I've got my eye on one of the Leopold keyboards because I've always wanted to try a full fledged Topre board. It comes with two options, Topre and Topre Silent.
How would you compare the sound, feel, and performance between the two?
When it comes to switches I have GOT to have the best tactility I can get. Which one would you say does a better job of it?
Topre vs Topre Silent
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
I’m assuming the opposite: that they’ve tried Nopre and now want to get “the full fledged” Topre experience.
To answer the question: I find no difference in tactility between damped and undamped Topre. I recently got to try them side by side again as I bought a second HHKB, with regular no-damper Topre throughout. First time I’d been faced with one in years. So what was the straight compare like again, after so long on Type-S? I didn’t like it!
I find damping Topre loses nothing. Just softens out that egregious plastic thwack when the keys top back out. The travel is indistinguishable. The sound is so much cleaner with more thock without that return racket. And the feel is indentical.
I duly damped that black HHKB myself. Love it! And I kept one lone key as stock to remind me what I’m missing. One small plastic smack!
To answer the question: I find no difference in tactility between damped and undamped Topre. I recently got to try them side by side again as I bought a second HHKB, with regular no-damper Topre throughout. First time I’d been faced with one in years. So what was the straight compare like again, after so long on Type-S? I didn’t like it!
I find damping Topre loses nothing. Just softens out that egregious plastic thwack when the keys top back out. The travel is indistinguishable. The sound is so much cleaner with more thock without that return racket. And the feel is indentical.
I duly damped that black HHKB myself. Love it! And I kept one lone key as stock to remind me what I’m missing. One small plastic smack!
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wobbled
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: HHKB PD-KB300 Pro 1
- Main mouse: Logitech MX Master 3
- Favorite switch: Topre
- DT Pro Member: 0192
If you're buying them factory silenced then expect the feel and performance to be absolutely identical to stock boards with only a change to the sound (which will obviously be more muted)
If you buy a stock board and choose to silence it yourself then you'd need to stick with 0.2 or 0.3mm silencing rings (silence-x and deskeys) otherwise you'll begin to lose some tactility unless you make up for the thickness of a 0.4 or 0.5mm silencing ring with a plate gasket.
If you buy a stock board and choose to silence it yourself then you'd need to stick with 0.2 or 0.3mm silencing rings (silence-x and deskeys) otherwise you'll begin to lose some tactility unless you make up for the thickness of a 0.4 or 0.5mm silencing ring with a plate gasket.
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JCMax
- Location: United States
- Main keyboard: Unicomp New Model M
- Main mouse: Anker Vertical Mouse
- Favorite switch: Clciky-tactile
Precisely!!! (Pun intended
)I've only tried a Topre switch tester. That's one of the reasons I want to try a Topre board now. That and plus I have tried a Niz Plum board.
Since they're so much money I just want to get ONE board for the Topre experience. I would rather get the switch type I would like the most than have to pay the same price all over again for a different board.
I would describe the tactility that I like (based from the switch tester) as having that nice rounded but well defined tactile bump with the very cushion-y soft, easy on the fingers feeling the bottoming out has. That's the best way I can describe it.
Muirium wrote: ↑27 Feb 2022, 17:34To answer the question: I find no difference in tactility between damped and undamped Topre. I recently got to try them side by side again as I bought a second HHKB, with regular no-damper Topre throughout. First time I’d been faced with one in years. So what was the straight compare like again, after so long on Type-S? I didn’t like it!
I find damping Topre loses nothing. Just softens out that egregious plastic thwack when the keys top back out. The travel is indistinguishable. The sound is so much cleaner with more thock without that return racket. And the feel is indentical.
I duly damped that black HHKB myself. Love it! And I kept one lone key as stock to remind me what I’m missing. One small plastic smack!
Based on what you guys said I may just buy the silent since since I want to be able to use it at work too. Thanks!wobbled wrote: ↑27 Feb 2022, 17:41If you're buying them factory silenced then expect the feel and performance to be absolutely identical to stock boards with only a change to the sound (which will obviously be more muted)
If you buy a stock board and choose to silence it yourself then you'd need to stick with 0.2 or 0.3mm silencing rings (silence-x and deskeys) otherwise you'll begin to lose some tactility unless you make up for the thickness of a 0.4 or 0.5mm silencing ring with a plate gasket.
