Beam Spring 104+SSK Reproduction Project! First Batch In Stock, Shipping early next year after New Model F Project

[vyquad]

I think something like the pingmaster case shape might match what people here are asking for, given that it's got the slant and the pencil holder. But also I just really like the pingmaster.

I'd also like to add my support for ortholinear, since it seems there aren't that many people interested in JIS or a split shift/enter/backspace keyboard, ortholinear seems like my best bet for getting a lot of keys.

Wow you are right, the pingmaster really does fit it

[JCMax]

I think something like the pingmaster case shape might match what people here are asking for, given that it's got the slant and the pencil holder. But also I just really like the pingmaster.

I'd also like to add my support for ortholinear, since it seems there aren't that many people interested in JIS or a split shift/enter/backspace keyboard, ortholinear seems like my best bet for getting a lot of keys.

Wow you are right, the pingmaster really does fit it

Ditto after looking at the layout. The pic I looked at reminds me of the layout for the F107. Maybe add the 2x5 right-hand block and make it a battleship!

It would still be cool to see the case take inspiration from some of the other cases like for Beamsprings and Model M. Combine the best out of each. Same height, dimensions, slant, etc. But with tweaks to the shape.

[PRIPARA_PLAYER]

The main difference between the pingmaster case and F107 (other than one unfortunately being made out of plastic) is that the F107 (and also F62 and F77) have a centered depression for the main keyboard, whereas the pingmaster is level along the front like the big beamsprings. It's a minor difference but imo brings it closer to the beamspring aesthetic.

[Muirium]

As a many-years Kishsaver user, I'd say that's a major difference. My thumbs rest on that lip, it's by far the most user-facing part of the case. Much prefer it to a higher riding keyboard.

[PeterQuines]

5 to 8 degrees tilt seems reasonable to implement? I don't think acoustics would be affected by a few extra mm higher in the back side below the board though for beam springs. My beam spring originals have pretty thick feet and the back is much thicker than the front, so the cases appear to be tilted on the inside as well as the whole case itself being tilted.

What does everyone think about an IBM Model M style case with beam spring switches? Is that preferable to the classic beam spring case design?

That bit of tilt sounds great!

Personally, I much prefer something closer to the classic beam spring case design, like what you shared earlier (with some tweaks like adding a tilt, adjusting the proportions a bit, etc).

There are plenty of Model M style keyboards out there already, but practically no modern keyboards that look like the old beam springs, especially the IBM 3278 A02. If people don't like something that chonky, I also like the idea others have mentioned to do a more minimalist case like some of the old Symbolics keyboards or the new Keymacs.

[headphone_jack]

Am I the only one that hates the new case design? Look at that completely flat typing angle, zero incline means an exceptionally uncomfortable typing experience especially with high profile caps. Vastly prefer the "default" case, even though it still looks plain and uninteresting, because at least it would be functional then.

[inozenz]

Am I the only one that hates the new case design? Look at that completely flat typing angle, zero incline means an exceptionally uncomfortable typing experience especially with high profile caps. Vastly prefer the "default" case, even though it still looks plain and uninteresting, because at least it would be functional then.

no, thats why i wont go for a repro beamer. And i find the "new" design is just horrible visually.

[marcuso]

What about a slanted metal case design like the keymacs? (with smoothed edges)

+1 for this; Elegant and ergonomic (although, could need a "palm warmer" mod for those in cold climates)

[Ellipse]

These are all nice case designs - keep them coming! Eventually we probably have to narrow them down to a few main options and maybe several more low quantity CNC milled ones where each case may cost several hundred dollars extra due to tooling, only paid by those interested in the specific design.

The two main decisions are which layouts to offer and in which cases to offer them.

So far in terms of layouts, I have seen the most amount of interest in 122, 104, TKL, 60%, and Split Ergonomic. Within the 104 and TKL there is discussion of different bottom row options that include 1.25U or 1.5U keys. ISO is definitely a top layout request. HHKB style had some small amount of interest. Given the individual modules are the largest cost outside of the case and tooling, the 122 may have extra cost while a 60% might be offered at a lower cost relative to the 104.

