Beam Spring 104+SSK Reproduction Project! First Batch In Stock, Shipping early next year after New Model F Project

[eppicshotgun12]

This is the sort of layout I would want. The functions of these keys aren't final yet but this is probably how I would have it set up.

ProposedBeamspringLayout.png (30.93 KiB) Viewed 8400 times

[Ellipse]

That kind of layout would require some tooling changes but not too much I'd guess - maybe just a slightly different top inner plate, PCB, and inner foam, and maybe top part of the case.

[eppicshotgun12]

I figured. I would be perfectly happy with a standard ISO layout too but if enough people are interested in my layout to get the tooling cost down I would be willing to pay the extra 100 or so. I know I saw a few people interested in a Pingmaster-type design.

[petermcd1010]

This is such a wonderful project.

I use an IBM 3278 as my daily driver. I have a spare pair of reading glasses on the lip and routinely use the lip for pens, screws, etc.. So I think if the case is going to extend beyond the F-keys toward the monitor, people will enjoy having a lip. Also, the lip may help keep dust and other material from entering the key mechanism, as the lip catches that material.

Personally, my dream would be an IBM 4978 with no lip or wrist rest like the 3278. I'm happy to pay more for the extra (relegendable?) keys plus part of tooling for a group buy, if others want to join.

[PRIPARA_PLAYER]

This would be my ideal layout with backspace/both shifts/enter split, I figure there might be more interest in this than JIS.

[Rezkian]

I agree about the lip! Do you happen to have the measurements for it? I was thinking about putting the ContourDesign roller mouse mobile in it.

This is such a wonderful project.

I use an IBM 3278 as my daily driver. I have a spare pair of reading glasses on the lip and routinely use the lip for pens, screws, etc.. So I think if the case is going to extend beyond the F-keys toward the monitor, people will enjoy having a lip. Also, the lip may help keep dust and other material from entering the key mechanism, as the lip catches that material.

Personally, my dream would be an IBM 4978 with no lip or wrist rest like the 3278. I'm happy to pay more for the extra (relegendable?) keys plus part of tooling for a group buy, if others want to join.

[petermcd1010]

The 3278 lip is 2" of flat space (angled slightly up toward the monitor) and then about 0.5" of curve as it heads up toward the top row of keys. The keyboard is 18.75" wide, btw.

[Shihatsu]

This is the sort of layout I would want. The functions of these keys aren't final yet but this is probably how I would have it set up. ProposedBeamspringLayout.png

I#d kill for this. Not a living beeing, but I would destroy some keyboards as gift to the old gods and the new to get this in all Beamspring Glory. Great to see some ISO love!

[vyquad]

im locked in on the idea that it looks like a pingmaster

[Julito]

It’s long shot but a Focus layout with a big ass enter and a split right shift would be awesome

I'd pay double for a focus layout like that

[thefarside]

It’s long shot but a Focus layout with a big ass enter and a split right shift would be awesome

I'd pay double for a focus layout like that

The only problem using a focus layout might be trying to get an enter key (I’m not sure if there are many Mx mount big ass enter options) and any stabilizers needed. I thought about pursuing it further but didn’t think there would be enough interest. If a few people are interested I can pursue it further just let me know.

[eppicshotgun12]

It’s long shot but a Focus layout with a big ass enter and a split right shift would be awesome

I'd pay double for a focus layout like that

The only problem using a focus layout might be trying to get an enter key (I’m not sure if there are many Mx mount big ass enter options) and any stabilizers needed. I thought about pursuing it further but didn’t think there would be enough interest. If a few people are interested I can pursue it further just let me know.

Tai-Hao makes MX big ass enter keys but im not sure what profile it is and they only come in a few colors.

[Ellipse]

When folks note their interest in a 122 key keyboard, is their specific interest in the exact historical 122-key terminal models with the 24 bunched-together function keys, 5-key cursor design, etc.

Or is it primarily a request for the ability to have more keys than on a standard ~104 key keyboard? 12 extra keys on the top and 10 extra keys on the left side for function keys/custom keys, etc.

Personally I would like a 122 key beam spring keyboard that resembles the Model M 101-key layout but with the extra 12 keys above the 12 function keys, 10 keys on the left which I can use for custom keys (Explorer, media playback, start menu, etc.), the keys between Ctrl and Alt of course, and 3 keys above the Insert/Home/Page Up keys for Print Screen, Scroll Lock, and Pause/Break. I'm not sure if this updated layout would have too much interest.

