> Removing the factory lubricant from SKCM switches immediately makes them awful. The lube is there for a reason.
Except of course, if you are suggesting that the brilliant ALPS engineers, after they have designed one of the best switches of all time, were incompetent and stupid enough to pay more and have to lube them.
I had to read this a couple times. You're saying that at least some Alps switches need lubricant. However, we need to identify which key switches in the SKCM group actually came with lubricant. Unless I missed something, as far as we know, the only one we know definitely did was orange Alps. If there were more and
confirmed by more than one source, I missed it. That's an apology on my part.
The comment about "incompetent and stupid" engineers makes me think of something like, "If Nissan engineers, after they have designed one of the best cars of all time, were incompetent and stupid enough to make those cars require oil changes ..."
In addition to this, unless I missed this -- and again, if I did, that's an apology on my part -- we haven't even determined what plastics were used for each SKCM switch. We do know that the construction of the SKCM switches visually changed over the years. Maybe they also changed plastics. Maybe something else changed.
> Or do you suggest that ultrasonic cleaning, somehow does something more than... just cleaning?
No, but if your key switches are filled with 25+ years of keyboard chow, chances are pretty good that your switches will work better after cleaning. Additionally, I don't think that keyboard switches that have been sitting around for 25+ years, even if you had them stored in a climate controlled environment, are in "brand new" shape. In any case, the reason I mentioned the cleaning is to try to get closer to a scientific test of, well, everything mentioned about lubes and Alps switches in this thread.
> And for the record, I have left BLUE SKCM switches with nyogel 760G
I've tried on cream damped and salmon. Maybe there's something interesting about the blue switches. Additionally, did you actually type on the switches every day? How many switches did you try? Maybe that makes a difference. For me, it's very hard to tell from one switch if it's good or not. I try to get at least 26 to test and put them in a keyboard.
> Too much, will simply mean that it will get spilled left and right and you will have to clean it. It will NOT make the sliding worse. It is not possible.
The comment about "too much" wasn't made by me, but that's something else to test. I probably do use more than others, but it's not like I'm using an entire tube per keyboard.
> I dont understand what you are trying to say or do but it seems to me that you are trying to defend nyogel 760G
I personally don't care about the brand or anything. I'm saying, "This worked for me," then you're saying, "It really didn't work for hellothere because (wall of text)." You're saying my opinion is invalid. Hey, it's an opinion. By definition it
can't be invalid. A better approach would be to see if you could duplicate my results. You've not done that. As far as I've been able to tell, you've tested on one blue switch. No salmons. No cream damped.
> And also you know why 760G doesn't work? Because that lube has a very low viscosity base oil (PAO).
And, for the folks it did work for ... they're imagining things? Disassembling and cleaning made everything work and the Nyogel being there is just a coincidence? I know you mentioned the placebo effect, but I really did have a couple binding keys on my salmon board and now I don't. I also can't get a key on my white Alps, which I lubed with the RO stuff, to bind.
I am not a Materials Scientist. I am not an engineer. However, the testing done in this thread is not scientific. It's anecdotal. Let me lay out a real test. I'll go ahead and say blue Alps:
You first need several
brand new blue Alps keyboards of the same make and model and, preferably, with sequential serial numbers, in a serial number range that we know no other tooling or keyswitch materials changes were made. You'd also want to make sure that the switches are from the same batch. You can use NOS keyboards instead if and only if they were stored the same way. The comments about serial numbers, etc. remain the same.
Keyboard tech confirms that all the keebs and switches are in the same condition or close to it.
* Control keeb. Completely stock.
* Test keeb 1. Clean the top housings and sliders ultrasonically. (If you really wanted to be picky, you would have a control of just ultrasoniced with water and another with whatever ultrasonic cleaning stuff you like. The water has to be degassed properly, from the same source and at the same temperature. Make sure you ultrasonic for the same length of time.)
* Test keeb 2. Everything from test keeb 1, but treat the housings (or sliders) with Nyogel/RO-59tmKT/peanut butter/whatever. Allow it to cure/dry/stiffen/etc. per manufacturer direction OR, if you want to test some sort of anecdotal information, like type on it for an hour a day for a few weeks, do that.
* Victim 1: test the keyboards. Have him write down which one feels the best. Have the victim write out a prepared doc. (Remember, same make and model, so it's a blind test.)
* Victim 2: test the keyboards. Have him write down which one feels the best. Use the same doc. (Remember, same make and model, so it's a blind test.)
* Victim 3: test the keyboards. Have him write down which one feels the best. Use the same doc. (Remember, same make and model, so it's a blind test.)
Three victims because, at the very least, you should get an average answer.
That's even
leaving out some steps. Yes, it's exhaustive. Do I want to do all that? Definitely not. Would I even be able to do one of these tests? Sorta. Because we're talking about keebs that are at least 25 years old and it's probably next to impossible to find three NOS ones with the characteristics I laid out, I do have three AEK IIs with cream damped switches I could test. But ... I'm happy to stick with stuff I already know has worked for me, rather than spend a day swapping switches.
Hey, if someone else in this thread comes up with a better solution, I'd be happy to try it, provided it's not hideously expensive. Even if it's from you, NeK. I think that's most people's bottom line. I wouldn't be the first to try, though. I let other people beta test for me
.
