Mu's New HHKB

User avatar
E3E

06 May 2022, 19:13

phinix wrote:
06 May 2022, 09:57
wobbled wrote:
05 May 2022, 18:48
I've never tried this myself so am unsure of what the results would be, but have you tried removing the type-s silencing rings?
I can't imagine there's any real wobble on the sliders as the rings are extremely thin
I was thinking doing it. I've read here and there that when you do that, they start to wobble - I don't why, I would have thought that PFU didn't do anything different making those - maybe stems being 1mm taller. If they wobble more, it would mean that stem or housing is different. Would they do such thing? Make totally different housings for type-s? I feel like not.
Maybe it is simple solution for me, just to take out rings. I would void warranty but hey...

EDIT: sounds like they are different: https://hhkb.io/components/sliders/

I'm getting another HHKB ( :roll: :lol: ) so will swap sliders, problem solved :D
What? Don't you know? Topre always wobble. Seriously, they're pretty wobbly.

The main issue with giving yourself the extra travel distance if you're doing this on the newer Type-S with longer slider legs, is that it can cause some issues and hard bottoming out.

I used rev.a silenced housings (internally they have more room to make up for the silencing ring) from an early 108UH-S coupled with rev.b silenced sliders which are lengthened to accommodate for the rings.

I thought more travel would be interesting to have on my analog Realforce. No, it was awful.Clacking and very inconsistent because it essentially over-travels, right into the PCB.

Another HHKB though? You could just get some sliders to swap in, but by all means get your HHKB fix if you're feeling that.

User avatar
phinix

07 May 2022, 12:08

E3E wrote:
06 May 2022, 19:13
phinix wrote:
06 May 2022, 09:57
wobbled wrote:
05 May 2022, 18:48
I've never tried this myself so am unsure of what the results would be, but have you tried removing the type-s silencing rings?
I can't imagine there's any real wobble on the sliders as the rings are extremely thin
I was thinking doing it. I've read here and there that when you do that, they start to wobble - I don't why, I would have thought that PFU didn't do anything different making those - maybe stems being 1mm taller. If they wobble more, it would mean that stem or housing is different. Would they do such thing? Make totally different housings for type-s? I feel like not.
Maybe it is simple solution for me, just to take out rings. I would void warranty but hey...

EDIT: sounds like they are different: https://hhkb.io/components/sliders/

I'm getting another HHKB ( :roll: :lol: ) so will swap sliders, problem solved :D
What? Don't you know? Topre always wobble. Seriously, they're pretty wobbly.

The main issue with giving yourself the extra travel distance if you're doing this on the newer Type-S with longer slider legs, is that it can cause some issues and hard bottoming out.

I used rev.a silenced housings (internally they have more room to make up for the silencing ring) from an early 108UH-S coupled with rev.b silenced sliders which are lengthened to accommodate for the rings.

I thought more travel would be interesting to have on my analog Realforce. No, it was awful.Clacking and very inconsistent because it essentially over-travels, right into the PCB.

Another HHKB though? You could just get some sliders to swap in, but by all means get your HHKB fix if you're feeling that.
I know topre wobbles, I had many topre boards in last 15 years.
Thing is the slider of Type-s is different - it has small indent under it, so rubber dome goes deeper, to feel like regular one.
Once you remove rings, you create a gap between dome and slider, that is why all caps would then be lose, not wobble, but lose, they will rattle vertically.

Now, to explain second hhkb purchase.
Second one will be for MX caps - I will buy deskeys sliders and swap them. So would have one hhkb I can use mx caps, second, the one I have Type-s, for pure topre experience, but with regular sliders.
Problem solved:)

User avatar
Muirium
µ

07 May 2022, 12:57

Set aside those Type-S sliders for someone else to upgrade their Topre and you're all set. ;)

As for wobble: I find all mechanical keyboards (indeed any keyboard with several millimetres of travel) 'wobble' compared to crappy chiclet laptop keyboards. (Scissor switches just don't move as much.) Topre's no more wobbly than Model F to my fingers. Don't think MX has any advantage here either, though to be fair I hardly touch them.

Besides, I don't really perceive this as 'wobble' so much as loose 'play' when you lay a finger on a key and push it in the X and Y dimensions instead of Z as intended. Short of extra tall caps like SA, or indeed MX/Alps adapters raising keys to similar heights, I've not encountered a keyboard I'd call truly 'wobbly.' But 'scratchy,' yes! Smoothness is what Topre gets just right.

What mechanical keyboard has the least wobble do you think?

User avatar
E3E

08 May 2022, 00:19

phinix wrote:
07 May 2022, 12:08
I know topre wobbles, I had many topre boards in last 15 years.
Thing is the slider of Type-s is different - it has small indent under it, so rubber dome goes deeper, to feel like regular one.
Once you remove rings, you create a gap between dome and slider, that is why all caps would then be lose, not wobble, but lose, they will rattle vertically.