[daedalus]

For me personally, one of the constraints is making sure that the layout is supported by common Cherry keycap sets. There's not too many keycap sets out there which have enough caps for a 122-key layout.

[Ellipse]

Measurement help requested - original beam spring cases:

For folks who have beam spring keyboards other than the 3278 can you provide measurements or drawings (a photo of a handwritten drawing would be fine) of the side profiles and size of the bezels around the top, bottom, left, and right of the keys? I ask because I only own the 3278 models.

I'd like to get the proportions right in the proposed designs.

I'd request the radius of the curves (one can approximate by measuring a straight line cross section of the curved part of the case), the side profile heights at various points, and the overall length.

Since IBM appears to have designed in inches and fractions of an inch please provide the measurements as such if possible.

If easier to provide the numbers that is fine, or if easier to draw something not to scale and mark the distances that would be good too.

[urgh]

Personally I would like a 122 key beam spring keyboard that resembles the Model M 101-key layout but with the extra 12 keys above the 12 function keys, 10 keys on the left which I can use for custom keys (Explorer, media playback, start menu, etc.), the keys between Ctrl and Alt of course, and 3 keys above the Insert/Home/Page Up keys for Print Screen, Scroll Lock, and Pause/Break. I'm not sure if this updated layout would have too much interest.

That is exactly what I want - modern 104 layout with extra keys. Plus nav cluster doesn't make much sense in 2022.

[JCMax]

If I had to go with battleship, it would probably be that also. A 122 key layout modified from a Model M-101. And if I went with a minimalist layout it would be the HHKB, like the F77 HHKB layout in the Model F project.

This may have been brought up before but what about a design/layout like the Dactyl Manuform? It would be a great option and I hope it's possible. But I think the cost would be PHENOMENAL!!! It's not likely to get enough support. That's why I've got it at "0" below.

0) Dactyl Manuform
1) Coolermaster Quickfire TKL layout
2) HHKB
3) 122-key Battleship (Model M inspired)

[Ellipse]

What do folks think about the new beam spring LED overlays? They will be Model M spec so that they can be used on the original Model M keyboards too (maybe if you use the new Model F project keys on a Model M or are custom adding overlays to the F77/F62?). A big thanks to Zed for creating these overlays.

In the coming weeks I expect the factory to start production on these. It may be possible to offer additional designs if there are any suggestions, but not sure yet. There may be a limit of designs so not all of the below designs may be produced.

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[Hak Foo]

Personally I would like a 122 key beam spring keyboard that resembles the Model M 101-key layout but with the extra 12 keys above the 12 function keys, 10 keys on the left which I can use for custom keys (Explorer, media playback, start menu, etc.), the keys between Ctrl and Alt of course, and 3 keys above the Insert/Home/Page Up keys for Print Screen, Scroll Lock, and Pause/Break. I'm not sure if this updated layout would have too much interest.

That is exactly what I want - modern 104 layout with extra keys. Plus nav cluster doesn't make much sense in 2022.

That's all but exactly what I did for my home-build battleship. Except I did 15 extra keys on the top row (matching print/scroll lock/pause) This offers a big space in the top left which could be used for extra keys or a rotary encoder.

[pandrew]

@Ellipse: NICE, I love the fact that now we have someone else (other than Unicomp) producing additional overlay designs!

Of all the presented options, I think the new beamsprings would best fit option D3. (because it's not too-in-your face, and all-caps matches the all-caps on other keys, such as PAUSE)

overlay_on_keyboard.jpg (38.78 KiB) Viewed 7464 times

But maybe I would reduce the contrast even more a little bit, here I set opacity of the overlay to 40%, effectively reducing contrast:

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When it comes to additional designs, I would also love to have available one that matches exactly the original IBM M13 led overlay design. These would be usable for the new beamspring keyboards too, but it would also be possible to use these to refurbish original IBM M13 keyboards. Unicomp doesn't sell this, so there's currently nowhere to source these:

black_m13_locklight_sticker.jpg (84.82 KiB) Viewed 7464 times

Note that the black M13 overlays have black borders with very-dark grey insides. The very dark grey is so dark, that it's almost looks all-black when viewed from a distance.

