NKRO, is it really important?

[eclairz]

Just found out about this forum from geekhack of which i've been a member of some years.

I used to play Super Street Fighter many years ago, and for each player you needed 4 directional keys and 6 attack buttons per player, and we both played on the keyboard.
That would be say 2 directional keys + 6 attack per player would be 16 Key roll over, i forgot what keyboard as it was a long time ago but it did work, so we must have had a ps/2 diode keyboard. Unfortunately the keyboard is lost in time, although it was quite fun.

[MrBlue]

Dont think its that important imo. You wont be using that many keys all at once anyway.

[lucidlts]

yea, you wont find a game (street fighter?) which requires you to press all 104 keys at once to activate the ultimate-move. lol

[Sugoi]

6KRO is very sufficient for me. Anyways, I have never encountered a situation where I needed to press more 6 keys at the same time.

[lucidlts]

most keyboards out there supports NKRO under PS/2. not much supporting NKRO under USB though :/
only 2 i know which is NKRO under USB, noppoo choc mini & a china brand PLU G3000

[keyboardlover]

most keyboards out there supports NKRO under PS/2.

Nope.

[celery]

Just found out about this forum from geekhack of which i've been a member of some years.

I used to play Super Street Fighter many years ago, and for each player you needed 4 directional keys and 6 attack buttons per player, and we both played on the keyboard.
That would be say 2 directional keys + 6 attack per player would be 16 Key roll over, i forgot what keyboard as it was a long time ago but it did work, so we must have had a ps/2 diode keyboard. Unfortunately the keyboard is lost in time, although it was quite fun.

You're rarely pressing more than 2 or 3 keys per player at a time in fighting games, so I'd bet you could have gotten by without NKRO. It was fairly rare on old keyboards (still is today). My brother and I used to do the same thing. When we were just mashing buttons, nobody noticed anything, but after a while, we found out that by holding a few keys at once, we could block the other player's input. Then it turned into endless bitching about cheating, and occasionally real-world street fighting.

[arcanius]

In the end, NKRO isn't necessary, but I do sometimes hate my 2KRO. I'd say 4KRO is enough for most gamers, but who actually makes a 4KRO keyboard?! In the end, I'd pay $20 extra to get 6/NKRO, because the few times that I do game, I notice how some 4 key combos don't work, sometimes it'd be nice to have those.
And whoever said that games are for joysticks, consoles, etc. I totally disagree. Nothing compares to PC gaming, where you can mod, customize, and use a mouse/trackball for precision and speed. Keyboard gaming isn't ideal for Racing or Flight games, but otherwise, it owns controllers and joysticks.

[ripster]

Too bad PC gaming is dying.

The date of it's decline historians will note as the day iD software and Carmack decided to make Rage a Console game.

http://www.destructoid.com/id-s-rage-fo ... 0907.phtml


What this means for the Mechanical Keyboard market long term is unclear.

[sam113101]

It is good for piano softwares and games.

[sixty]

Too bad PC gaming is dying.

Well PCs as in Desktops are also decreasing more and more - so eventually it will all even out and we are back to using computers for work stalking girls on facebook and consoles for gaming! Just like in the 70s and 80s!

Btw gamers, can you think of any more absolutely needed key-combinations that a keyboard should be able to pass to play modern games? I got these from some guy on geekhack:

A + W + D
A + S + X
W + D + E
S + D + C
W + A + Q
Ctrl + A + Q
E + S + D + F
Capslock + Left Shift + S

We need some more for a new upcoming project - any ideas?

[tehpassenger]

I don't mind PC gaming is really dying, since the esports are intrinsically related with PC. Sure it's not the country of casual gamers, but did it have ever been it ?
For example, SC2 receive an overall good welcome (even with his huge lacks ) .. So I don't think PC gaming is on the decline.

[Crazy9000]

Too bad PC gaming is dying.

Well PCs as in Desktops are also decreasing more and more - so eventually it will all even out and we are back to using computers for work stalking girls on facebook and consoles for gaming! Just like in the 70s and 80s!

Btw gamers, can you think of any more absolutely needed key-combinations that a keyboard should be able to pass to play modern games? I got these from some guy on geekhack:

A + W + D
A + S + X
W + D + E
S + D + C
W + A + Q
Ctrl + A + Q
E + S + D + F
Capslock + Left Shift + S

We need some more for a new upcoming project - any ideas?

