IBM Model M replacement keycaps - Where to buy?

[Karmel]

The keycaps that I am comparing the Unicomps to are one piece IBM Wheelwriter caps, both sets are one piece, I recently bought a Unicomp pc 122 keyboard and replacing the keycaps on it with Wheelwriter caps make all the keys feel much better, though now my Wheelwriter keyboard feels really bad because it has Unicomp caps. I ordered some more Unicomp keycaps to see if they would have the same issues. The only noticeable difference besides the slightly reduced height it that open section on the back of the stems is shorter and the clips at the bottom are square and not triangular.

[Weezer]

That is a good point, Fs are older so if there is wear involved then you would expect them to be smooth on both the barrels and the caps, but it appears to be just the caps that are smooth. Someone who owns more Ms and Fs and also knows a bit about the plastics involved should really look into it. Elipse might have some insight here but it is likely only related to Fs and not Ms.

To answer OP: Cindy has caps although you may need to email about them if they are not listed: https://elecshopper.com/

I'm not sure. I can state that my entirely anecdotal observations have been that model F parts have been smoother across the board for me.

Thinking about this now, I'm wondering if the increased play afforded by the longer tongs on the bottom of the model F key has a small part in the exceptional smoothness of Model Fs.

[Karmel]

I guess since this was bumped I'll throw in my tangential two cents.

The people who work at Unicomp are genuine and honest. I respect them for trying and I really wish them the best. Because of this I always try to go to Unicomp first when I need something, but I often don't make a purchase because Unicomp as a company is poorly managed.

I want to make this distinction before I list my thoughts because I think there's a difference between good people and a good product.

-I wish that Unicomp as a whole would put more emphasis on servicing older keyboards. For example, if I need to buy a new ribbon cable for my lock lights, it's not a quick fix like it would seem, it's actually time for a full bolt mod since I have to buy their all in one membrane and completely rip everything apart just to fix the lock lights. For many people this is quite daunting. Unicomp also doesn't also offer any sort of servicing or restoration for Model F keyboards, which in my opinion is a crying shame and a missed business opportunity. With the prices that model Fs go for these days I'm sure there are many people who would invest large amounts of money to restore their model F with new flippers and barrels, not to mention for new PCBs, modern conversions, etc. I'm sure the convenience of the service could justify a good profit margin. Instead Unicomp puts a lot of emphasis in their inferior newer keyboards which as far as I know offer nothing over the original IBM keyboards that I can be had for maybe $10 more on ebay.

-I wish Unicomp would offer reprogrammability on their newer keyboards as a stock feature to give them some sort of impetus for purchase other than: "I want new" because at this point with xwhatsit and soarers, the IBM variants have Unicomp beat eight ways from Sunday.

-I've been seriously deterred every time I've thought about purchasing custom keycaps from them. They look bad, even in the sample pictures and in all the examples I've seen online. The kerning is way off and they're not as dark or bold as the original IBM legends. There's no point in having custom options if every time I throw down money I'm spinning the roulette wheel on quality control.

-Going off that last point, IBM and Lexmark keys are all relatively interchangeable because they all use the same font. If I buy custom keycaps from Unicomp, I have to fully commit to it and buy a full set if I want them all to match. I'm perplexed really that after IBM spent large sums of money on R&D to determine which font and font size was the most legible and pleasing to the eye and used the font successfully on probably the most ubiquitous keyboard ever, that Unicomp would throw all that in the garbage seemingly for very little reason. I get that tooling wears out over time but it seems reasonable to be able to get new tooling in something more similar to the original Helvetica for the former reason as well for compatibility.

-The Unicomp website is cumbersome to navigate and often involves bizarre It feels like I'm purchasing products from a warehouse blowout website rather than from a company that sells premium keyboards.

So yeah, those are my main gripes with Unicomp as a company. Overall though I've been impressed with their customer service and the people who work there have been quite kind. I wish that they would move in a different direction though because I don't see the business getting any bigger with their current focus where it is.

I do agree with most of these points, I think that Unicomp do really need to step up most of what they are doing at the moment. I will say that though my Unicomp keycaps may have some imperfections, the lettering on them is just as good as the lettering on my Wheelwriter keycaps. Though Unicomp products tend to not have very consistent quality, as in sometimes you might get a keyboard that is almost the same quality as a 1996 Lexmark model or you might get a keyboard that has the quality of a Razer Ornata. I think they really need to test their products more, I mean when I got my Unicomp 122, the E, 9, and back tab keys wouldn't even register if I pressed them on the bottom of the keycap, though the issue was fixed once I reseated the springs. I think anything like that could have been avoided if they had just tested the keyboard, or had tested it more precisely. So yeah, they really need to improve some of their business practices and they need to look into fixing some of their machinery and things such as that.

