Post your keyboard/keycaps!

[depletedvespene]

Right alt key was not working. I thought one of the switches was just broken but no, turns out the right alt was NOT SOLDERED. it didn't even look de-soldered, it just looked like the switch was not ever soldered to the board.

One of the most crazy keebs related thing I've ever read. The first owner never wrote an email.

Or, perhaps, it was a customized keyboard for someone with an e-mail addiction.

[depletedvespene]

Oh, my lens was dirty

BTW, I've seen every now and then this unusual physical layout, which comes off as a mix of the AT and battleship layouts (with a slight crosspollination of the Enhanced layout). Do we know where does it come from? I'd like to have a better name for this than "battleAT".

[Wolfi77W]

Very nice find, thanks for sharing! At least part of the reason for the good sound is that those are early white Alps switches. Alps made changes as time went on, and most folks who have tried the different versions including myself prefer the earliest ones. It would be interesting to compare this keyboard side by side with the metal base version.

I've been logging Northgates into a database for several years, up to almost 800 now, and the bar code label is new to me.

I'm pretty sure that Northgate added the labels after they received the keyboards from the manufacturer, because we've seen the same style labels on keyboards from several vendors including Monterey and Silitek. The 0B I believe is February 1990, but that would be when it was received or processed, not a manufacture date. I've only seen the GT6OMNIKEY03 FCC number once before, on a recent ebay listing for a 101I with the paper label missing. Most of the other 101I models on record had a GT6OMNIKEY01 ID. (GT6OMNIKEY02 was used on early 102 models) Note that this is an early 3 character FCC ID and only the GT6 part identifies the manufacturer. Later FCC codes used a 6 character identifier, but Northgate appears not to have switched to a 6 character ID.

I'd very much like to see scans of the manual. I have a nice 101I, but not a copy of the book. Looks like some kind of receipt also. Any clues about its origin there? Interesting also to see the RMA sheet with the instructions for displaying the firmware version at a DOS prompt. That works on my 101I and on most later Northgates, but apparently not on the earlier gold badge models.

Thank you for the info regarding Alps and Northgate Polecat! The differences you described between early and later White Alps explains why my Northgate feels and sounds closer to my Blue Alps board than my other white alps boards. Only noticeable difference I can feel between the two is the larger tactility on the Omnikey than the Blue Alps.

While it is definitely a possibility that they did apply the barcode labels on their board, I find it interesting that no other Omnikeys have come up so far with the actual barcode. You'd think that if that was standard procedure that we'd have seen more boards before that also has the barcode or some remnants of the adhesive used to stick the barcode on the case. I don't know the history of this board so I guess we won't know the story or the reason for the barcode unfortunately. And the receipt you mentioned, if you're referring to the pink slip beneath the manual, is actually the receipt for taxes/duties I incurred from importing the Omnikey.

Regarding the instructions for displaying firmware, since the instruction is for DOS I should be able to do it through Windows Command Prompt right? I haven't thought much of looking into the firmware version until you mentioned it.

Here is the scan of the whole manual and RMA form as well: https://imgur.com/a/pzUYuZT

The manual appears to be from April 1990 and it's for both the I and N variants of the Gen 2 101s, or the 101-IBM and 101-NCS as the layout page explains it. Guess we now know why Northgate gave the I and N designations for the 2 variants.

[Polecat]

Thank you for the info regarding Alps and Northgate Polecat! The differences you described between early and later White Alps explains why my Northgate feels and sounds closer to my Blue Alps board than my other white alps boards. Only noticeable difference I can feel between the two is the larger tactility on the Omnikey than the Blue Alps.

While it is definitely a possibility that they did apply the barcode labels on their board, I find it interesting that no other Omnikeys have come up so far with the actual barcode. You'd think that if that was standard procedure that we'd have seen more boards before that also has the barcode or some remnants of the adhesive used to stick the barcode on the case. I don't know the history of this board so I guess we won't know the story or the reason for the barcode unfortunately. And the receipt you mentioned, if you're referring to the pink slip beneath the manual, is actually the receipt for taxes/duties I incurred from importing the Omnikey.

