F104+SSK+122+62+77+50+Ergo orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards

[Bryo4321]

There are about 1255 ordered keyboards remaining to ship (about 3800 new Model F keyboards have been ordered in total so far for this project). My expectation remains as before, that I can expect to move through the rest of the backlog in May, June, and July.

Thank you for this update Ellipse. I’ve been watching this thread like a hawk since I ordered a few years ago. I’m so darn excited to get my hands on this thing! Thanks for all the hard work, I can’t imagine the ride this has been for you!

[robo]

At long last received my F77 - installed all the keys as per instructions and am enjoying it a lot for the most part.

It definitely looks even better in person than in the photos.

Had a few initial problems with a couple keys not clicking which I eventually resolved by removing and reseating springs, and slightly bindy wide keys (left shift and enter) which are improved by pinching in the key stems as recommended.

Still have one issue, which is that when typing capital F's (left shift + F) I often just get lower case - ie. the left-shift immediately followed by the F key doesn't seem to work reliably - I have to give it a a little more time than normal for the shift key to register.

Is this is a known issue, and is there a fix that doesn't involve getting into firmware?

Second issue is perhaps more of a QC one, but my space bar is somewhat warped - will contact Ellipse directly about that one.

[Ellipse]

Please check one of my recent posts about tightening up the controller grounding to improve key sequence issues. Also unplugging, waiting 15 minutes, and plugging back in one time also seems to permanently fix the issue for some people.

Yes unfortunately PBT's uneven shrinkage when cooling does result in the large keys like the space bar being slightly warped - this is normal.

[robo]

Please check one of my recent posts about tightening up the controller grounding to improve key sequence issues. Also unplugging, waiting 15 minutes, and plugging back in one time also seems to permanently fix the issue for some people.

Thx, found the post: viewtopic.php?p=503154#p503154
Will give that a try.

Yes unfortunately PBT's uneven shrinkage when cooling does result in the large keys like the space bar being slightly warped - this is normal.

Hmm, i this something that could be fixed with a hair dryer and careful flexing or is that likely to lead to diaster?

[NathanA]

Is there anybody here with an F62/F77 + Solenoid who would be willing to flash the most recent build of Vial that I've made and give it a try, specifically with an eye toward evaluating how well the solenoid works with this firmware vs. the stock ones, and then report back here?

There were past reports from solenoid users who tried my Vial hex files and noted that the solenoid responsiveness was not as good. This despite the fact that I added exactly the same solenoid code tweaks and default settings as Ellipse does & recommends in his QMK build instructions..it should be literally the same code. Since I don't have a solenoid, however, I can't test myself and just have third-party reports to go on.

I am wondering if the poor performance in the past might've been due to me using an outdated compiler/toolchain that was merely generating less efficient code. These latest hex files were generated after I updated my build environment, so it would be interesting to see if these perform better for people.

If you do test these, please first flash the included eeprom_eraser.hex file, wait a few seconds, then reboot (unplug/replug) the keyboard, and then finally flash the appropriate hex file for your keyboard model. This will eliminate the possibility that old settings stored in EEPROM from the previous firmware is unduly influencing the firmware behavior. (For all I know, this might be the whole explanation for people's past experiences.)

Thank you!

[Starbag]

Hey all, our online QMK configurator is having some headache during "compile". It wouldn't compile even the default layout but display error messages as follow:

boto3.exceptions.S3UploadFailedError: Failed to upload qmk_firmware/xwhatsit-brand_new_model_f-f62-wcass-default_6523a7c.json to qmk/0764dedd-6be3-4938-aad0-2903954522b7/xwhatsit-brand_new_model_f-f62-wcass-default_6523a7c.json: An error occurred (XMinioStorageFull) when calling the PutObject operation: Storage backend has reached its minimum free disk threshold. Please delete a few objects to proceed.

Is there anything I am missing while using it?
Thank you very much.

[NathanA]

Is there anything I am missing while using it?

I don't think so. I've used it in the past and it's worked for me. I just tried it and get the same error that you reported.

"Storage backend has reached its minimum free disk threshold. Please delete a few objects to proceed." << this sounds to me like whatever server or VM this instance of the QMK Configurator is installed on is now out of disk space.

I'm not 100% sure who runs this instance, but my impression was always that this was set up by pandrew. It appears to be running within an AWS instance. Regardless, whoever has administrative access to this host is the only person who is going to be able to do anything about this.

