A new car...

citrojohn

01 Oct 2016, 22:55

Hmm... non-vestigial running boards, separate headlamps, four-light saloon body that has no suggestion of a VW Beetle. Mid-to-late 1930s I'd say, probably a 170V. :geek:
That model lasted right through the war and into the 50s, by virtue of being the most stolid, unexciting, unenterprising design anyone produced in Germany at the time. It probably saved Mercedes. All the same, I can't help feeling sad that the much more interesting rear-engined 170H that preceded it lasted just four years...

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seebart
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01 Oct 2016, 23:19

Sounds like you got car history knowledge. Impressive. When I lived in USA in the 1970s my dad had a 73 Oldsmobile Delta Eightyeight coupe convertible with a 455 cui rocket bigblock. One monster of a vehicle, I'll never forget the sound of that engine. Looked exactly like this one:
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fohat
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01 Oct 2016, 23:36

seebart wrote:
73 Oldsmobile Delta Eightyeight coupe convertible with a 455 cu rocket bigblock.
My aunt had a 1965 Oldsmobile Starfire convertible (just like this one, except dark blue with white top and white interior) with that same engine ("police interceptor" option) but in a smaller and sleeker car.

I only got to drive it a few times, but one night I took it out on a long straight deserted road and stopped. From a cold start, with the 3-speed automatic in "Drive" I floored it. It shifted from 1st to 2nd at almost 60 mph (90 kph) and from 2nd to 3rd at just over 100 mph (160 kph) and I had it up to 140 mph (225 kph) before I chickened out. The car still had more.
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seebart
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01 Oct 2016, 23:45

Wow, what a beauty, a powerful beauty at that. I bet those 60's models were better build quality too. Driving like that could get you killed fohat. :o The Olds my dad had was just one huge boat.

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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 02:38

Well I got a scooter for now. It's no Vespa, but it will do.

Thinking of just using rentals, Lyft, and car sharing through any bad weather or for longer trips until I decide to purchase a car.

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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 03:13

Best car my family ever owned in my lifetime was a 1984 Buick LeSabre Limited. Roomy, comfortable, classy, stylish, powerful, indestructible, a boat on wheels, really. The seats were gigantic, you could fit three adults back there, and the most comfortable I ever sat in. Everybody could sleep in the backseat. It had a big V8 engine in there, we never topped it with the family in the car, but my dad said he got it up to 130-140 mph at one time. Loved the styling on cars of that era. Yea, all these 1980s sedans were a little rectangular and large, but this Buick has the big grill, spokes on the wheel covers, chromed out on the edges, whitewall tires, and nice, big steel bumpers. Virtually indestructible, too, unless you were in a high speed crash. My brother drove The Boat in high school and rear ended a fellow classmate in the parking lot (he was an idiot in high school). The car he hit was totaled; the boat only had a misaligned bumper and cracked headlight. Repairs were no more than a few hundred dollars.

God, that thing was a part of my childhood as much as anything else.

Image

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webwit
Wild Duck

02 Oct 2016, 11:44

Those Oldsmobiles look very cool but so old compared to contemporary and comparable Europeans like the Mercedes W116 6.9, which I think aged much better. My own favorite along those lines is the old Volvo Station. Drives like a powerful car, has the fuel consumption and crash safety of a tank, and you could haul stuff with it like a van, which I loved. Now if I need to transport something big, I must use a transport service or rent a van. If I wouldn't live in the city with it's small streets and small parking spaces, I would like a car like that again.

citrojohn

02 Oct 2016, 14:27

webwit wrote: My own favorite along those lines is the old Volvo Station. Drives like a powerful car, has the fuel consumption and crash safety of a tank, and you could haul stuff with it like a van, which I loved. Now if I need to transport something big, I must use a transport service or rent a van. If I wouldn't live in the city with it's small streets and small parking spaces, I would like a car like that again.
A 240, right? Oddly enough I saw one of those just last week. Completely stock on the outside, but with a set of speakers that filled half the boot...
seebart wrote: Sounds like you got car history knowledge. Impressive.
Cars were my obsession before keyboards. The old or interesting ones still are - sadly, for the most part over here it's a rubberdome world where cars are concerned. And 30s cars are an interesting study - the innovations in styling all happened at fairly specific times, so it's easy to guess a date by looking at the style. If it had been a 20s one I'd have had much more trouble working out a date...

