(Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

[Humanoid]

The reason for asking, are we bigger now than we were months/years ago?

I'm certainly new here. I only discovered this thread about a week ago, and have been carefully reading every one of your posts whenever I have some time. I'm currently on page 31 out of 65.

I recently bought an IBM EMR Keyboard II on ebay just to see what a model F really feels like, and it truly is amazing! (except for the spacebar)

You can count me in as being interested in an SSK Model F, as well as a flat tenkeyless Model F in phase 2.

Welcome back!

[Hypersphere]

Thanks for the great news -- positive in all respects

<snip>
How widespread is the model F movement now (like really)?
<snip>
The reason for asking, are we bigger now than we were months/years ago? Does it make sense to produce exactly what we had on a larger level because the movement is bigger?

Judging by the incredible response to Ellipse's F62/F77 project, with around $700k in sales thus far, there is major interest in Model F keyboards. Although Ellipse's project is focused on the previously unobtainium of the Kishsaver-type F-boards, I think there is still considerable interest among those who would like to have Model F boards in more traditional formats, such as the SSK and the full-size Model M, but with F-type switches. Just how many have this interest, I do not know. Perhaps a new survey would help.

On a more minor note, I have forgotten the specs of the original project and its expansion from SSK to include full-size -- Would the F-type full-size fit into a standard Model M case? One reason I ask is that I have a couple Unicomp "industrial" cases --it would be great if these could house a full-size Model F keyboard.

[wcass]

.... Would the F-type full-size fit into a standard Model M case?

That is the plan; old case - new internals.

[Hypersphere]

.... Would the F-type full-size fit into a standard Model M case?

That is the plan; old case - new internals.

Thanks!

[Muirium]

Regarding scale: got to remember there’s relatively few SSKs out there. If owning one of those is the cost of entry, expect much fewer takers than interest alone.

Is there also a full size Model M version of this project? That one will do better, as they’re more plentiful and can even be bought new from Unicomp.

Personally, I’m only into the F upgrade for SSK. But I’m lucky to already have a few.

[digital_matthew]

I'm happy to hear things seem to be going better for you. Looking forward to seeing more of this amazing project!

[drevyek]

There are a few projects out there for cutting down a full-size M case to fit the SSK form factor (I have one, posted in this thread, somewhere), so that is always an option.

I recall that there was a plan to buy a bunch of loose cases from Unicomp (industrials, IIRC), but I don’t know what ever happened with that.

[Muirium]

Doing a TKL chop is quite a daunting challenge for most of us! Easily enough to put a lot of interested people off. If someone was willing to do it for them, however…

But yeah, sounds like there’s a full-size MF as well as SSK, so that should help suit everyone.

[Hypersphere]

I'm still "in" for at least an SSK ==> F and a full-size Model M ==> F. I would also try to honor my original commitment to the project -- I would need to check my records to see what that was!

[hansichen]

Regarding scale: got to remember there’s relatively few SSKs out there. If owning one of those is the cost of entry, expect much fewer takers than interest alone.

Is there also a full size Model M version of this project? That one will do better, as they’re more plentiful and can even be bought new from Unicomp.

Personally, I’m only into the F upgrade for SSK. But I’m lucky to already have a few.

Though keep in mind that you also need more barrels and flippers for a full-size board. With the current Model F prices you already invest quite a bit of money into it to source all the parts so you might wanna go for the board which suits you the best in the end.

I'm personally interested in an SSK upgrade

[wcass]

There was talk about producing new SSK cases. Not sure if these would be "reproductions" or "updated" with GUI/Win keys.

[__red__]

Assuming @__red__ is game if we can’t reach him

You called?

Has @DMA been around?

He's been away for a while, but I can contact him OOB if you need him.


Red

[hansichen]

There was talk about producing new SSK cases. Not sure if these would be "reproductions" or "updated" with GUI/Win keys.

I think this talk is already going on for like 5 years now I doubt that anything in this regard will happen soon.

[Muirium]

Though keep in mind that you also need more barrels and flippers for a full-size board. With the current Model F prices you already invest quite a bit of money into it to source all the parts so you might wanna go for the board which suits you the best in the end.

Ah, we’re still stuck with no secondary source, like Ellipse?

If Model Fs must be harvested, then count that as another strike against expecting larger scale. Interest is one thing, but people must come prepared with the right loots to enter this project! I have both, but I’m unusual like that.