[andrewjoy]

Oh my god , I just got my shipping notice !!!!

Also hi everyone.

[Muirium]

I hear Her Majesty’s Customs and Excise is throwing a party at your expense. Woo! Good luck!

[Seph]

Hi guys,

Just received my F77, and it's working as expected over all.

However, the top rightmost key of the main section of the keyboard doesn't register anything. In the signal level monitor, I can see a big change in the value when the key is pressed, but the keypress monitor shows a threshold value of 0, and doesn't react when the key is pressed. How do I remedy this?

[Ellipse]

I wanted to share a nice photo of a full size 101 key Industrial Model M with the Industrial SSK 12 key set - one of the first photos I have seen of this combination:

https://www.reddit.com/r/modelm/comment ... ived_from/

Seph that is odd that just one key shows a 0 threshold value. Maybe the flipper was stuck while activated, when the keyboard was first connected?

[NathanA]

However, the top rightmost key of the main section of the keyboard doesn't register anything. In the signal level monitor, I can see a big change in the value when the key is pressed, but the keypress monitor shows a threshold value of 0, and doesn't react when the key is pressed.

Seph that is odd that just one key shows a 0 threshold value. Maybe the flipper was stuck while activated, when the keyboard was first connected?

If a key is held down while calibration happens (when first plugged in), it will show a super-high threshold number, not 0.

Seph, you say "the top rightmost key of the main section", not "Backspace". What exact layout are you using? Is this the stock firmware (out-of-the-box) that you are running or did you flash a different one, and if a different one, which one did you flash?

[Scarpia]

MY KEYCAPS ARRIVED!

I’m so excited, and happy that everything seems to be correct despite it being a fairly complicated order that I changed multiple times, not to mention the fact that I’ve moved twice since 2016 when I put in my order.

Thank you again Ellipse! Now I can finally put its temporary keycaps back on the SSK where they came from.

[daedalus]

Has anyone run into issues with keys being transposed? I have an issue with the spacebar where everyone once in a while, the space and the next key I type get swapped around (Fore xample, liket his) It doesn't happen every time, but often enough for it to not be a conicidence.

I noticed this after I opened up the keyboard assembly to fix a flipped which was not clicking correctly. It could be that I messed up the reassembly, but it seems to me more like a firmware issue... has anyone else seen this?

[sedevidi]

Has anyone run into issues with keys being transposed? I have an issue with the spacebar where everyone once in a while, the space and the next key I type get swapped around (Fore xample, liket his) It doesn't happen every time, but often enough for it to not be a conicidence.

I noticed this after I opened up the keyboard assembly to fix a flipped which was not clicking correctly. It could be that I messed up the reassembly, but it seems to me more like a firmware issue... has anyone else seen this?

Sounds like a grounding issue, as Ellipse stated a few posts ago.

[andrewjoy]

I hear Her Majesty’s Customs and Excise is throwing a party at your expense. Woo! Good luck!

Don't remind me. Bloody extortion it was it is .

[daedalus]

Has anyone run into issues with keys being transposed? I have an issue with the spacebar where everyone once in a while, the space and the next key I type get swapped around (Fore xample, liket his) It doesn't happen every time, but often enough for it to not be a conicidence.

I noticed this after I opened up the keyboard assembly to fix a flipped which was not clicking correctly. It could be that I messed up the reassembly, but it seems to me more like a firmware issue... has anyone else seen this?

Sounds like a grounding issue, as Ellipse stated a few posts ago.

Derp, completely missed that - thanks for the reply.

[sje]

So I have my new F77 and have issues I can't seem to solve. Running an Intel Mac.

• Keyboard detected on USB
  Detects in QMK Toolbox
  Detects in VIA
  But I cannot get it detected by the mac keyboard configurator (it will not recognise any keys)
  None of the keyboard testers (Via, QMK Toolbox) detect keys
  Cannot get it into bootloader mode Both Shifts+B does nothing
  QMK toolbox shows the "Brand New Model F Keyboard F77" connecting and disconnecting when I plug/unplug - but key tester does not register keys
  VIA shows key mappings etc, but key tester does not register keys
  IBM Capsense says "No Controller Found"
  Pandrew utility does not detect any devices.

I am out of ideas and would really appreciate some guidance here.

Cheers

[NathanA]

So I have my new F77 and have issues I can't seem to solve.