[Weezer]

I do agree with most of these points, I think that Unicomp do really need to step up most of what they are doing at the moment. I will say that though my Unicomp keycaps may have some imperfections, the lettering on them is just as good as the lettering on my Wheelwriter keycaps. Though Unicomp products tend to not have very consistent quality, as in sometimes you might get a keyboard that is almost the same quality as a 1996 Lexmark model or you might get a keyboard that has the quality of a Razer Ornata. I think they really need to test their products more, I mean when I got my Unicomp 122, the E, 9, and back tab keys wouldn't even register if I pressed them on the bottom of the keycap, though the issue was fixed once I reseated the springs. I think anything like that could have been avoided if they had just tested the keyboard, or had tested it more precisely. So yeah, they really need to improve some of their business practices and they need to look into fixing some of their machinery and things such as that.

To be fair to Unicomp, the keys may have gotten messed up during shipping.

Over all though, yeah I haven't been impressed with the quality.

It's a shame to me because I really like the guys at Unicomp. They're always super helpful and they refunded me the difference on shipping when they overcharged me. That kind of stuff makes an impression on me and I always try to go to them first when I need something because of it.

I'm a perfectionist so I can see how my complaints could seem overbearing to others, but my criticisms are really borne out of the hope that they might improve their marketing and offerings. I think they could be doing a lot better as far as sales if they just stepped up their game a little bit, because if you choose to go Unicomp you're giving up a lot of features that are commonplace on keyboards in the same price range, and you're also not getting anything super close to what you get with an IBM manufactured board. I mean Joe Strandberg has an advertised gross sales of 1.1M with his Model F project. That's gotta be something that could be profitable for Unicomp if they pursued something similar. I don't understand why they don't. Joe also seeked out the press and got free advertising in the numerous articles published about his project. If I look up Unicomp I get results for X-Ray machines and COVID-19. Marketing sells.

[kmnov2017]

...

....I mean Joe Strandberg has an advertised gross sales of 1.1M with his Model F project. That's gotta be something that could be profitable for Unicomp if they pursued something similar. I don't understand why they don't....

Unicomp's annual revenue is in excess of USD 25 million annually. Over the past 4 years that's your comparing Joe's sales against, Ucicomp's revenues are well over USD 100 million...

[Weezer]

...

....I mean Joe Strandberg has an advertised gross sales of 1.1M with his Model F project. That's gotta be something that could be profitable for Unicomp if they pursued something similar. I don't understand why they don't....

Unicomp's annual revenue is in excess of USD 25 million annually. Over the past 4 years that's your comparing Joe's sales against, Ucicomp's revenues are well over USD 100 million...

Where are you finding the sales figures for Unicomp?

[kmnov2017]

This is available publicly and also on D&B, Bisnode, etc. Comparing unicomp's revenue to Joe's project is laughable.

Unicomp sells thousands of keyboards to their corporate customers. Most of their revenue comes from large custom orders. Any reason for change of font, colours, etc will only make sense if a large customer order warrants it and pays for the tooling.

Requests for one off sets of keys or random keys from enthusiasts like us in nothing but nuisance for them. So I don't see why they'd change anything. It just doesn't make any business sense.

[Ellipse]

As a note to update this old thread, the Brand New Model F Keyboards project key caps are compatible with original Model F and Model M keyboards.

zrrion I have not noticed what you describe regarding keys (Model M keys and Unicomp keys are fine in my experience testing on the new Model F keyboards) but I will note that the plastic used in the Model F barrels is different from what is used on the Model M "frame" (plastic top assembly including the barrels). I find the Model F barrels to produce a much higher quality experience including smoothness with a variety of key caps, compared to the Model M.

[kmnov2017]

The new one piece keycaps from Unicomp are quite smooth on model Fs, at least in my opinion. The older two part unicomp keycaps are DEFINITELY scratchy on model Fs but not really noticeable on Model Ms.

[funkmon]

I wonder if maybe that's due to the personal wear on the keys. I have some Alps switches that will only work with the sliders they've always had, and don't work with other ones. They're scratchy. Maybe, over time, your old Unicomp keys have kind of just begun to sit with the barrel and now they won't work well with any other keyboard, but your brand new ones are still a blank slate.