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
Type-S: the DT authorised choice. Well, 2022 DT. Webwit thought otherwise of my first Topre board back in 2014. I’m very glad I didn’t follow his advice. User installable damping rings hadn’t been invented yet. 
Which keyboard are you looking at anyway?
Which keyboard are you looking at anyway?
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JCMax
- Location: United States
- Main keyboard: Unicomp New Model M
- Main mouse: Anker Vertical Mouse
- Favorite switch: Clciky-tactile
My top choices in descending order
Leopold FC660C Black 65% (When they come back in stock unless I order the white/gray version)
Leopold FC980C Black (Only if I can find one that comes with 45g)
HHKB Classic Charcoal 60% (Although this one doesn't come with Silent Topre)
HHKB Hybrid Type-S Charcoal 60%
I am going to order from mechanicalkeyboards.com.
The only thing I DO NOT like about HHKB is no arrow keys. I use those a lot.
Otherwise it might be my top choice.The Leopold is because a lot of reviews have said it's a good alternative to HHKB with a similar layout.
Leopold FC660C Black 65% (When they come back in stock unless I order the white/gray version)
Leopold FC980C Black (Only if I can find one that comes with 45g)
HHKB Classic Charcoal 60% (Although this one doesn't come with Silent Topre)
HHKB Hybrid Type-S Charcoal 60%
I am going to order from mechanicalkeyboards.com.
The only thing I DO NOT like about HHKB is no arrow keys. I use those a lot.
Otherwise it might be my top choice.The Leopold is because a lot of reviews have said it's a good alternative to HHKB with a similar layout.
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
The Leopold layout is a little goofy for my taste. Man up and go 60% or stay home on TKL! The layout space between is full of awkward compromise and limited choice of caps.
Bet I hit the arrow keys as much as you do. They’re more than fine on the HHKB. They have me wishing all my keyboards had an Fn key tucked beside Right SSSHHHIIIFFFTTT so I could do the same on them. Hopping over to a whole other neighbourhood every time you want to move the cursor soon becomes as unnatural feeling as it sounds! Imagine you had to leave the alpha block for other frequent necessities like Shift! oh, hold on a sec, i’ll be back in a moment… There we go.
I’m an HHKB Pro 2 purist myself. The board I damped the other day is my black one. Both looks are very comely, I love a good dyesub, but I’ve got to say the stealthy ninja style is winning me for now!
The newer models already come with a damped option, which saves some messing around inside, and a PBT spacebar as stock, and a Bluetooth option. I had the parts to spare so it was an easy choice for me to go grab a second Pro 2 while they’re still available in new condition. But if I was starting out, I’d very likely get the Bluetooth Type-S.
Oh, I’d suggest anyone who’s HHKB-curious to trial run those cursor diamond keys on another keyboard first. (Ideally something with a 1.75 unit Right Shift like a Model F XT, where I did it.) Because if you get that black model, the function legends are almost invisible, right enough!
Bet I hit the arrow keys as much as you do. They’re more than fine on the HHKB. They have me wishing all my keyboards had an Fn key tucked beside Right SSSHHHIIIFFFTTT so I could do the same on them. Hopping over to a whole other neighbourhood every time you want to move the cursor soon becomes as unnatural feeling as it sounds! Imagine you had to leave the alpha block for other frequent necessities like Shift! oh, hold on a sec, i’ll be back in a moment… There we go.
I’m an HHKB Pro 2 purist myself. The board I damped the other day is my black one. Both looks are very comely, I love a good dyesub, but I’ve got to say the stealthy ninja style is winning me for now!
The newer models already come with a damped option, which saves some messing around inside, and a PBT spacebar as stock, and a Bluetooth option. I had the parts to spare so it was an easy choice for me to go grab a second Pro 2 while they’re still available in new condition. But if I was starting out, I’d very likely get the Bluetooth Type-S.
Oh, I’d suggest anyone who’s HHKB-curious to trial run those cursor diamond keys on another keyboard first. (Ideally something with a 1.75 unit Right Shift like a Model F XT, where I did it.) Because if you get that black model, the function legends are almost invisible, right enough!
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
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hellothere
- Location: Mesa, AZ USA
- Main keyboard: Lots
- Main mouse: CST2545W-RC
- Favorite switch: TopreAlpsHallEffectTopreAlpsHallEffectTopreAlps
Alps SKCM brown.
Back on to Topre, I've got two Realforce keyboards: a 45g and a 55g. The 55 is much more tactile.