Now, to explain second hhkb purchase.
Second one will be for MX caps - I will buy deskeys sliders and swap them. So would have one hhkb I can use mx caps, second, the one I have Type-s, for pure topre experience, but with regular sliders.
Problem solved:)
Oh yes, that's certainly different then. I've never tried taking rings off of the silenced sliders on my boards! Yeah, that'd be loose and rattly, not fun.

Nice to see someone who appreciates the stock upstroke clacks of Topre. All of my boards are silenced because I don't really care for the sound, but I love seeing differences in preferences.

Getting another HHKB to use MX slider sounds like a great idea. :D
Muirium wrote:
07 May 2022, 12:57
.
What mechanical keyboard has the least wobble do you think?
Definitely agree here in regards to wobble just being common and pretty natural with mechanical keyboards because of the nature of sliders and tolerances.

I'd guess space invaders probably have the least wobble due to switch and key cap mount design. I've only had a few space invaders boards, but never long enough to check; I've used their 7u PBT space bars for projects.

User avatar
phinix

08 May 2022, 00:50

As much as I love hhkb, for some reason typing on type-s is weirdly mushy for me.
I feel a bit bad that so many people here love type-s, where I just feel that stock sounds and feels better.
Is it possible that I feel them both at the same time - scratchy and kinda smooth :)
However, I think that swaping sliders will be great idea for me.
Black hhkb will give away its stock sliders, Type-s will give away its sliders with rings.
Deskeys sliders will go to black one, black caps and type-s sliders - for sale.
This way I will have beautiful stock hhkb and black one will get all my mx caps collection.
I only need to hunt for some 6u spacebars, as some of my sets do not have those.

Anyway guys, I can tell that I love my hhkb. I hope I will have patience to learn it.

User avatar
wobbled

15 Sep 2022, 20:38

Purchased one from the same seller you used Mu and he accepted an offer of 90 pounds. An absolute steal for a NIB HHKB. I think this one might end up as the internals for the S60 Sho or Evija when they arrive.

User avatar
Muirium
µ

16 Sep 2022, 12:26

Quit tempting me to stock up on boards! :lol:

I lowballed them en route to buying my ninja black one. Turned me down. Interesting to hear they’re getting more flexible with time. But do I really need a third?

As for the projects you mention: I’ve never heard of them and picture weighty “Norbauer HHKB” and the like. Not what appeals to me so much about the light and little Happy Hacker…

User avatar
Muirium
µ

20 Jun 2023, 12:17

Here's my current layout:
µHHKB 2023.png
µHHKB 2023.png (101.35 KiB) Viewed 4349 times
The base layer is almost completely default: bar one little trick on left Command to make Esc into tilde (up on Layer 5) for window switching when holding that key, but not the other Command.

The function layer, meanwhile, has a lot more going on. :D

Highlights:
  • The standard suite of HHKB navigation keys—cursor diamond, Page Up/Down—which are sublime and mandatory for me on all 60% keyboards
  • Media keys on A, S and D: I have them laid out as Mute, Volume Down, Volume Up—which I do everywhere, too
  • Print/Scroll/Pause are still where Topre's legends have them, and Pause is useful as Hasu's firmware flashing key
  • F13? Yes, I have it mapped to sleep. "Power" as Topre's front facing legend puts it.
  • And a numpad!?!
Well, yes! But only really behind the scenes. See, I have numpad keys remapped to 🖱️ Mouse Keys in Karabiner. I actually find these very useful, laid-back lap-typist that I am! Most of my daily mouse use is entirely trivial and can be done on the keyboard in a pinch. Besides, that numpad is still there if I want it: I can toggle between numpad mode and mouse mode using Num Lock: Fn + M.

Mouse movement is an 8-direction 'joystick' centred on the G key—left click—which I chose as there's room for it all on the layer. I added scroll keys for convenience, which work quite nicely, too. It's all an iterative design, simply letting my fingers decide where things ought to be and editing it to make it so.

Yay programmability!

User avatar
Muirium
µ

20 Jun 2023, 16:16

To illustrate what's really going on, I dug out my ancient OmniGraffle templates and cooked this up:

µHHKB 244.png
µHHKB 244.png (351.49 KiB) Viewed 4259 times

I've roughly colour coded them into the sections, as I understand them, of each layer. Orange is mouse / numpad zone, where things are not as they seem!

Mouse Mode:
  • G = Left Click
  • F = Mouse Left
  • R = Mouse Left and Up
  • T = Mouse Up
  • And so on for the whole square around G: chord these keys and you get 16 effective directions, they all add up
  • ] = Scroll Up
  • Delete = Scroll Down: I have these set to nice slow scrolls, good for moving the view finely vs. Page Up/Down
But the real action is in my Control layer, driven by Karabiner, which runs a whole bunch of things. Having these at the system level means I can, and do, use them everywhere; all from my HHKB and every other keyboard.