[elecplus]

That is a good point, Fs are older so if there is wear involved then you would expect them to be smooth on both the barrels and the caps, but it appears to be just the caps that are smooth. Someone who owns more Ms and Fs and also knows a bit about the plastics involved should really look into it. Elipse might have some insight here but it is likely only related to Fs and not Ms.

To answer OP: Cindy has caps although you may need to email about them if they are not listed: https://elecshopper.com/

Thanks @zrrion! Yes, I do still have about 150 pounds of original M and F caps. None were made by Unicomp. Still working on the new ecomm. It should be functional by Aug 1, and I will have the caps up then.

[Dikkus]

The new one piece keycaps from Unicomp are quite smooth on model Fs, at least in my opinion. The older two part unicomp keycaps are DEFINITELY scratchy on model Fs but not really noticeable on Model Ms.

Interesting. I don't have any one parts to test, but I believe you. It's curious, though.

Has anyone ever concretely identified what's the main source of potential friction on the stems? I've heard all sorts of theories, but nothing seems solid. I've tried to fix some particularly scratchy F/M keycaps -- first by cleaning the barrel, obviously -- and then by lubing. Lube doesn't really seem to do much for smoothness on the stems. Maybe a little, but not much. I've seen some people say to shave a bit off the "arch" or the nubs, but I've tried both of those things and it doesn't really seem to do much for smoothness.

Funnily enough, I think that's why I end up preferring the two piece keycaps the most over the single piece ones. A key that feels super scratchy in one barrel might feel perfectly smooth in another barrel. One both of my M's, I had to "tune" the keyboard by mixing and matching the stems until I was satisfied with the smoothness.

[Weezer]

This is available publicly and also on D&B, Bisnode, etc. Comparing unicomp's revenue to Joe's project is laughable.

Unicomp sells thousands of keyboards to their corporate customers. Most of their revenue comes from large custom orders. Any reason for change of font, colours, etc will only make sense if a large customer order warrants it and pays for the tooling.

Requests for one off sets of keys or random keys from enthusiasts like us in nothing but nuisance for them. So I don't see why they'd change anything. It just doesn't make any business sense.

I'm not trying to start an argument, but I wanted to point out that I wasn't comparing Unicomp's revenue to Joe's, I was referencing Joe's revenue just to illustrate how there's demand out there and therefore money to be made.

[Karmel]

I got my Unicomp keycaps delivered and the results are quite strange. All the pearl ones are 1 piece and any other color including pebble is 2 piece. The color of the pebble keycaps in indeed off a little when compared to the originals, but pearl is the exact same. There are no manufacturing errors or anything on the new ones I ordered, unlike the ones that came with my Unicomp keyboard which have extra plastic strips hanging off and misshapen sections on the bottom of the slider in some cases. I might just order a set of blank keycaps or something like that, seeing as they appear to be better quality than the ones I had. I didn't order a full set, just keys for the numpad and a few others.

[funkmon]

Yes, that's fairly typical as of late. Most of the pearls are one piece and the pebbles are two pieces. And the colours are definitely off on the pebble, but they're also ever so slightly off on the pearl as well, which is interesting. It is slight.

You can order a full custom set for $30, printed however you want, if you're going to order a full set. It's nice. I like it a lot. You can also put in the custom order if you want them to fill it with all two piece or one piece keys. I genuinely prefer the one piece keys in terms of build, but I hate swapping those things out, which is something I do strangely frequently.

[downtownHippie]

I'm not trying to start an argument, but I wanted to point out that I wasn't comparing Unicomp's revenue to Joe's, I was referencing Joe's revenue just to illustrate how there's demand out there and therefore money to be made.

But you kind of are. You're insisting that a company with more than $25mil in yearly revenue should care about an additional $250k...and that's revenue, not profit.

Stop being upset someone doesn't want to sell to whiny gamer freaks - you might not be one, but many in our community are entitled little pieces of garbage, and if you sat on the other end of an inbox getting email like that all day you'd quickly decide to just ignore ALL OF US who don't want to spend $1mil at a drop.

I've bought 2 custom keyboards from them, and more than $300 in additional plastic...most of their customers buy a few $$milllion$$ in keyboards, ANNUALLY. $250k in annual revenue is NOT much money for a company like that.

And after the horrible treatment of someone trying to do a custom group buy on r/mk a few weeks back buy people who felt slighted that someone only invested $20k in a project instead of a couple mil...I'd probably be setting filters on email and anyone who is an ass once in email will get all their email blocked forever.

[Weezer]

Um... not sure how to respond to this to be honest. As I said, I'm not trying to start an argument. I just shared my opinion.