Currently, the Realforce 55g is not available with factory silenced switches.
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
Step 1. Get a Topre.
Step 2. See if you like it.
Step 3. Investigate dome swaps and aftermarket rings.
Step 2 may well preclude any further steps, apart from longing for future Topres.
Besides, just use your HHKB a few years and it'll feel like 55g. My 2014 model does! The lighter feel of the black model I'm using today is something I really like about it. Wonder where I could source 30g Topre domes, or something third-party which still has that Topre feel…
Step 2. See if you like it.
Step 3. Investigate dome swaps and aftermarket rings.
Step 2 may well preclude any further steps, apart from longing for future Topres.
Besides, just use your HHKB a few years and it'll feel like 55g. My 2014 model does! The lighter feel of the black model I'm using today is something I really like about it. Wonder where I could source 30g Topre domes, or something third-party which still has that Topre feel…
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Bjerrk
- Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
- Main keyboard: Cherry G80-1800 & Models F & M
- Main mouse: Mouse Keys, Trackpoint, Trackball
- Favorite switch: IBM Buckling Springs+Beamspring, Alps Plate Spring
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
Well, I've been banging away on mine pretty heavily for many years. And I wouldn't call it "deteriorate" as that would mean *less* tactility to me. Quite the opposite! They seem to mature quite nicely with extended heavy use.
But my own taste leans towards the lighter varieties. I'd never want to swap 55g domes into a board. My 55g 87u is more than enough of the super tactiles for me. It's had just a fraction as much use from me, as a result. I like 'em light.
I've no plans to retire the white HHKB, let's put it that way.
But my own taste leans towards the lighter varieties. I'd never want to swap 55g domes into a board. My 55g 87u is more than enough of the super tactiles for me. It's had just a fraction as much use from me, as a result. I like 'em light.
I've no plans to retire the white HHKB, let's put it that way.
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JCMax
- Location: United States
- Main keyboard: Unicomp New Model M
- Main mouse: Anker Vertical Mouse
- Favorite switch: Clciky-tactile
I think he means "break in" rather than deteriorate. Which is the mark of an awesome keyboard!
I will get the HHKB Type-S Hybrid. It is a tough choice between the black and the white. The black I can only see someone getting if they don't care about being able to read the key legends. So basically for purely aesthetic reasons since they look so cool (which do).
I am leaning towards the white being my top choice since I want to be able to see the legends. Plus I like getting white-gray color schemes once in awhile since so many peripherals are black. It's bit of a refresher sometimes.
Although if I decide to get another one at some point I would definitely go back to black.
I will get the HHKB Type-S Hybrid. It is a tough choice between the black and the white. The black I can only see someone getting if they don't care about being able to read the key legends. So basically for purely aesthetic reasons since they look so cool (which do).
I am leaning towards the white being my top choice since I want to be able to see the legends. Plus I like getting white-gray color schemes once in awhile since so many peripherals are black. It's bit of a refresher sometimes.
Although if I decide to get another one at some point I would definitely go back to black.
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
As someone who took that same path exactly, I can quite recommend it.
The black on black legends always struck me as plain silly. Back when I considered which HHKB to get, I was more tempted by a black one with blanks! Having used this one a fair bit now, I can say I'm pleased I got it with dyesubs. Sure, they're almost invisible, but actually, when you're entering a long password or doing anything which takes you out of finger-autopilot, those legends are a subtle assistance I've already enjoyed a few times! I wouldn't want to rely on them for learning the ;'[/ cursor diamond, however. But for finding number keys in secure forms and the like, they're a fine addition.
This is coming from someone whose NovaTouch currently looks like this:
I can definitely type on blanks. But every once in a while there's that awkward moment when you forget where you are and just glance at the legends and… well, utter Elven curses!
The black on black legends always struck me as plain silly. Back when I considered which HHKB to get, I was more tempted by a black one with blanks! Having used this one a fair bit now, I can say I'm pleased I got it with dyesubs. Sure, they're almost invisible, but actually, when you're entering a long password or doing anything which takes you out of finger-autopilot, those legends are a subtle assistance I've already enjoyed a few times! I wouldn't want to rely on them for learning the ;'[/ cursor diamond, however. But for finding number keys in secure forms and the like, they're a fine addition.