In terms of cases there are options for a blended version of the original beam spring cases in one group and more modern looking cases in another group.

[arcanius]

My two cents come from zero expertise, but I think that a big part of the success of the F62 & F77 is that their layouts were, for the most part, universally usable. We see this demand in vintage markets too; we'd all daily an F XT if it had a better layout.

I think I'll appreciate a beam spring keyboard that I can keep as my daily driver, use for the bits of typing and gaming that I do, but also as a functional layout that I can use for daily tasks, shortcuts, etc.
I think a split version would be heavenly, but only for a smaller part of the community.
I think an F122 would be equally awesome, especially considering the magnitude and epicness of this project. I'm not sure that it would have as much universality (especially if it's F122-sized) as a TKL or 104.

And I say this wishing it were an F77 with a function row.

WRT case design, I can't even give two cents. As long as it's sturdy.

[Ellipse]

Question for all the coders (cross posted from the Model F project thread as it applies to both projects):

Is anyone up for helping move the Model F QMK/Via/Vial project to the new Raspberry Pi RP2040 chip over the coming weeks? Recently the ATMEGA chips have become nearly impossible to find in quantity due to the chip shortage, which means it's probably time to switch over to the RP2040 for the capacitive keyboard controllers. After it is up and running I would like to secure the RP2040 chips soon before they may run out too, so that the final round and beam spring second round will not be delayed.

It seems like QMK support is in progress but not yet completed for the RP2040, and there are other projects like KMK which seem to work with the RP2040. The question is, is it better to go with KMK? How stable is it? It may take a while for QMK RP2040 support to be ready. Some recent related links:
https://golem.hu/guide/kmk-firmware/
https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyb ... igning_if/
https://github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware/pull/14877
https://github.com/KarlK90/qmk_firmware ... 40-support
https://github.com/KarlK90/qmk_firmware ... rollers.md
https://github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware/issues/11649
https://github.com/pimoroni/pmk-circuitpython
https://www.reddit.com/r/olkb/comments/ ... _the_pico/
https://github.com/vladantrhlik/VT-40
https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyb ... _firmware/
https://github.com/KMKfw/kmk_firmware

What would it take to get the Model F firmware working on the RP2040 chip? Would the xwhatsit wcass controller require an updated design for the RP2040 to work?

[eppicshotgun12]

For the interest form, as long as you submitted the form you should be fine - no need to submit again as that will double count things. There is no email confirmation that is sent after completing the form.

For the additional layouts with split keys: different top inner assembly, PCB, and inner foam parts would be required due to the MX stems generally being in the center of the key, even for different key sizes, to my knowledge. The Model F design allowed for these keys to be split without extra parts, with one exception of the HHKB style split right shift.

I guess the question would be for those folks interested in non-ANSI/ISO standard layouts: would they be willing to split the additional tooling costs for the unique parts. It may be several hundred dollars extra per person on top of these boards which are already costly to produce.

I'm sorry if I'm missing something but I'm assuming you're going to reach out via email after you've finished with the Model F project? I was going to buy an F77 when I noticed the deadline but then I stumbled upon the Beam Spring project and submitted the interest form right away. I really like how the case looks with its massive pencil tray and I'm super stoked to see how this turns out!

[eppicshotgun12]

What about a slanted metal case design like the keymacs? (with smoothed edges)

+1 for this; Elegant and ergonomic (although, could need a "palm warmer" mod for those in cold climates)

Something like this with a pencil shelf would be pretty cool IMO.

[Ellipse]

Glad you've signed up and yes confirmed eppicshotgun12 - I need to get through the Model F backlog before the beam spring stuff and will email those on the interest form when ready.

[eppicshotgun12]

…

1. The included key caps look like double shot SA profile. SA is a far cry from the sphericals that originally shipped on these boards. MT3 is a better approximation.