Regarding the instructions for displaying firmware, since the instruction is for DOS I should be able to do it through Windows Command Prompt right? I haven't thought much of looking into the firmware version until you mentioned it.

Here is the scan of the whole manual and RMA form as well: https://imgur.com/a/pzUYuZT

The manual appears to be from April 1990 and it's for both the I and N variants of the Gen 2 101s, or the 101-IBM and 101-NCS as the layout page explains it. Guess we now know why Northgate gave the I and N designations for the 2 variants.

Thank you for scanning and posting the manual! I'll give that a closer look soon. But you've answered one of our questions, explaining what the I and N meant.

I've had several of my Northgates almost since new, so I'm 99 percent certain that they didn't put bar codes on the ones they sold. Note that Northgate sold direct by mail order as well as through computer stores. They also included keyboards with the computer systems they sold. Here's the old thread from when I got my 101I, which has some of the unanswered questions near the end.

viewtopic.php?f=62&t=26699&p=497246&hilit=101i#p497246

Note that they went from a dot matrix printed paper label to a better looking and more durable vinyl one sometime between when yours (0B - February 1990) and mine (0H - August 1990) were made. And they also changed from a plastic base to a metal one on the 101I and 101N during that time. As far as I know only the early 101I and 101N models ever had a plastic base.

The firmware version does come up when you hit that key combo at the command prompt in Windows 7, but it disappears almost immediately. On a faster computer than mine you might miss it completely. On mine it matches the label (1.02) but that might not always be the case. Northgate was making lots of changes for compatibility around that time, and some keyboards might have been upgraded before or after they were sold. We're in the process of trying to document those changes, but we're still finding new versions almost as quickly as we're figuring out the old ones.

[Wolfi77W]

Thank you for scanning and posting the manual! I'll give that a closer look soon. But you've answered one of our questions, explaining what the I and N meant.

I've had several of my Northgates almost since new, so I'm 99 percent certain that they didn't put bar codes on the ones they sold. Note that Northgate sold direct by mail order as well as through computer stores. They also included keyboards with the computer systems they sold. Here's the old thread from when I got my 101I, which has some of the unanswered questions near the end.

viewtopic.php?f=62&t=26699&p=497246&hilit=101i#p497246

Note that they went from a dot matrix printed paper label to a better looking and more durable vinyl one sometime between when yours (0B - February 1990) and mine (0H - August 1990) were made. And they also changed from a plastic base to a metal one on the 101I and 101N during that time. As far as I know only the early 101I and 101N models ever had a plastic base.

Thanks for sharing your older 101I thread, lots of info I didn't know that was discussed there especially regarding vendors and the vendor numbers, all this time I assumed the gen2 101s still used Focus PCBs but clearly that's not the case. Interesting too that they started out with a plastic base for the older 101s and switched out for a metal base later on.

Also when opening the 101I, is there some clips or hidden screws I have to look out for? I'd like to take a look inside mine, but I don't want to damage the keyboard or case in anyway.

The firmware version does come up when you hit that key combo at the command prompt in Windows 7, but it disappears almost immediately. On a faster computer than mine you might miss it completely. On mine it matches the label (1.02) but that might not always be the case. Northgate was making lots of changes for compatibility around that time, and some keyboards might have been upgraded before or after they were sold. We're in the process of trying to document those changes, but we're still finding new versions almost as quickly as we're figuring out the old ones.

Looks like it'll be a challenge to get the firmware version on my pc. Might have to try checking the firmware on one of the older pcs at my workplace.

[Polecat]

Thanks for sharing your older 101I thread, lots of info I didn't know that was discussed there especially regarding vendors and the vendor numbers, all this time I assumed the gen2 101s still used Focus PCBs but clearly that's not the case. Interesting too that they started out with a plastic base for the older 101s and switched out for a metal base later on.