Another design that I would like to see is top-aligned leds but with original IBM style. Let me explain, as you may know, current Unicomp full-size keyboards have top-aligned led lights:

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unicomp_overlay_2.jpg (11.34 KiB) Viewed 7464 times

Unicomp sells a couple overlay variants for these, but none try to look like original Model M overlays.

unicomp_alternatives.jpg (29.77 KiB) Viewed 7464 times

About a year and a half ago I drew up a couple ideas for the purpose of discussion:

top_aligned_led_overlays.jpg (142.72 KiB) Viewed 7464 times

Note: P3 is the original IBM overlay.
I personally liked P6, and P2 the most, and I think people overall gravitated towards P6 on chat.
Also would be great to have the P6 layout, but with black IBM M13 colors.

[Johnbo]

When folks note their interest in a 122 key keyboard, is their specific interest in the exact historical 122-key terminal models with the 24 bunched-together function keys, 5-key cursor design, etc.

Or is it primarily a request for the ability to have more keys than on a standard ~104 key keyboard?

I believe I mentioned it earlier in the thread, but yes ideally I'd prefer a standard 104 layout plus extras.

I'm not sure exactly how the plates work, would it be possible to split some of the 2U keys into separate 1U keys? For example I'd love the numpad to be all 1U keys, but that's not a deal breaker.

Basically, more or less standard 104 layout as a starting point, and then IMO the more keys you add on the better. 10 keys to the left, 12 extra function keys, more numpad / nav keys, etc. all are useful for me.

[cloudhax]

for a 122 I would ideally want basically like an ansi-modded f122 battleship

[Ellipse]

Here are some updated photos of the draft beam spring 104 style design. The overall case design is unchanged for the time being.

I would certainly appreciate any of the side profile measurements on the various beam spring cases other than the 3278 which I own. The goal is to have some cases inspired by the profiles and designs of various IBM cases, assuming the mold exterior parts can somehow be combined to keep costs reasonable (then it would just require different mold cores).

My first IBM style design posted a couple months ago was a combination of some IBM cases but I'm thinking maybe I should just do one case for each main variety (5251, 3278, 3101, maybe the 66 key beam spring?).

Of course of we go with a mold instead of CNC milled, the bent tabs for the top case would be removed and you would not see them. The top and bottom case would be assembled with posts on the inside of the top case.

Below are some details on the beam case design, to be more in line with the originals.

Top case (now at an angle as requested)
.....Top inner assembly ("TIA")
..........Inner foam
..........Beam Module
..........PCB
..........Foam or rubber sheet below the entire PCB
.....Bottom inner assembly ("BIA")
Bottom case

Notes on the PCB: the PCB is secured to the top+bottom inner assembly in a different way from round 1. The PCB touches the area where the top+bottom inner assembly are screwed together. To avoid issues, because the metal inner assembly cannot touch the PCB, on the top side, there is a small mylar strip glued or taped to the top inner assembly as you would see with the original IBM beam spring keyboards. On the bottom side of the PCB, the large foam mat has some holes in it for the screws so that the PCB does not contact the metal parts. The PCB and foam pieces are not shown in the photos (you can see a gap where the PCB would go, in between TIA and BIA.

The new TIA has slightly larger holes in the TIA, so that the modules will not fit into place. This will make assembly less secure - the beam modules will not be securely installed in place in the TIA; instead they will only be secure when the inner assembly is completed. Before then, the beam modules can be easily moved out of place. The reason for this is to reduce the contact between TIA and the beam module, in order to reduce the sound (that is why a foam is added). The foam allows a reduction in the noise of the mechanism. The goal is to eliminate the ringing sound when typing. This part was not in the previous beam design. The colors shown are all false colors designed to maximize visibility/contrast of the various parts. I expect the TIA to be black and BIA to be the same IBM gold type finish.

Screws: Case screws will be hex countersunk/flat top, 6-32, 1/2". Inner assembly screws will be standard + Phillips, the same used with the F62/F77. The TIA has holes and the BIA has threaded holes. The threaded holes are not shown in the photos.

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[aidanic]

Here are some updated photos of the draft beam spring 104 style design. The overall case design is unchanged for the time being.

I would certainly appreciate any of the side profile measurements on the various beam spring cases other than the 3278 which I own. The goal is to have some cases inspired by the profiles and designs of various IBM cases, assuming the mold exterior parts can somehow be combined to keep costs reasonable (then it would just require different mold cores).

My first IBM style design posted a couple months ago was a combination of some IBM cases but I'm thinking maybe I should just do one case for each main variety (5251, 3278, 3101, maybe the 66 key beam spring?).

