The tin foil hat conspiracy

[matt3o]

I recently wrote the following article and I would also like your opinion on this topic.

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Every time I tell someone that I don't use Facebook or Whatsapp they can't believe that a nerd such as myself doesn't use essential nowadays' tools. I then start passionately exposing my concerns and showing proof that what I'm saying is true and already happened and not just out my lunatic mind. At that point I'm already labeled as conspiracist and I'm told that I'm over exaggerating and I should put my tin foil hat back on.

The discussion usually ends there, but if I feel particularly inspired and insist long enough I ultimately get the classic "oh well, who cares. I have nothing to hide".

That my dears, is the most utterly bullshit you can tell to yourself.

I have nothing to hide

I know you are not a terrorist but still you give privacy for understood in many aspects of your daily physical life. You expect it every time you go to the bathroom and close the door, you expect it when you go to the doctor or you confide to a close friend.

Saying that on internet you have nothing to hide is the equivalent of being okay at taking a dump in a glass walled bathroom with a very good acoustic.

Everyone has things that keep to themselves, things that only say to a special person, things that can be shared with close friends or family, things they talk only to a doctor and so on and so forth.

If in real life we have so many layers, why don't we expect the same level of privacy on internet? We are giving to Facebook, Google, Linkedin and the others more information about ourselves than we give to our SO or even to ourselves (remember Google is investing in DNA mapping).

I believe there are three main reasons for that.

One. Internet privacy in intangible. You don't see what you are actually exposing. Even if I told you that you are giving away info about yourself, you wouldn't really believe me because after all you don't see an imminent threat.

Two. We are used to the various internet services, many are born with them. It's hard to believe that something you are using since you were born is not actually good for you. Which leads to...

Three. Most of the services are free, we rely on them and they are pretty darn good. This is the same old "if you are not paying for it, you are the product". But that doesn't really cut it. People don't care being the product if their belly is full and if they do not see or understand the outcome.

Also, companies are making understanding and fighting for your internet privacy so incredibly complicated that users just give up and pretend that everything's fine.

So?! Do you want to go back to the telegraph? This is another stupid argument that often comes out.

Of course not, I just demand clarity. I want to know exactly how, what and whom my data is given away to. I want to be able to stop certain entities from collecting my data in the same way I can close my bathroom door. I'm sure that if all the ways our data is exposed were made public, 99% of the users would take some kind of counter measurement to protect it.

Sorry for the rant. Thanks for your time, now share this on Facebook.

[hansichen]

I can understand your point and I don't use Facebook and hardly use WhatsApp myself. But even if I am aware of the problem I see myself using an android phone and Google/Google Mail. I try to avoid many things but as a digital native it's pretty hard to do that. Eg I need WhatsApp to communicate with other students as they don't have other messengers, Google Mail is still the best mail service and I don't even know which one to use instead, but I'm probably only not motivated enough to search for better services.
I wish there would be easy solutions but for me it's a hard thing to imagine a life without some of these things, especially in regard of communication with other people of my age.

[seebart]

I'm 100% with you on this matt3o. People use these apps and take security for granted. In my experience at least 80% of all users do not think about online privacy or even read the EULA which is ususally 5-10 pages in tiny print. Most people will say two lines about this when I talk to them about it:

[*] I have nothing to hide everything is fine what's your problem?

[*] The privacy security setting is automatic from what I understand I have nothing to worry about.

Both serious bullshit. The sad part is that most users really don't know what that situation is but don't make an effort to learn either?!? I've said this before; what scares me most are younger people who have grown up with facebook & whatsapp etc and cannot live their daily lives without this software anymore. Every day I see these kids walking the streets with their face down looking at their "device" like zombies. Sad really. All this is going to get worse in the future.

Good rant Matteo!

[matt3o]

and to the equation I omitted the security aspect. Hackers will always exist and there's no such thing as a 100% secure system. To that add companies that stores passwords or credit card in plain text (Yes I'm talking to you Sony).

I've always been an outsider, but saying "what can I do?! there are no alternatives" is simply not true. there are alternatives we are just too lazy to use them

[Findecanor]

For me, these things are self-evident. They should be for everyone in the computing profession.