I've really gone to town on the Control key, seeing as it's mostly spare here on the Mac. I've made it an instantly reachable layer of my own devise:

Stràc Macros:
  • Control A = à
  • Shift Control A = À
  • And so on for all the vowels
Text Transformation:
  • Control W = TitleCase the selected text and replace it with the result
  • Control Q = Capitalise (run TitleCase on) the word to the left of the cursor and return here
  • Shift Control Q = Capitalise (run TitleCase on) the first word in the line, and return here
  • Control T = Twiddle—swap—the characters left and right of the cursor: this is built into Mac, btw.
  • Shift Control T= Twiddle the words left and right of the cursor
  • Control R = Twiddle the characters left and 2 × left of the cursor: great for fixing typos
  • Control L = lowercase the entire text selection
  • Shift Control L = UPPERCASE THE ENTIRE TEXT SELECTION YOU MANIAC
  • Control Z = Lowercase the word to the left of the cursor and return
Cursor Movement:
  • Control S = Move to the beginning of the current line (standard Ctrl A but I took that for À)
  • Control D = Move one character left (like Alt + Left)
  • Control F = Move one character right (like Alt + Right)
  • Control G = Move the end of the current line (standard Ctrl E but I took that for È)
Note the purposeful similarity to the line below, which is these guys.

Text Selection:
  • Control X = Select previous paragraph
  • Control C = Select previous word
  • Control V = Select next word
  • Control B = Select next paragraph
I use these last 4 in particular all the time. They're a huge time saver when holding the Shift key to make major edits. They work behind the scenes by firing a whole dance of Shift + Option + Left etc. via Karabiner, sparing repetitive finger gymnastics while your eyes are on the text. They're a timesaver on TKL and regular size keyboards, too, and all right there on the alpha block. Very pleased with these!

Find and Replace Macros:
  • Control - = Replace spaces with hyphens in the text selection: sometimes-you-just-gotta-keep-moving!
  • Control ; = Find commas, periods and colons in the selection, replace them with semicolons; capitalise accordingly
  • Shift Control ; = Find commas, periods and semicolons in the selection, replace them with colons: capitalise accordingly
  • Control , = Replace periods and (semi)colons in the selection with commas, and capitalise accordingly
  • Control . = Replace commas and semicolons in the selection with periods. And capitalise accordingly
Variations on a theme, which I found myself doing frequently enough to want to automate. I’m forever shifting clauses around, and these guys really help.

And lastly, some simple wraps:

Wraps:
  • Shift Control 9 = Wrap (selected text) with paren
  • Control ' = Wrap 'selected text' with single '
  • Shift Control ' = Wrap "selected text" with double "
  • Control / = Wrap /*selected text*/ with C comment style /* */
  • Shift Control / = Wrap ¿selected text? with ¿?
One particular annoyance in making this list is that a lot of these don't work right here in the post composition window on DT. I don't know why that is—built in Control key shortcuts in the editor pane?—but they're really for long-form work. Even longer than this. :lol:

User avatar
adhoc

22 Aug 2023, 12:03

I'm also not a fan of Type-S. The whistling sound on some of the keys drove me mad.

Anyway, I'm stealing your idea about the numpad mapping to the mouse, Mu.

User avatar
Muirium
µ

22 Aug 2023, 12:46

adhoc wrote:
22 Aug 2023, 12:03
I'm also not a fan of Type-S. The whistling sound on some of the keys drove me mad.
Also? I love my Type-S. That particular grumbling must be from someone else. :P
adhoc wrote:
22 Aug 2023, 12:03
Anyway, I'm stealing your idea about the numpad mapping to the mouse, Mu.
That's why I share them!

"Numpad Mousepad" works especially well on actual numpads. Since the Mac has no Num Lock function (IBM only invented it for the XT and AT then kept its ghost around forever) I use that key to toggle between mouse movement and regular numerics on fullsize keyboards. Works like a charm. Once I got used to it there, I brought it over to the HHKB along with a numpad layer.

User avatar
adhoc

22 Aug 2023, 12:49

Sorry Mu, I should have used quotation tool but I was on my phone and too lazy to use it. The grumbling was indeed by someone else.

Your opinion on Type S is wrong, by the way. (this is my attempt at humour...yeah, I know)

User avatar
Muirium
µ

22 Aug 2023, 13:04

One of the many, many noble life lessons from the Big Lebowski.

Image

If you're talking about the 'puff' my Return key has—which sounds like a tennis ball in a serve if hit with emphasis—then it's no less than my very favourite key! It's the one which means you're Done. The End. :D

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