Also when opening the 101I, is there some clips or hidden screws I have to look out for? I'd like to take a look inside mine, but I don't want to damage the keyboard or case in anyway.

Looks like it'll be a challenge to get the firmware version on my pc. Might have to try checking the firmware on one of the older pcs at my workplace.

No hidden clips or anything, just the visible screws, very easy to open up, at least on the metal base version. I've never seen the plastic version in person.

I don't know why the version number flashes and disappears. That could be from the Soarers Converter I'm running. I can try it on a blue cube or Radio Shack dongle next time I have it out. It does the same thing on my other Northgates also, so it isn't just the 101I.

[Muirium]

The firmware version readout is just plain text "typed" automatically into the computer, right? (Essentially a macro.) If so, sounds like it ends with a series of Backspace characters to remove it; with the assumption the PC was immensely slower so you could read this message while it was typed then rubbed out.

If that's the case: you need a keylogger of some sort, which will record the characters. I use Karabiner for macro stuff like this on the Mac:

Code: Select all

[
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"v"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "25 (0x0019)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"v"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "25 (0x0019)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"1"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "30 (0x001e)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"1"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "30 (0x001e)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"period"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "55 (0x0037)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"period"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "55 (0x0037)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"0"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "39 (0x0027)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"0"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "39 (0x0027)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"spacebar"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "44 (0x002c)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"spacebar"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "44 (0x002c)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"b"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "5 (0x0005)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"a"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "4 (0x0004)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"b"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "5 (0x0005)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"a"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "4 (0x0004)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"b"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "5 (0x0005)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"b"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "5 (0x0005)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"y"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "28 (0x001c)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"y"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "28 (0x001c)",
    "misc": ""
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"left_shift"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "225 (0x00e1)",
    "misc": "flags left_shift"
  },
  {
    "type": "down",
    "name": {"key_code":"1"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "30 (0x001e)",
    "misc": "flags left_shift"
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"1"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "30 (0x001e)",
    "misc": "flags left_shift"
  },
  {
    "type": "up",
    "name": {"key_code":"left_shift"},
    "usagePage": "7 (0x0007)",
    "usage": "225 (0x00e1)",
    "misc": ""
  }
]

Point being: the characters were typed, and can be recorded, subsequent blanking be damned!

[dotdash]

I don't know why the version number flashes and disappears. That could be from the Soarers Converter I'm running. I can try it on a blue cube or Radio Shack dongle next time I have it out. It does the same thing on my other Northgates also, so it isn't just the 101I.

Not the converter. Tried it directly to ps/2 on an old pc. I think I booted it to FreeDOS. I ended up making a video of the screen with my phone. I may have enlisted help to hold the phone while I pressed keys. (mine was sw rev 7.03 11/02/90)

[Wolfi77W]

So I tried checking the firmware on my Windows 10 pc through both a Tinkerboy converter and a din-5-ps/2 to active ps/2-usb converter. While the output was still fast on both, the output through active ps/2-usb converter was noticeably slower. Slow enough that I could read the revision on mine as 1.02, there appeared to be a date revision as well but I couldn't fully read it before it disappeared.

As for the back panel, the plastic base appears to be mainly held by clips on the sides and the screw on the center. I probably won't open it up as long as I have no reason to. Don't like the idea of breaking clips.

[Polecat]

Well...I connected my 101I to a real DOS computer (6.22) and the message stays on the screen:

omnikey rev 1.02 09/27/89\

In addition I hit F7 by accident instead of F8 and got this message:

this is a northgate computer sys. copyrighted keyboard program.\
if this keyboard is not a northgate computer sys. product\
please call 612-553-0111 collect\

Note that everything is in lower case and there are backslashes at the end of each line. Could the backslashes be interpreted as a line feed only in Windows, but as a line feed and carriage return in DOS?