I also have my ad-blocker configured to block Facebook's "Like" buttons because they track you through those even if you are not registered with them. But yes, it does irk me that I keep missing out on things because I don't use Facebook ...

Another thing... In my country, a social security number that uniquely identifies you is prevalent and used in all contacts with the government, health care etc. More and more businesses are requiring this ID number to buy even relatively inexpensive items. The postal service logs it when you pick up a package, even if no money is being exchanged.
The government's databases of all citizens, where they live, when they are born, how much they earn, their family tree etc. are all available to companies who would want to track you and the only thing you can opt out of is direct junk mail. If they have my SSN from a transaction, then they can link my real identity to that and profile me.
I try to avoid vendors that require you to give out your SSN to buy from them, but it is not easy. Often, you don't have an option.
In other countries where the use of SSN is not so widespread, this abuse would not be accepted at all. Other governments that have tried to implement much less comprehensive systems have failed because of widespread protests.

[rsbseb]

Here's a secure system for you.

calc.jpg (39.22 KiB) Viewed 8912 times

Seriously though, I have a couple of family members who work for the US government. They do not use social media of any type. I personally work on a laptop that has the wifi physically disabled for anything I feel is particularly sensitive or critically important to me. It never sees a network or unauthorized media.

[codemonkeymike]

I have plenty to hide, not because I am a terrorist but because I don't want some billion dollar corporation to know more about me then my best friends and family. What could they do with such information? Manipulate you, mostly in buying habits but they can manipulate how you think about things as well with how and what they show you and when. And I cant stand when companies have twitter accounts, it should be "Jeff the Social Media Intern of XYZ corp". I could rant about this but I am at work, making money for a multi million dollar corporation.

As a note of how suspicious I am of large corporations (mostly google) I have a private email with ProtonMail and I use DuckDuckGo for search

[Daniel Beardsmore]

There are two primary factors for my having permanently remained off Facebook. One is that I found it incredibly user-hostile. Facebook is in that class of websites like eBay where the idiots just can't stop meddling with it. Whatever works one day will be totally different and completely broken the next. Why would I subject myself to that level of masochism? That and not needing to be reminded several times a day that Sean Connery is dead.

The other reason is Facebook's terrible reputation for privacy. Since I'm not a source of income to them, I exist solely to be mined for someone else's benefit.

As for Twitter, I always found it both amusing and sad (is there a word for that, since it's such a common perception?) that the rail operator First Capital Connect adorned their Twitter page with a vector illustration a nonexistent type of train (and one with no visible source of power — FCC was all electric so I'd expect pantographs and shoegear). Twitter never made any sense to me — the tweets are so short as to be largely meaningless. I need a local Borg collective instance to be able to communicate everything that's inside my head. Or one of those Christmas tree cables that Geordi plugs into Data's head.

[rsbseb]

Excepting a few targeted interest communities like DT, Facebook is the only social media site I visit. I go to Facebook because none of my close family lives close to me. I gives me a chance to go on the occasional political rant, thus insuring my close family never wants to be any closer to me.

I am of course kidding about my Facebook motivations, but in practice it's probably pretty accurate.

[adhoc]

Don't worry, there's more of us like you than you think. I'm not even entirely sure what the benefits of social media is, I honestly don't care about what others are doing in their private life and I'm supposed to sell my private data for the benefit of that? I still only use forums, as any social media with voting system kills discussion and creates hiveminds (exception to rule are some market subreddits, like mechmarket or pen swap).

[Ray]

I have an android phone without google apps installed - as a principle.
I started using whatsapp when they introduced end-to-end encryption by default. I don't care about the american gov being able to read it in the near future.
I would also use signal (the messaging app) if I had a way to use it without compiling the source.

I don't like the way firefox is going, but I don't have an alternative in sight. Tried chromium once, kicked it after 2min. I am giving away more than I want when browsing the net, but I am too lazy and it is too convenient.

about 14 years ago, I did set up gpg encryption for my email, hardly ever used it, never use it today, but then I hardly ever use email (except at work, where encryption is also absent and most stuff we send should be encrypted - since we wouldn't want it to be on our webpage).

[matt3o]

whatsapp is facebook and metadata is not encrypted. remember we are talking about privacy not secrecy!