My madeleine cars are a Rover P4 (wood, leather and a studied disdain for change-for-its-own-sake), a leaf-green Skoda Rapid ("who cares if it deafens us on the motorway - it's rear-engined!"), a Peugeot 505 estate ("eight seats! a comprehensible heating system!") and a Vauxhall Astra / Opel Kadett that made me car-sick every time I rode in it (I still can't see one without feeling the preliminary stuffiness in my airways).
But being a total sucker for weirdness, the one I really fell in love with was the Citroen GSA. Hydro-pneumatic suspension and braking, a flat-four engine like a Subaru's, a semi-automatic gearbox and the craziest dashboard you ever saw. Gotta love the mindset that squeezed all the lights and wiper controls onto one pod for the left hand, then just threw the minor controls apparently at random into a Stackpole-like lattice - and I would love to know who thought a speedometer that reads like a bathroom scale was a good idea. :lol:

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fohat
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02 Oct 2016, 15:25

I have a "thing" about 1960s American iron because that was the decade of most of my teens, and 90% of my first couple of years' driving was in 1964-68 models. But I have had 2 Volvos, a 1967 122 and a 1988 244T (my last non-Camry).

1930s cars (from the Depression Era, no less) covered the spectrum indeed. 1937 Cord exterior would have to be my favorite:

("reverse suicide" doors here, too, never noticed!)
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seebart
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02 Oct 2016, 15:31

webwit wrote: Those Oldsmobiles look very cool but so old compared to contemporary and comparable Europeans like the Mercedes W116 6.9, which I think aged much better.
Could not agree more, but the Yanks got cooler oldies. Love how this is turning into a "car stories" thread. I snapped these two recently while on my bike, both classics. Love the BMW 3.0 CSI, that shape. :shock:
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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 15:40

Anybody up for a classic car trip around Cuba, now that we Yanks can legally visit the country?

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seebart
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02 Oct 2016, 15:44

vivalarevolución wrote: Anybody up for a classic car trip around Cuba, now that we Yanks can legally visit the country?
Oh I'd love to. Pretty far trip for me though. :roll: I hear it's jam-packed with tourists already.

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webwit
Wild Duck

02 Oct 2016, 15:47

You should visit Poland, Czech Republic or Slovakia for that, for the Eastern Bloc variant. :lol:

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seebart
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02 Oct 2016, 16:04

webwit wrote: You should visit Poland, Czech Republic or Slovakia for that, for the Eastern Bloc variant. :lol:
Me? If I go there I'll be looking for some Tesla Hall effect keyboards and other rare oldschool keyboards. :ugeek:

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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 16:22

seebart wrote:
webwit wrote: You should visit Poland, Czech Republic or Slovakia for that, for the Eastern Bloc variant. :lol:
Me? If I go there I'll be looking for some Tesla Hall effect keyboards and other rare oldschool keyboards. :ugeek:
Two birds with one stone.

While we are on the subject of these giant old cars that actually were comfortable, stylish, powerful (unlike the masses of economy cars on the roads today), what gives me hope for their modern revival are electric cars. I took a Tesla Model S for a test drive, and quite frankly, it is space age. Tons of interior space, handling is insane because of that battery pack creating a low center of gravity, braking so responsive that you don't actually need to press the brake pedal, and maximum torque from 0 mph, so it comes off the line faster than super cars.

All while looking like an unassuming luxury family sedan. Completely blows the doors off the boring reputation of electric cars as practical, slow, bore-mobiles. Taking that thing for a test drive convinced me that well made electric cars offer a better driving experience than an internal combustion vehicle and I hope they are the future of the automobile industry. Unfortunately, Teslas are not going to solve the problem of sprawl, but rather fit into the current urban paradigm.