Let me guess: you received your keyboard, it was working, THEN you flashed a VIA hex file to it, and that's when the problems started?

And you perhaps haven't read the last 2 pages' or so worth of posts to this thread?

And I'm also guessing that you downloaded the ZIP archive of hex files *before* this past weekend, rather than downloading a fresh copy right before flashing?

I wish there was some form of making a "sticky" post to these threads that ALL readers could not possibly miss. Then perhaps this would stop happening to people.

The short version: if you have a keyboard that shipped & arrived to you this year (2022), and if you downloaded the ZIP archive of firmware hex files prior to April 30, then the VIA firmwares included in that ZIP archive are not compatible with your keyboard. The controller received a minor hardware revision to it mid-production, and controllers that Ellipse manufactured after November 2021 need updated firmware for them to actually work properly. The QMK firmwares got updated. Through an oversight, the VIA ones didn't.

Ellipse corrected this in late April. If you downloaded the ZIP file before he posted his update, you have "soft-bricked" your keyboard. As long as it is running the incompatible firmware, it will not be able to detect keystrokes.

You will now need to open up your keyboard, unscrew the controller from the back plate, flip it over, find the two pads marked "PROG", jumper them together with a paperclip, plug the USB cable into the computer while they are jumpered, and then you will be back in flash/DFU/bootloader mode, able to correct the mistake.

Also, you should be made aware that the IBM Capsense utility can only talk to a keyboard controller running the original xwhatsit firmware, not QMK or any variant thereof (which includes VIA). Furthermore, the pandrew utility is incompatible with VIA firmwares. Thus it is normal that neither of those utilities are able to detect your keyboard while it is flashed with VIA.

[sje]

So after waiting 4 years for my keyboard I received one manufactured in 2020. I followed the instructions to the letter including darkcruix summary and screenshots. I downloaded the hex files yesterday. The fact this does not have a”fail safe” beyond having to open up is Terrible design.

I challenge anyone new to this to dig through the morass of contrasting and convoluted instructions In this thread and the confusing instructions and make sense of things. I have been a long term advocate of this project but the “last mile” could have been done better.

[Ellipse]

sje did you redownload the latest firmware files from the project web site - manual, or did you use a previously downloaded hex file? As an update the latest zip file fixes some issues related to Via.

If you follow the instructional firmware video and instructions in the project web site manual step by step, there are no issues with the latest firmware.

Also as noted before, the sticker label print date does not correspond to the manufacture or assembly date. I print labels in batches. These third container ship keyboards going out this year were made last year.

[sje]

The files were downloaded from the user manual site and the bucklinspring site. I can’t recall which I used. I downloaded the, both yesterday. The label should show the actual date otherwise it creates misleading situations as the data indicated is wrong.

The video is not helpful if you don’t run a windows machine as it uses steps I can’t do that way on Mac.

After hard reset and some fiddling it is finally working. Hardware is stunning, but can I recommend you get a technical writer to completely rework the instructions? The fact a lot of folks have issues means it can be clearer.

[NathanA]

The files were downloaded from the user manual site and the bucklinspring site. I can’t recall which I used.

This likely explains it. bucklingspring.com is darkcruix's site. I just visited it & went to the VIA download section, and his files are dated March 2021. So he hasn't updated his copies of VIA that he makes and distributes in some time. So his copies surely wouldn't be compatible with the latest controller revision.

[planedrop]

Hoping I can get a bit of help with my solenoid configuration on the F62, really happy with the sound so far but it seems to have a lot of trouble keeping up with my typing speed, and so half of every word I type just doesn't acuate it. Is this related to dwell time or is this potentially related to something else? Would shortening the solenoid extend distance help with this at all?

Goona be honest solenoids is where my knowledge of anything keyboard related completely falls flat, so apologies if this is a rather obvious thing.

[nickgiobbi]

Hello all, I read through the forum posts and I don't think this was posted previously, but apologies if it has been already.

I've soft-bricked my F77 the same way some of you have I guess...I now see the updates reading through these posts on how to load Via without soft-bricking. But I've tried and tried to use the PROG short to get the keyboard to "unbrick", and I can't get it to reset.

does someone mind helping me with some more details on how to do it properly, like time to maintain the short, what to plug the USB into if not a motherboard USB port, or anything else that the more seasoned of you might think I'm doing wrong? Any advice would be great. I was so excited to get the board and now I'm so sad to look at it I might cry...