[vivalarevolución]

Facebook was great when it started, and maybe I'm biased because I was part of the original target demographic (college students). Only people with a .edu email could sign up, so that limited it to students, professors, other university employees. You could only "friend" people from the institutions that you attended and had a legit email address for the institution. It was like a giant club for people at university. You could make your own little personal page, post witty comments on your friends wall, make little pages for your dorm or club or cause or whatever, look up that hot girl in your stats class, even creep on her swimsuit photos from spring break. oh yea. I'm not even sure if there were privacy settings originally.

Obviously, that system couldn't last forever, because the old Facebook had to monetize their user base and expand access to actually turn a profit. What Facebook is not what made it great in the first place. Social media sites all seem to be fun, exclusive, and ego-driven when they start. But they have generate revenue and it helps to have as many users as possible amd as much info as you can get from them.

I think the social media sites have matured enough that their main usefulness is well defined. From the user perspective there obviously is the ego gratification and instant gratification aspects, but they can useful for keeping up with the lives of others and also business promotion. One of my family members is a moderately successful online personality, and generating business through social media is an important aspect. So the whole game does have some usefulness for the individual.

That said, you can waste an enormous amount of time on these apps without adding anything meaningful and valuable to your life and I found it best just to log off about all of them. I think for most of us adults, if we don't have something we can promote via social media, it's best to minimize the time we spend and what we put on there.

[Mr.Nobody]

If you use mobile phone, google and youtube, your privacy is out there already, and your ISP knows a lot about you...so what's the point avoiding facebook, they just can accumulate your data one way or another if they want to take advantage of them, we just pretend we still have privacy and they just pretend they don't know and won't harm us using our personal data they've been collecting for years.

[webwit]

If you use mobile phone, google and youtube, your privacy is out there already, and your ISP knows a lot about you...so what's the point avoiding facebook, they just can accumulate your data one way or another if they want to take advantage of them, we just pretend we still have privacy and they just pretend they don't know and won't harm us using our personal data they've been collecting for years.

Two wrongs make a right fallacy.

[seebart]

Here's a "fun" read realted to this subject:

Underpaid and overburdened: the life of a Facebook moderator

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/m ... me-content

[matt3o]

If you use mobile phone, google and youtube, your privacy is out there already, and your ISP knows a lot about you...so what's the point avoiding facebook, they just can accumulate your data one way or another if they want to take advantage of them, we just pretend we still have privacy and they just pretend they don't know and won't harm us using our personal data they've been collecting for years.

as Stallman says (the biggest windmill fighter there is) if you don't even try to fight they already won.

[tp4tissue]

Facebook has a very specific purpose.

It reduces the time cost to maintaining relationships/ creating new ones.

For young people it's the primary way of mate selection..



For people in mid-age, or heading into it, they may already have a mate, or have abandoned looking for one..


This is where one can begin to detach from social media..

[Daniel Beardsmore]

For young people it's the primary way of mate selection..

We're doomed.

[Mr.Nobody]

Don't worry, new technology always brings new problems, but human society is always be able to find a solution and adapt itself to the new situation, always...We only have one chance to live, one life, so IMO, the most pathetic way of living is having to much to hide.

[DanielT]

Very nice article matt3o! People don't realize that with giving up on their privacy they are taking part in Big Brother system.
I have been working in telecom industry as a technical person for the last 14 years, I know how easy is to listen to a mobile phone conversation, how easy is to track a mobile phone. While working at a mobile operator I have even took part in the development of a tool used to localize mobile subscribers and I lough my ass off when I see in the movies all that crap with "keep him talking 30s", if you know the phone number you know where the guy is end of story. Secret services have direct access to the mobile operator equipment,this is a legal requirement, again I know that because I used to create the users for them each time a new equipment was put in place.

Now I work also with cloud crap, again people think is the most secure shit, it is not! If you look at the architecture and the way all components interconnect you see how easy is just to get all the data from an user, eavesdrop on everything he does. Privacy is a big ZERO and if the laws change (see Patriot Act...) any governmental agency can access your data and you can do shit about it.