This is coming from someone whose NovaTouch currently looks like this:
- IMG_3624.jpg (271.81 KiB) Viewed 17137 times
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wobbled
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: HHKB PD-KB300 Pro 1
- Main mouse: Logitech MX Master 3
- Favorite switch: Topre
- DT Pro Member: 0192
I would personally go with the HHKB White Hybrid Type-S if I were you.
The black on grey keycaps really are difficult to read to the point you may as well have bought blank keycaps. Not a huge deal when you know the HHKB layout pretty well, but there's always that occasion where you need to look down.
You could of course get a black HHKB and put the white keycaps on - not actually a bad look, but of course more expense.
Do expect very light domes from the newer Hybrids though. It's been a very long time since I've had a brand new (newly produced) Pro 1 or Pro 2, and had forgotten just how light the domes are when brand new. Even the old stock Pro 2s have managed to mature when being left in their box (not at all a bad thing!)
Now personally I have modded my Pro 2 to 55g domes and left my Pro 1 with original domes as I like the stiffer, more tactile feel. If you can find a realforce 55g for cheap then I highly recommend the swap. Or even the carrot domes from Deskeys.
I definitely think people would buy your 45g Hybrid domes off you if they want that brand new 45g feel!
The black on grey keycaps really are difficult to read to the point you may as well have bought blank keycaps. Not a huge deal when you know the HHKB layout pretty well, but there's always that occasion where you need to look down.
You could of course get a black HHKB and put the white keycaps on - not actually a bad look, but of course more expense.
Do expect very light domes from the newer Hybrids though. It's been a very long time since I've had a brand new (newly produced) Pro 1 or Pro 2, and had forgotten just how light the domes are when brand new. Even the old stock Pro 2s have managed to mature when being left in their box (not at all a bad thing!)
Now personally I have modded my Pro 2 to 55g domes and left my Pro 1 with original domes as I like the stiffer, more tactile feel. If you can find a realforce 55g for cheap then I highly recommend the swap. Or even the carrot domes from Deskeys.
I definitely think people would buy your 45g Hybrid domes off you if they want that brand new 45g feel!
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
^ Good point. I could see myself fancying those domes. And I also happen to have these:
I've tried them on my black HHKB, but I'm strongly Team Black for the moment.
I've tried them on my black HHKB, but I'm strongly Team Black for the moment.
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JCMax
- Location: United States
- Main keyboard: Unicomp New Model M
- Main mouse: Anker Vertical Mouse
- Favorite switch: Clciky-tactile
I am seriously thinking about getting the black keyboard with the white gray keys separate. Thanks for the suggestion. It's the same look on the New Model M (which I think looks awesome).
The ones I am looking at have an option for silent 45g. If it breaks into feeling like 55g after a bit of use I would be happy! I think 55g is the sweet spot for me.
The ones I am looking at have an option for silent 45g. If it breaks into feeling like 55g after a bit of use I would be happy! I think 55g is the sweet spot for me.
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
Aye, you're on the right track. It's nice having both colourways at hand:
I'd nab the HHKB first and see how the ninja black lifestyle suits you, and only then spring on the sparkly white caps. But I know it's often easier just to rip off the financial bandaid all at once!
I'd nab the HHKB first and see how the ninja black lifestyle suits you, and only then spring on the sparkly white caps. But I know it's often easier just to rip off the financial bandaid all at once!
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wobbled
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: HHKB PD-KB300 Pro 1
- Main mouse: Logitech MX Master 3
- Favorite switch: Topre
- DT Pro Member: 0192
You can still pick up the keycaps from either ebay (like this one) https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154833546434
Or from buyee.jp and importing them directly.
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wobbled
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: HHKB PD-KB300 Pro 1
- Main mouse: Logitech MX Master 3
- Favorite switch: Topre
- DT Pro Member: 0192
Mu did your HHKB come new in original box?Muirium wrote: ↑28 Feb 2022, 19:28Aye, you're on the right track. It's nice having both colourways at hand:
I'd nab the HHKB first and see how the ninja black lifestyle suits you, and only then spring on the sparkly white caps. But I know it's often easier just to rip off the financial bandaid all at once!
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JCMax
- Location: United States
- Main keyboard: Unicomp New Model M
- Main mouse: Anker Vertical Mouse
- Favorite switch: Clciky-tactile
The silent switch for HHKB looks like it is only available on the HHKB Type-S Hybrid on mechanicalkeyboards.com.
There is only one thing stopping me from placing my order right now..............the price.