…

I desperately want spherical keycaps. I just love the feel of that profile. I’ve been trying to find some compatible with my buckling spring keyboards (the ones from Ellipse) but no luck. Hopefully someone will produce spherical caps for this new beam spring project.

I was toying with the idea of casting custom resin caps, spherical ones specifically, using the stem from a two-part cap as a base. Unfortunately, I'm in a college dorm so I don't have nearly enough space to undertake a project like that. I was also thinking about trying to adapt Cherry caps to Buckling Spring stems but found that the cap would be lifted up way too high and would leave a nasty gap between the bottom of the cap and the top of the case. I know Keymacs casts his own caps and even makes double-shots from resin for his keyboards, it's super involved but im sure someone could replicate the original BS caps with cherry mounts in a similar fashion.

[dfischer429]

What about a slanted metal case design like the keymacs? (with smoothed edges)

+1 for this; Elegant and ergonomic (although, could need a "palm warmer" mod for those in cold climates)

Something like this with a pencil shelf would be pretty cool IMO.

I really like this design, and I like the draft proposed by Ellipse as well. Perhaps some combination of the two, with the rounded edges and pencil shelf that pay homage to the original design with the steeper typing angle and reduced bulk of the keymacs style case.

[RikiGuitarist]

What about a slanted metal case design like the keymacs? (with smoothed edges)

Although this looks very sleek and elegant, I don't think it would be a universal fit for everyone.

It has a built in wrist rest, and if someone doesn't like how it feels, or makes their typing experience uncomfortable or painful over extended periods, there's no way of changing that without changing the case. Also for people who want to use their own wrist rest, or dislike any kind of wrist rest, this is also a bad design.

I'm also concerned about the fixed angle for people who prefer a flatter keyboard.

If this design was among other options that's more neutral in terms of the degree of tilt, and nothing interfering with the wrists, I wouldn't mind this being another option. But if this is the only choice, I would like to have something else that let's people adjust their own tilt and wrist area.

[eppicshotgun12]

I've been thinking about cases lately and honestly, I really like Ellipse's design he posted on page 8. I know some people don't like it but my vote goes to this one.

FQmT4PfUYAA6VYG.jpg (242.39 KiB) Viewed 6639 times

[Versa]

I vote pingmaster! I'm so looking forward to this

[eppicshotgun12]

I forgot to mention it on the interest form because I didn't know it was going to be offered but I just wanna express my interest in an ISO layout board.

[KJHawkinson]

I've been following the Model F reproductions for a while. I have ordered one myself and am looking forward to using it once it's arrived.

This Beam Spring project is really amazing and I've signed up for this list as well. I'm looking forward to the round 2 case and I personally like the idea of something reminiscent of the classic Beam Spring cases so I think that the 3d renders the Ellipse posted are really on the right track.

The one change I would make to the current 3d render is to maybe add a bit of a curve on the bottom of the case. I know that not all vintage Beam Spring keyboards have this curve but it seems to go along well with the look of the originals.

Beam Spring Curve.PNG (1.05 MiB) Viewed 6509 times

As for the key layout I feel that aesthetically the 96 key modern layout most closely resembles the look of some of the vintage Beam Spring keyboards. Especially since the Function keys on the 96 key layout are not spaced apart from the other keys and because the numpad butts up against the main keys a bit more closely. The 96 key also keeps most of the functionality of a modern 104 key layout. Here is an example with the MT3 Susuwatari keycaps.

96 Key.PNG (949.88 KiB) Viewed 6509 times

Neither of these images are my own. I'm just using them here for example.

Either way, this project is amazing! Just wanted to give my input.

[eppicshotgun12]

I've been following the Model F reproductions for a while. I have ordered one myself and am looking forward to using it once it's arrived.

This Beam Spring project is really amazing and I've signed up for this list as well. I'm looking forward to the round 2 case and I personally like the idea of something reminiscent of the classic Beam Spring cases so I think that the 3d renders the Ellipse posted are really on the right track.