And there is another thing. Now everyone is crazy about automation, about self-healing systems, self-deployment, robots, and people think it is so cool, it will make their jobs so easy.... well it's not like that. Why ? It's simple, doing this you only dig your own grave, once all the automation is place you become "obsoleted, deprecated" and then do what ?
Johnny Cash has a very nice song called "The Legend of John Henry's Hammer", pay attention to the lyrics... one thing that should make people think is this :

Code: Select all

"Now did the Lord say that machines ought to take place of livin'?
And what's a substitute for bread and beans? I ain't seen it!"

[matt3o]

Elon Musk suggests that in the age of automation governments should give people a base wage

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/04/elon-mus ... -wage.html

The problem is that if you give people money and nothing to do... bad things happen.

[DanielT]

I've read that and it gives me the creeps... I'm happy I saw other times, I'm happy I had the chance to write a postcard, go to the Post Office to make a phone call... Honestly we don't "need" any of these technology achievements not at that cost ...

[matt3o]

I don't know. I don't see it as necessarily a bad thing. It could be the verge of a new civilization. Hopefully better. I dunno. The glass is half full I guess.

[davkol]

derp

[Redmaus]

I agree matt3o, there is no respect for anonymity or privacy on the internet nowadays. It all changed about after 2007 for some reason. Everything mines your data nowadays. Your phone, OS, google, and almost anything else you use. I mean these companies can keep a database with the available resources so why wouldn't they?

[Mr.Nobody]

When robots have taken over the government, who's gonna pay useless human beings by then? The only thing that robots can't do by humans can might be having sex, so the porn industry might be the only industry involves humans, if robots have interests to watch...

[gogusrl]

And before that you had 50 mb yahoo mail storage and had to use altavista and shit. All the nice luxuries you enjoy on the web right now (from facebook to google to gmail) are free of charge because you are their income. Who you are, what you like, who you know, where you are, etc.

Don't wanna be that ? Pay the Apple tax (because they seem the only ones to actually give a shit about this), host your own email, go PGP, VeraCrypt, use Gentoo ( ), buy data only prepaid sims, go always on vpn bought with bitcoins, sip accounts, etc.

TLDR : you can have all the anonymity you want, going back to the stone ages if that tickles your pickle, the cost is only that of commodity.

A lot more to be said about universal basic income, automation and a post-scarcity world. Until then, everyone should read The Culture - Ian M. Banks

[seebart]

I agree matt3o, there is no respect for anonymity or privacy on the internet nowadays. It all changed about after 2007 for some reason. Everything mines your data nowadays. Your phone, OS, google, and almost anything else you use. I mean these companies can keep a database with the available resources so why wouldn't they?

Agreed, although it may have begun slightly before. I remember going online in the mid 1990's. The internet was obviously quite different then, quite "innocent" and "hamless" in some way. Today many users feel the need for projects like this:

https://www.torproject.org/projects/torbrowser.html.en

[Techno Trousers]

I totally agree with you matt3o. I'm old enough to remember what real privacy meant. A mere 30 years ago in the U.S.:

• If you went "online", it was a point-to-point dial-up connection, so only you and the BBS knew about it.
• If you watched a TV, or listened to music, or played a video game, only you knew what entertainment you were consuming.
• When you shopped, only you knew what you were buying (cash) or only that store and credit card company knew (credit).
• If the government, or law enforcement, wanted to read your correspondence, track your whereabouts, or listen to your private conversations, they had to first convince a judge that they had cause to do so. And I'm talking about a real judge, from a real court district. Not some phony "secret court".

The average person has no clue how much of their private and even intimate information is in the databases of their government, and corporations big and small. I do what I can by contributing to the EFF and real investigative news outlets like The Intercept. In addition to avoiding "real name" social media, I also use a suite of tools to help preserve what little bit of privacy I can. I don't go "tinfoil hat" in my efforts, but taking reasonable precautions is my way to resist. It says that I refuse to submit targeted advertising, and I reject the premise that unconstitutional mass collection of everyone's data will make me safer.

• Device encryption
• Long alphanumeric passwords on my devices
• DuckDuckGo
• uBlock Origin
• Signal
• Streisand

Edward Snowden said it best: "Saying you don't care about privacy because you have nothing to hide is like saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say."