Would you still pay full price or order the HHKB Hybrid and dampen them yourself?
There is only one thing stopping me from placing my order right now..............the price.
Would you still pay full price or order the HHKB Hybrid and dampen them yourself?
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JCMax
- Location: United States
- Main keyboard: Unicomp New Model M
- Main mouse: Anker Vertical Mouse
- Favorite switch: Clciky-tactile
Nevermind, just placed it! I also got a dust cover to go with it too!JCMax wrote: ↑01 Mar 2022, 02:27The silent switch for HHKB looks like it is only available on the HHKB Type-S Hybrid on mechanicalkeyboards.com.
There is only one thing stopping me from placing my order right now..............the price.
Would you still pay full price or order the HHKB Hybrid and dampen them yourself?
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Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
That's the spirit! Welcome to the HHKB Club. 
What does the dust cover look like? I don't need one as I keep my HHKB in my laptop bag whenever I'm not using it, so it's always good to go. Charge it in there too, with a USB cable, like all my devices. Obviously, the Bluetooth native models use replaceable AA batteries instead; but you don't have to charge them as religiously as I do. I've never had my HHKB empty on me, in all these years of use.
But now I've two, though… good job I got that HHKB carry case.
The Type-S I bought brand new from Amazon Japan in 2014, with 002's proxying assistance, in the same order as that PFU official dyesub set, and the official Happy Hacking HHKB carry case.
This black one I bought on Ebay from that seller Go-Kart shared. Cost me £127 and change. They describe their stock as "Opened – never used condition" which is accurate. The box is a little scruffy on the outside, like it's travelled a bit, but the HHKB came entirely wear free and spotless, its inner pastic wrapper opened but that's all. Perfectly reasonable.
Mind, my 2014 HHKB's box got a bit squeezed in rough luggage handling, so both my boxes look the same way! I keep the original controllers in them, and my swapped out caps.
What does the dust cover look like? I don't need one as I keep my HHKB in my laptop bag whenever I'm not using it, so it's always good to go. Charge it in there too, with a USB cable, like all my devices. Obviously, the Bluetooth native models use replaceable AA batteries instead; but you don't have to charge them as religiously as I do. I've never had my HHKB empty on me, in all these years of use.
But now I've two, though… good job I got that HHKB carry case.
Aye, both my HHKBs came in their original box. One white Type-S, one regular black.
The Type-S I bought brand new from Amazon Japan in 2014, with 002's proxying assistance, in the same order as that PFU official dyesub set, and the official Happy Hacking HHKB carry case.
This black one I bought on Ebay from that seller Go-Kart shared. Cost me £127 and change. They describe their stock as "Opened – never used condition" which is accurate. The box is a little scruffy on the outside, like it's travelled a bit, but the HHKB came entirely wear free and spotless, its inner pastic wrapper opened but that's all. Perfectly reasonable.
Mind, my 2014 HHKB's box got a bit squeezed in rough luggage handling, so both my boxes look the same way! I keep the original controllers in them, and my swapped out caps.
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JCMax
- Location: United States
- Main keyboard: Unicomp New Model M
- Main mouse: Anker Vertical Mouse
- Favorite switch: Clciky-tactile
There's a good pic of the dust cover where I got it from here: https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/in ... ail&p=6745
I think it looks pretty sweet! I went with it because I think it will help out with not having to clean it as often. The dust cover I got for my New Model M sure does help. I want a dust cover for every one of my boards now!
Since I'm not moving my boards around a dust cover is more handy for me than the bag. Although I am thinking about getting the bag because I do want to use my HHKB for my work board at some point. That's the main reason I'm getting it (and why I wanted Silent Topre).
I think it looks pretty sweet! I went with it because I think it will help out with not having to clean it as often. The dust cover I got for my New Model M sure does help. I want a dust cover for every one of my boards now!
Since I'm not moving my boards around a dust cover is more handy for me than the bag. Although I am thinking about getting the bag because I do want to use my HHKB for my work board at some point. That's the main reason I'm getting it (and why I wanted Silent Topre).
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Palatino
- Location: England
- Main keyboard: Fluctuates.
- Main mouse: Of no interest.
- Favorite switch: Too early to tell.
02:27
05:37
Love it. A few hours of looking at something is all it takes to go from penny-watching prudence to all-out bells and whistles!Nevermind, just placed it! I also got a dust cover to go with it too!