The interface for creating it wasn't very intuitive, so I can only hope I got it right. Here is the link:

https://www.massdrop.com/vote/SA-Dasher ... Yay-or-Nay

MassDrop also supplies this URL as well:

http://dro.ps/v/SjxNKEZ

[nafsasp]

I created a poll on MassDrop, for what its worth. The interface for creating it wasn't very intuitive, so I can only hope I got it right. Here is the link:

https://www.massdrop.com/vote/SA-Dasher ... Yay-or-Nay

MassDrop also supplies this URL as well:

http://dro.ps/v/SjxNKEZ

I just shared the poll over on reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyb ... _massdrop/

(Voted for both colorways, since I'm in for both if this group buy happens)

[zslane]

Thanks, nafsasp!

[khongthenhuvay]

Voted for both. I'm in for both, too

[SL89]

Voted

[kingnestea]

Voted and shared the link

[zslane]

Everyone's support is greatly appreciated!

And not just for myself, but for everyone who has an interest in seeing these sets on their keyboards.

Note: voters selecting "Neither set" are tracking at about 6% right now, which I suppose isn't too bad.

[SL89]

Dasher is great as we all know, and Dancer has been something ive wanted since i first saw it.

[nafsasp]

Thanks, nafsasp!

Yup, BTW, I see this has already been discussed a bit at the start of the IC. But I would vote for uniform R3 this set as opposed to sculpted. In some ways uniform feels more retro to me, and can make a few things easier (alternate layout compatibility, for instance).

[niomosy]

Re: Protection
This is a touchy subject for some folks, and I've drawn the ire of other designers because of my own views on the matter. I don't believe in "protecting" colorways or keycap designs in general, unless a lot of highly unique novelty keys are involved. In the case of SA Dasher, it isn't even my original colorway design. It is based entirely on a pre-existing product (the Data General Dasher), so I can hardly lay claim to any kind of creative ownership over its dual-blue color scheme.

I think this is a great stance toward colorways. I definitely think any original designs for legends deserve some protection, but when a set is based on a historical design I think there shouldn't be hard feelings about folks wanting to re-run the colorway later (though I definitely think people should reach out to the original group buy runner/designer to make sure they don't have plans to do so first).

I can confirm that zslane has had some ire drawn due to his stance. At one point, we were discussing the possibility of re-runs of some previously run colorways as a possibility for those that missed the buy. It's a not-uncommon problem with a growing hobby like this. I was also in support of some reruns even if not by the original creator if they didn't wish to do so. We were called entitled for such thoughts and told to focus on new colorways.

The legalities get us into tricky areas of discussion. Essentially, legends are completely unprotected in US copyright law. The only minor exception is on heavily adorned fonts and only the adornment is protected, typically. There's a couple sections they have that talk specifically on uncopyrightable items / material and fonts are included in that.

Similarly, colorways on keyboards are also unprotected by copyright. The colorway bit finally came to a head when Melissa confirmed that colorways can simply be run by anyone that wants them run so long as proper documentation and payment are submitted.

[kylezhuang]

Voted!

[zslane]

Thanks, nafsasp!

Yup, BTW, I see this has already been discussed a bit at the start of the IC. But I would vote for uniform R3 this set as opposed to sculpted. In some ways uniform feels more retro to me, and can make a few things easier (alternate layout compatibility, for instance).

I hear you.

Bear in mind, however, that the original Dasher terminal keyboards did not have uniform rows. They were what we'd today called sculptured, though the switch used back then achieved the row contouring differently. So for this keyset, sculptured feels like the right way to go.

[hoq]

I created a poll on MassDrop, for what its worth. The interface for creating it wasn't very intuitive, so I can only hope I got it right. Here is the link:

https://www.massdrop.com/vote/SA-Dasher ... Yay-or-Nay

MassDrop also supplies this URL as well:

http://dro.ps/v/SjxNKEZ

I shared the URL in the Taobao ,hoping the Chinese people can help to vote for this set.

[zslane]

Great, thanks hoq!

[hoq]

Great, thanks hoq!

With pleasure！

[khongthenhuvay]

Shared on several small communities. Hope that helps a bit

[niomosy]

Definitely a pretty solid number of votes in for this one.