[NathanA]

But I've tried and tried to use the PROG short to get the keyboard to "unbrick", and I can't get it to reset.

does someone mind helping me with some more details on how to do it properly, like time to maintain the short, what to plug the USB into if not a motherboard USB port, or anything else that the more seasoned of you might think I'm doing wrong?

I think pandrew provided the best explanation in a recent post of his, which I'll quote here:

You need to short the PROG pads while plugging the device in. You need to find something low resistance to short the PROG pads with. You might think that a screwdriver is gonna be enough, but due to surface oxidation it is likely not gonna be good enough. I like to use sharp metal tweezers, because they can dig into the pad a little bit, breaking up the surface oxidation, and I can actually be sure it's shorting. Apply constant strong pressure on the pads while plugging in the keyboard to make sure they're perfectly shorted.

I've personally had the best success using a paperclip that's first been completely unwound/straightened, and then folded in half. Take the two ends, make sure they are both making good contact with the pad opposite the other, then plug in the USB cable into the computer. I like to do this while QMK Toolbox is running so that I can clearly see that it has worked & the controller has connected up to the computer in bootloader mode, and if it hasn't, I can then try again immediately. (Then again, I also prefer QMK Toolbox to the Atmel FLIP Java-based flasher.)

Ellipse, what do you think about editing the very first post of this thread, and adding a sentence or two of bold text at the top that warns people that if they've received their keyboard in 2022, they need to make sure that they have downloaded the most recent firmware before attempting a flash? I suspect some people will still glance over it, but some seeing & heeding it is probably better than none...

[pandrew]

Hey guys,

In the future if configurator fails consistently please PM me directly to restart it.
(If it fails just once it doesn't necessarily need a restart, sometimes it fixes itself after 2-3 tries)
This time looks like it accumulated a lot of temporary data in one of the containers, restarting it freed up 16GiB of disk space.

Hey all, our online QMK configurator is having some headache during "compile". It wouldn't compile even the default layout but display error messages as follow:

boto3.exceptions.S3UploadFailedError: Failed to upload qmk_firmware/xwhatsit-brand_new_model_f-f62-wcass-default_6523a7c.json to qmk/0764dedd-6be3-4938-aad0-2903954522b7/xwhatsit-brand_new_model_f-f62-wcass-default_6523a7c.json: An error occurred (XMinioStorageFull) when calling the PutObject operation: Storage backend has reached its minimum free disk threshold. Please delete a few objects to proceed.

Is there anything I am missing while using it?
Thank you very much.

[Seph]

However, the top rightmost key of the main section of the keyboard doesn't register anything. In the signal level monitor, I can see a big change in the value when the key is pressed, but the keypress monitor shows a threshold value of 0, and doesn't react when the key is pressed.

Seph that is odd that just one key shows a 0 threshold value. Maybe the flipper was stuck while activated, when the keyboard was first connected?

If a key is held down while calibration happens (when first plugged in), it will show a super-high threshold number, not 0.

Seph, you say "the top rightmost key of the main section", not "Backspace". What exact layout are you using? Is this the stock firmware (out-of-the-box) that you are running or did you flash a different one, and if a different one, which one did you flash?

I flashed a QMK layout. My keyboard has split backspace, so I have delete as the upper-rightmost key, with a small backspace to the left of it.

I wanted to share a nice photo of a full size 101 key Industrial Model M with the Industrial SSK 12 key set - one of the first photos I have seen of this combination:

https://www.reddit.com/r/modelm/comment ... ived_from/

Seph that is odd that just one key shows a 0 threshold value. Maybe the flipper was stuck while activated, when the keyboard was first connected?

Can't say for sure, but I don't think so. I've flashed a new QMK layout a few times now, wouldn't that have reset it?

[Ellipse]

NathanA good idea - I have updated the first post with the firmware note.

planedrop did you follow every step of the solenoid setup video and instructional notes on the project web site? Also are you using firmware downloaded directly from the project site or firmware generated from pandrew's QMK configurator web site beginning with 35.164? Take a look at the manual on the project web site for an explanation on the specifics of what to do.

[Bryo4321]

Got my Model F yesterday. Some of the caps were a little finicky to get one, but everything otherwise seems to be in order. Absolutely gorgeous keyboard, and I think I might order another set of caps and a repair kit just in case. I am absolutely floored, it feels perfect! I haven’t noticed any flipper issues or shift key issues or anything of the sort fortunately.