The one change I would make to the current 3d render is to maybe add a bit of a curve on the bottom of the case. I know that not all vintage Beam Spring keyboards have this curve but it seems to go along well with the look of the originals.
Beam Spring Curve.PNG

As for the key layout I feel that aesthetically the 96 key modern layout most closely resembles the look of some of the vintage Beam Spring keyboards. Especially since the Function keys on the 96 key layout are not spaced apart from the other keys and because the numpad butts up against the main keys a bit more closely. The 96 key also keeps most of the functionality of a modern 104 key layout. Here is an example with the MT3 Susuwatari keycaps.
96 Key.PNG

Neither of these images are my own. I'm just using them here for example.

Either way, this project is amazing! Just wanted to give my input.

I agree on adding some more curves to the case, as for the layout, I don't exactly know how I feel about anything other than a full-size ANSI or ISO as I daily drive an ANSI Model M and my other favorite keyboard was also a full-size. I do agree that it would aesthetically match but I'm not so sure about it ergonomically, at least for me.

[Shihatsu]

As a Model F customer I wanted to wait on the F before I jump ship. Like "let's first see if the random guy from the internet actually delivers after I gave him quite an amount of money, lets check the quality". O boy did he deliver, so here I am.
I will read all the discussion later on, just wanted to drop in an yell "COUNT ME IN" and "SHUT UP ND TAKE MY MONEY".

[digital_matthew]

I too would like a "navclusterless" keyboard like the one JCMax posted since the nav cluster maps nicely onto the numpad . The 5X2 block on the left would be cool too, but not totally necessary.

[JCMax]

I am really fine with the original case that Ellipse posted. Yeah, some subtle improvements wouldn't hurt, like how the lip could be a bit rounder and maybe more of a slant from back to front, but it's pretty much right there for me.

I have decided for my final suggestion:
Case Design: Ellipse's posted design (some sort of derivation)
Layout: The CoolerMaster Quickfire 10 key-less nav-num cluster, 2x5 block to the left of the main body.

Also maybe some customization options for the 2x5 block and the nav-num cluster keys. I'm talking about the buttons and not just the key-mappings. So if there is slight tweak to what key combinations are on the nav-num cluster, they can be programmed in and have custom key-caps printed for them. (I am willing to spend on the extra cost if it's not too bad).

Other than that the rest of the layout can be just like with a regular board, complete with F-row keys at the top.

[eppicshotgun12]

Am I the only one that thinks a 20 key numpad would be pretty cool? I know Chyros would approve, and if we were to go with a nav-less layout it would be nice to have the extra buttons. Maybe have the alphanumeric keys, 3x5 nav cluster, 20 key numpad?

[JCMax]

It would be very cool. Especially with macro options. But how expensive that would make it?

[eppicshotgun12]

There is already a 3x5 nav cluster on the render on page 8 so I hope that makes it into the final design and honestly I would be fine with that. Basically an ISO Beam Spring Pingmaster lovechild with modern F keys is my ideal keyboard. Idk how much it would cost to have it laid out with a 20 key num pad cause with how the stabs are, the PCB would have to be different between the normal and expanded to keep proper cherry keycap compatibility.

[Ellipse]

Regarding pricing for additional layouts, my expectation is that it would cost a couple thousand dollars in tooling for each unique layout involving a different number of keys. The key (!) would be finding folks willing to split the tooling costs as noted before - for example if the tooling cost $2k extra then you could have 10 people paying $200 more each, or 20 paying $100 more each. It is definitely tough as these boards are already costly to make.

[Rezkian]

Fine by me! Desperate for ISO! It should be worth it as a potential endgame.

Regarding pricing for additional layouts, my expectation is that it would cost a couple thousand dollars in tooling for each unique layout involving a different number of keys. The key (!) would be finding folks willing to split the tooling costs as noted before - for example if the tooling cost $2k extra then you could have 10 people paying $200 more each, or 20 paying $100 more each. It is definitely tough as these boards are already costly to make.