Of course of we go with a mold instead of CNC milled, the bent tabs for the top case would be removed and you would not see them. The top and bottom case would be assembled with posts on the inside of the top case.

Below are some details on the beam case design, to be more in line with the originals.

Top case (now at an angle as requested)
.....Top inner assembly ("TIA")
..........Inner foam
..........Beam Module
..........PCB
..........Foam or rubber sheet below the entire PCB
.....Bottom inner assembly ("BIA")
Bottom case

Notes on the PCB: the PCB is secured to the top+bottom inner assembly in a different way from round 1. The PCB touches the area where the top+bottom inner assembly are screwed together. To avoid issues, because the metal inner assembly cannot touch the PCB, on the top side, there is a small mylar strip glued or taped to the top inner assembly as you would see with the original IBM beam spring keyboards. On the bottom side of the PCB, the large foam mat has some holes in it for the screws so that the PCB does not contact the metal parts. The PCB and foam pieces are not shown in the photos (you can see a gap where the PCB would go, in between TIA and BIA.

The new TIA has slightly larger holes in the TIA, so that the modules will not fit into place. This will make assembly less secure - the beam modules will not be securely installed in place in the TIA; instead they will only be secure when the inner assembly is completed. Before then, the beam modules can be easily moved out of place. The reason for this is to reduce the contact between TIA and the beam module, in order to reduce the sound (that is why a foam is added). The foam allows a reduction in the noise of the mechanism. The goal is to eliminate the ringing sound when typing. This part was not in the previous beam design. The colors shown are all false colors designed to maximize visibility/contrast of the various parts. I expect the TIA to be black and BIA to be the same IBM gold type finish.

Screws: Case screws will be hex countersunk/flat top, 6-32, 1/2". Inner assembly screws will be standard + Phillips, the same used with the F62/F77. The TIA has holes and the BIA has threaded holes. The threaded holes are not shown in the photos.

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Hi, would it be possible to have a curved bottom like on original beamspring keyboards? I feel like that would make it look a lot more natural and less boxy.

[Vizir]

I am sure I've signed up on the Google Form, but is there any way to check? Will filling it out again erase the old answers and throw me back in the line?

What are the plans for making smaller version of the beamspring? In the hhkb or similar sized form factor?

edit: just saw the ergodox style case posted a few pages ago. any way to get that or similar split or even an ortho layout?

[ifohancroft]

I am sure I've signed up on the Google Form, but is there any way to check? Will filling it out again erase the old answers and throw me back in the line?

What are the plans for making smaller version of the beamspring? In the hhkb or similar sized form factor?

edit: just saw the ergodox style case posted a few pages ago. any way to get that or similar split or even an ortho layout?

I don't know if Ellipse has plans for offering ready-to-use pre-built ErgoDoxes but when I finish making my own ErgoDox, the plan is to make it with work with Ellipse's Beamsprings and release everything as open source. Also, I remember Ellipse said you'd be able to buy just the Beamsprings if you want in the future.

[BuGless]

With regards to desirable keyboard layouts for the beam springs... :
I love the new model F77 layout. I use the F77 to be productive, mostly.
In order to be able to seamlessly alternate between the F77 and a beam-spring, I'd like a layout that as much as possible matches key sizes, key placement and board curvature between the F77 and the beam-spring keyboard.

I am aware that for nostalgic reasons the old layouts might be desirable, but in my case I'd like to optimise for ergonomics and maximum reuse of "muscle memory" from already using the F77.

[aiyagari]

I would need to see both cursor movement keys as well as a numeric keypad. I use both. Practically I think this means something like a Model M layout, but I’m flexible on arrangement of other items (like split shifts, backspace, etc). This is why I didn’t go for the F77 in spite of really thinking about it. If there is a 122 layout, then I’d prefer the option that is more “Model M like” than the historical layout. Having extra function keys would be a nice thing - would allow for use of F-keys as well as still having media keys.

[depletedvespene]

Some 40%s

If 122-key keyboards are battleships or battlecruisers, this beamspring-inspired 40% would have to be termed "corvette".

[depletedvespene]

This is the sort of layout I would want. The functions of these keys aren't final yet but this is probably how I would have it set up. ProposedBeamspringLayout.png

While I agree with most of it (I'd go tsangan on this), it needs to be remembered that is is meant to be used with modern-production MX keycaps (MT3 or GMK profile), which do come their own limitations; while the nav cluster would be easily filled with spare keycaps (with inappropriate legends), some things, like the split numpad Enter, would be hard to cover.