There *are* a couple clips on my metal base 101I. Sorry, I didn't remember those, so it mustn't have been a problem to open the case.

edited for typos

[Wolfi77W]

Ahh ok thanks for confirming the presence of clips, I'll give it a try, won't hurt to try as long as the clips aren't too stiff. Interesting that they have a function for the f7 key as well.

[Inxie]

PXL_20230924_223620430.NIGHT-01.jpeg (1.45 MiB) Viewed 29157 times

I'm really enjoying these PBT's I picked up. I really like the rounded bowl shaped type keycaps a bit more than the traditional shape now.

[Muirium]

Sphericals have the look, for sure.

But I must be honest: I prefer typing on cylindricals. They have the feel, for me.

[paperWasp]

Very nice!

But what kind of switches does use that rotary dial telephone?

[Inxie]

Very nice!

But what kind of switches does use that rotary dial telephone?

These kinds . One that mutes the headset entirely by shunting it when the dial is pulled back, and the other that flashes the hook switch off and on when returning.

PXL_20230924_013138582.jpg (3.86 MiB) Viewed 28947 times

[paperWasp]

They look almost linear.

Thanks for the picture. Love this kind of antique technical stuff.

[Aruberon]

On todays east bloc exhibit we have the MERA ELZAB 7940, manufactured in 1978, in Zabrze, south west Poland:

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The keycaps are 1970s thick double shot, im assuming ABS, however the manufacturing process leaves a lot to be desired, with some keycaps being perfectly smooth and sharp legends, while others arent properly filled at all. some legends are yellow, most are white, the choice seems pretty arbitrary, likewise with the shade of colour of the keycaps themselves, some are a deep blue, some are aquamarine:

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The switches themselves are M-24-112 magnetic reed switches, manufactured by Unitra Dolam in Wrocław/Breslau, not much too them other than the enclosed housing, four rails which are ungodly bindy, the spring, the magnet and the reed switch itself:

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[paperWasp]

The keycap colour is quite atractive.

[depletedvespene]

Whenever I am trying out a new national layout or (or customizing one), this is the keyboard I test it out with:

Model_M_XXK.jpg

The XXK is not alone anymore.

Unicomp Mini-X.

Mini-X.jpg (179.95 KiB) Viewed 28091 times

Indeed, this is a Unicomp Mini-M. I replaced the buttons with blanks and a large batch of X keys (all by Unicomp).


As is by now my standard practice, which I opine should become an actual standard for everyone, the 6 key in the number row has a HRI bar. On numpadless keyboards (TKL and smaller), this has proven to be very useful when inputting numbers.

Three HRI buttons.

HRI.jpg (200.95 KiB) Viewed 28091 times

Initially, I wanted all alphas to be gray and all mods to be blue. Sadly, Unicomp does not provide blue for all the non-1U buttons, so I went with only the Esc key (Fn, actually, as Esc is on the home row) to be the accent.

[depletedvespene]

So I finally got off my lazy ass and replaced the blanks in my F77 with Ellipse's es-LA keycap sets. I mixed the cream alphas from one set with the dark gray modifiers (plus three blue ones, and two black unprinted keys for ${REASON}).

F77, esLA layout.

F77.jpg (144.41 KiB) Viewed 28037 times

Looks great, but I would love to have gray alphas instead. This is good for now.


Note the placement of the Esc key. The "Caps Lock vs. Ctrl on the home row" holy war is over, and both sides have lost. Esc on the home row is the way to go; vi forever.

HRI keys: F, J, 6.

HRI_F.jpg (220.05 KiB) Viewed 28037 times

In keeping with my whi... practice, the F77 also has an HRI 6& key.

[Muirium]

So I finally got off my lazy ass and replaced the blanks in my F77

Aren't those blacks still blanks? Or are you paying homage to Topre's black on black legends? Even they aren't quite that invisible.

That's the cost of pulling Escape down from the number row, where it should be, just as Control must be left of A. I do agree with you on Backspace though.