Now if the commoners like myself could afford the thing, I would be even more excited.

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seebart
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02 Oct 2016, 16:30

True, electric cars are becoming a realistic option. German car makers have long ignored the subject but are now finally coming out with electric models. We also have quite a car-sharing boom in the cilties here in Germany. I sometimes use some of these services, quite practical for shorter trips.
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webwit
Wild Duck

02 Oct 2016, 16:32

They will have a problem if there aren't any big breakthroughs in battery technology. I wouldn't do this. They add to the pain by making those batteries and loading stations brand exclusive. What I want is make a pit stop at a generic battery station and swap my battery for a fully charged one.

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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 16:49

seebart wrote: True, electric cars are becoming a realistic option. German car makers have long ignored the subject but are now finally coming out with electric models. We also have quite a car-sharing boom in the cilties here in Germany. I sometimes use some of these services, quite practical for shorter trips.
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My city, Indianapolis, is basically serving as experiment for electric car sharing in the United States. We have this service called Blue Indy, based on the Autolib service that has been successful in a few large French cities. Indianapolis is a sprawling mess with some of the worst public transport in the country for a city of its size, so the mayor and French billionaire Vincent Bollore decided to use the city as a testing ground (with public funding, of course). The service is intended to fill a convenience gap that the public transport system clearly lacks. Theoretically, if the service is successful in a sprawling American city like Indianapolis, it could work anywhere else.
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I use the service a couple times a week, and it is convenient, but like a piece of software that was rolled out too early. Honestly, I think it will fail here, for a couple reasons. 1) Indianapolis is a heavily car centric city with a conversative population that is skeptical of new ideas and also poor people that cannot afford this stuff. Adoption is slow; 2) Reliability is lacking in the system. Broken charging stations, malfunctioning software, super cheap cars, etc. Quality is poor, and if people have a couple bad experiences, they will not continue using it.

Most American cities have too low density to allow effective and reliabile public transportation. Innovative alternatives like electric car sharing deserve to be considered. However, if they are executed poorly, they will not succeed.
webwit wrote: They will have a problem if there aren't any big breakthroughs in battery technology. I wouldn't do this. They add to the pain by making those batteries and loading stations brand exclusive. What I want is make a pit stop at a generic battery station and swap my battery for a fully charged one.
Yea, super fast charging stations that are not brand exclusive and quick battery swaps will be necessary for electric cars to succeed at a massive level. We are too accustomed to a convenient, quick fill up. Imagine a network of charing stations and battery swaps as common as gas stations. That's what it will take to alleviate "range anxiety."
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webwit
Wild Duck

02 Oct 2016, 16:55

The worst moment if you have such a car is if you need a charge, drive to a charging station(s), and they are all in use. What are you going to do now? Wait a couple of hours for your turn? Then wait more while it's charging? The battery dictates your travels.

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fohat
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02 Oct 2016, 17:08

As with so much "modern technology" every manufacturer wants to own the rights to the preferred proprietary system, and the reward for owning the patent on the "industry standard" for the electrical distribution system for powering cars would be almost incalculable.

Regardless of how loudly "anti-government" capitalists would squawk, there clearly needs to be unified international standard on how these things work.

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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 17:09

webwit wrote: The worst moment if you have such a car is if you need a charge, drive to a charging station(s), and they are all in use. What are you going to do now? Wait a couple of hours for your turn? Then wait more while it's charging? The battery dictates your travels.
Add that to the cost of installing a charger in your home. I think a Tesla Model S uses as much electricity as everything else in your house while it is charging, and the range of a Tesla is what most people need to alleviate range anxiety. You cannot realistically own a long-range electric car without owning a home and investing a couple thousand dollars in equipment and professional hookup to actually charge the thing.