You can really only cover the more common FPS movesets really. Anything else could be random.

For example, when I need 7kro I'm pressing down [space]zvc[up][right][numpad 1]

[ripster]

I don't mind PC gaming is really dying, since the esports are intrinsically related with PC. Sure it's not the country of casual gamers, but did it have ever been it ?
For example, SC2 receive an overall good welcome (even with his huge lacks ) .. So I don't think PC gaming is on the decline.

Like I've been saying the future of PC Gaming is "Farmville". Social Gaming is expected to surpass $1B this year.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/01/ ... 0L20110113

Guess what Steam Made last year?

$1B.

[Crazy9000]

Steam hasn't released sales figures :p. They are a private company so don't have to.

Any numbers assigned to steam sales are merely speculation.

[bakageta]

IIDX and Poppin music could both go above the 6 key limit when played with a keyboard. Though if you were a major player of those games you would buy a proper pad I suppose.

A proper controller for Pop'n actually makes the game a fair bit harder... Try hitting all 9 keys at once on a full size controller, it's a nightmare.

While the games use more than 6 keys, do they ever require you to hold down 7+ keys at once? I had a quick look at some videos on insane difficulties and don't think I saw more than 3 keys used simultaneously.

Pop'n has several songs with 6-notes hit at the same time, and a small handful of songs with 7+. They are ridiculous on a real controller, but slightly more manageable on a keyboard, since you don't need to lay your entire arm across it. I can't think of any IIDX song that needs all seven keys pressed at once, but I know of at least one that alternates quickly between the top 3 and bottom 4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ih-WpTZcFIQ around the 1:44 mark), and the easiest method to pass that is to cheese through it by hitting all 7 keys at once.

Really, NKRO isn't important for the vast majority of people. There are only a few situations you'd need more than 6KRO, and most people do just fine with 2KRO.

[ripster]

Total Gaming Market? Somewhere around $15B. This says middle aged males are old and obsolete.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 23449.html

She looks happy she doesn't have to install a liquid cooling pump.

[lucidlts]

most keyboards out there supports NKRO under PS/2.

Nope.

why not? filco,ducky,cherry,das,leopold,zowie,steelseries,etc. these keyboards supports NKRO under PS/2

[webwit]

NKRO will never be important in gaming as most of the potential customers don't have a NKRO keyboard.

[ripster]

This became quite clear to me when the Sidewinder X4 was introduced. You can read pages of Amazon reviews without anybody mentioning the NKRO over USB feature.

It REALLY is only important at Geekhack and OCN. And OCN keeps screwing it up.

[keyboardlover]

why not? filco,ducky,cherry,das,leopold,zowie,steelseries,etc. these keyboards supports NKRO under PS/2

That's a small handful of keyboards. MOST keyboards do NOT have nkro.

[Crazy9000]

why not? filco,ducky,cherry,das,leopold,zowie,steelseries,etc. these keyboards supports NKRO under PS/2

That's a small handful of keyboards. MOST keyboards do NOT have nkro.

Yeah, and only the NKRO Filco support it. I betnot all the Cherries are NKRO too.

[ripster]

For someone who has spent so much time at the OCN Keyboard forum you are sure ignorant about NKRO.

[Crazy9000]

For someone who has spent so much time at the OCN Keyboard forum you are sure ignorant about NKRO.

You're just jealous since you can't handle more then 6 keys at a time.

[Ekaros]

My Filco is NKRO, but my Steelkeys 6G isn't, or my G80-3000, neither is my Model M nor my G84-4400...

NKRO is not very common feature, of course the "premium" mechanicals often have it which screw the result a bit...

[ripster]

The $275 Topre Realforce and HHKB are examples that high price doesn't always get you NKRO.

[keyboardlover]

There's a myth that NOBODY uses full NKRO.

I, for one, would like to dispel that myth.

I-literally-use-NKRO.jpg (85.43 KiB) Viewed 13060 times

[BababooeyHTJ]

Too bad PC gaming is dying.

Yeah, I thought that it was already dead.

[ripster]

Got Shogun 2 yesterday. Pretty nice for a dead category!

[NewGuy]

PC gaming is always dying/dead…