[depletedvespene]

So I finally got off my lazy ass and replaced the blanks in my F77

Aren't those blacks still blanks? Or are you paying homage to Topre's black on black legends? Even they aren't quite that invisible.

That's the cost of pulling Escape down from the number row, where it should be, just as Control must be left of A. I do agree with you on Backspace though.

Those two black keys are still blanks. I'm not using either key, as muscle memory is a b◉tch and that area can only be Backspace. For now, I am perfectly happy with a TIE Enter and an "HHKB-style" Backspace, but once Ellipse has started to produce ISO Enter keys I might do the unthinkable and open up the F77 to take out one flipper and put one stab in.

Far from being a cost, Esc on the home row actually SOLVES the problem of Esc and `~ (|°¬ in the pictured keyboard) clashing on a keyboard with no F row, which in turns avoids the problem of splitting or moving the Backspace key. As I said, the home row war is over and Esc is the winner.

[Muirium]

Muscle memory can be a female canine indeed, though oddly enough I've never found all my frequent switching between backspace types—simply because of different keyboards—to cause me any problem. Most of my favourite keyboards have 1.5u backspace right of ], where I like it best, but the others all have it up where you usually find it, leaving \ or even our old friend ISO Return down there.

ISO's inexcusably shortened left Shift does throw me off from time to time, but Backspace never seems to be a problem. Might I perhaps suggest: make fewer errors?

Kidding. I use Backspace plenty, as I so often edit things around when I’m (re)writing them. But honestly, it's a nice big key even at 1.5u and causes me no problem. I do highly recommend mapping Shift ⌫ Backspace to ⌦ Delete. If that's missing on a system, then I’m more likely to start cursing while mid-edit.

[depletedvespene]

Kidding. I use Backspace plenty, as I so often edit things around when I’m (re)writing them. But honestly, it's a nice big key even at 1.5u and causes me no problem. I do highly recommend mapping Shift + Backspace to Delete. If that's missing on a system, then I’m more likely to start cursing while mid-edit.

No, no, no, no. Delete has to be its own key as well. Of course, if it were for me, the keys ⌦ and ⌫ would be on either side of the keyboard (on B00 and B14), and both 1.5U in size. Or, at least, 1.25U and 1.75U, respectively. Then you'd probably quiet down the complaints about "inexcusably shortened left Shift" keys as well.

[depletedvespene]

BTW...

... just as Control must be left of A.

¿And to the right of what, as well? All modifiers should be on either side of the keyboard... and if we follow the basic rule of symmetry of the modifiers placements, that means that RCTRL should be where {ANSI | the lower half of ISO} Enter is. Which would imply, as well, a return to the old R2 Return keys.

Replace "Caps" with "Ctrl" on the home row.

800XL.png (230.59 KiB) Viewed 27978 times

[kbdfr]

[…] All modifiers should be on either side of the keyboard […]

Unconditionally agree.
That is one of the reasons I love my programmable XXXL Tipro, which allows me to use e.g. Esc or Enter or the arrow keys with either hand..

[ifohancroft]

Don't have a picture yet, but couldn't wait to post that I finally have a Model M (IBM Enhanced Keyboard).

It's a second gen, white oval label (1391401) in US ANSI, with a removable PS/2 cable, manufactured on 26 Sep 1988 in the USA. The vertical keys use stabilizer bars though, like on the first gen.

[Jo3l]

This is part of my keyboard collection, some are restored, some are still dirty, some are modded with usb interface, and I wanted to share it with you.

[Muirium]

Impressive presentation. I get the feeling that brightly coloured room contains quite a few showcases, not just limited to keyboards.

[depletedvespene]

This is part of my keyboard collection, some are restored, some are still dirty, some are modded with usb interface, and I wanted to share it with you.

Nada mal. Cuántas eñes, oyes (i ces trencadas, noi).


I'd like to ask for close-up pictures of the F/XT, F/AT and M0110A keyboards — it's for es-ES documentation purposes.