[hansichen]

Ellipse charges 1$ per spring/flipper set and 1$ per barrel, and that stuff will ship in like 2021. At that price you can still buy most Model F boards and source these parts faster and cheaper

[E TwentyNine]

Cutting down a fullsize M case to fit an SSK is dirt simple. Though if someone made a new smaller form factor case for this that might be a good idea.

Is someone going to work on a new logo for the Mara?

[snacksthecat]

Cutting down a fullsize M case to fit an SSK is dirt simple. Though if someone made a new smaller form factor case for this that might be a good idea.

Is someone going to work on a new logo for the Mara?

Oooo, that would be awesome. I propose some variation of the logo they put on the Selectric.



I've always thought this is the coolest IBM logo.

[Muirium]

Gotta say I’m a stickler for the stripes.

[raymondse]

+1 on the striped logo.

[micrex22]

-I think the best way of approaching new SSK chassis would be taking an impression mold and casting new ones like what phosphor glow did. I would... except I don't want to cast a mold from my NIB industrial SSK... and my ivory SSK has deformities making it also unsuitable. Otherwise I would have cast some black / speckled 'space' ones by now (I guess I could just buy one of the overpriced ivories on ebay for this purpose).
-Using commercial logos for a logo impression would be unsavoury and I think LL mentioned that prior / plus the idea was to make something community driven, and IBM logos can be used for original molds if the desire arises

[Darkshado]

Looking forward to the project moving again!

I too would love to see decent reproduction SSK cases made available (can't find the thread about the molding experiments), in a pinch something 3D printed like this (viewtopic.php?f=7&t=14639) would also work.

I've never worked with acrylic, but perhaps a few laser cut pieces bonded together would make for a nice result?

[Techno Trousers]

OMG. Welcome back, Lot Lizard! Looks like I was only off by 365 days and 2019 is going to be the MF'n year!

I expect demand to be perhaps slightly higher than it was, given the prices F-122s have been commanding, though as always the limiting factor is availability of the "switches." I'm glad I kept the faith and still have two torn down F-122s plus the 81 AT barrels I have on layaway with you. Plenty to make my two MF-TKL and 1 MF-Fullsize end game keyboards.

[Techno Trousers]

For those without cases, maybe the Model MF curved assembly could be mounted to a metal "frame" and left exposed? It would look pretty badass as a naked keyboard.

[DMA]

Yeah, I'm around. Tentator dragged me in with the news of your return.

Haven't touched the stuff for 3 months tho. Or was it four? Doing CS tech support (3 new users since summer!), but otherwise completely disconnected.

Sangdrax shipped me 3 quite nice cortrons so I could add support for those to CS - but everything just kind of stuck in the middle - mostly work taking its toll (lots of interesting problems to solve). Still some hope for getting back at those - but.. should probably just shipped it all back already

Had CS BLE in the works, got as far as PoC BLE firmware + prototype PCB (cypress BLE module plus LTC-3559-based buck converter for power efficiency) - also paused for lack of interest, both internal and external.
I mean.. I've got there - about 20 hours of full bore operation on single-cell 500mAh Li-ion, promising results on a jury-rigged proximity sensor over my F122 so device knows when fingers are away and goes low power - but also knows when fingers are back while in powersaving and powers up. Not productionized, of course. Will be pretty expensive too - about $30 just for silicon (probably $2 for everything else except connectors - inductors and large-ish caps required by buck converters have non-zero cost.).

Still testing CS attached to an XTant every day (it's my primary driver).
More than a year already, if memory serves. It's quite stable - didn't have to recalibrate even once.
Crumbs getting under the flippers are the problem though. Make sure the perimeter of the assembly is airtight.

[DMA]

For those without cases, maybe the Model MF curved assembly could be mounted to a metal "frame" and left exposed? It would look pretty badass as a naked keyboard.

Yeah, my (well, Muirium's, technically) naked XTant is a good conversation starter. The frame has to be sturdy tho - it's around 8 pounds, and it's smaller than full-size M

[Muirium]

Glad to hear it’s serving well. Got any pics?

[DMA]

Glad to hear it’s serving well. Got any pics?

Sure!

xtant.jpg (133.65 KiB) Viewed 12669 times

https://www.instagram.com/p/BckeN1LBTaq/
It's mostly the same now, just more crumbs inside

[Muirium]

Bare bones and fully functional. That controller of yours is just the ticket for every latter day F!

[minh2134]

Ok this is epic

[wcass]

Next version of XTant pad card will have pin out so that CY8CKIT-059 can be connected with standard header pins.