Most of us would be fine with an electric car with a range of ~100 miles as a second vehicle, many of these can be charged through a regular wall outlet in a reasonable amount of time. For example, a Nissan Leaf (80-100 mile range) can reach 50% charge overnight through a 110V standard North American outlet. But again, you realistically need to own home to have access to the convenience of charging the vehicle on a regular basis. The technology has to be convenience for EVERYONE, not simply those who own a home.

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seebart
Offtopicthority Instigator

02 Oct 2016, 17:35

webwit wrote: The worst moment if you have such a car is if you need a charge, drive to a charging station(s), and they are all in use. What are you going to do now? Wait a couple of hours for your turn? Then wait more while it's charging? The battery dictates your travels.
Not only that but the battery technology itself is far from mature. The whole concept of electric cars has a long way to go IMO but at least something is happening be it experiments like Indianapolis or eccentric business people like elon musk. The japanese have some decent electric cars on the market but the range of course is limited.

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webwit
Wild Duck

02 Oct 2016, 17:40

The good news is that the early adopters help the technology mature, so we can buy something better and cheaper later. We must cheer these people on, while they are sweating or cold because they don't dare to use the airco or heating. Although I guess their pain is alleviated by being home owners with their own parking space at the house and their second car for long distances.

I wonder what a world with battery powered vehicles would look like. And I don't mean the vehicles or traffic, but the power shift. The Middle East will go bankrupt and their problems of western invasions will stop, with the "terrorism" hopefully as well. The new wealth would go to the countries with the "rare earth" materials. Will they get rich, bombed by the US (for freedom, of course), or both?

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seebart
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02 Oct 2016, 18:14

I think the OPEC countries are starting to get the hint there might be a shift sooner or later. Of course electricity also has to be produced, depending on how this is achieved that process can still be quite ecologically harmful. Solar power is great but not an option for everyone. At least there is some hope. But many people like my neighbor just need that powerful fast car regardless, and as long as there's a market those will be built and sold. Crazy.

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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 18:32

webwit wrote: I wonder what a world with battery powered vehicles would look like. And I don't mean the vehicles or traffic, but the power shift. The Middle East will go bankrupt and their problems of western invasions will stop, with the "terrorism" hopefully as well. The new wealth would go to the countries with the "rare earth" materials. Will they get rich, bombed by the US (for freedom, of course), or both?
Yea, the geopolitical and environmental consequences of our dependence upon oil is the worst part of the whole industry. I would like to think that a world without oil dependence would be a better world. But perhaps it also means new places for conquest, conflict, and destruction. We are humans, after all, adept at creating a messy world.

You forget to mention the warming planet, holes poked in the earth, waters fouled, habitats destroyed...I will stop there. Mostly for money, power, and convenience over a short period of human history and the planet's life. From what I know, the environmental consequences of electric cars are less than those of oil. But not a benign technology that is deserving of blind worship, by any means.

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seebart
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02 Oct 2016, 18:52

vivalarevolución wrote: over a short period of human history and the planet's life.
Right, we've managed to fuck this planet up in very short time if you look at the timeline. I read the other day that amino groups were found on some other rock in space (forgot the details now) and that since amino groups are the origin of humans we may well be aliens if amino groups hit the earth with a meteoroid. :maverick:

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fohat
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02 Oct 2016, 19:23

vivalarevolución wrote:
You forget to mention the warming planet, holes poked in the earth, waters fouled, habitats destroyed ....
Funny that the Middle East will be able to easily generate large amounts of solar energy for itself, when it wants to.

And, if all the oil is not sucked out in the immediate future for the people who are alive today to burn, future generations will be very appreciative of whatever oil is left, because what it is really useful for is making plastic!

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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 19:53

seebart wrote:
vivalarevolución wrote: over a short period of human history and the planet's life.
Right, we've managed to fuck this planet up in very short time if you look at the timeline. I read the other day that amino groups were found on some other rock in space (forgot the details now) and that since amino groups are the origin of humans we may well be aliens if amino groups hit the earth with a meteoroid. :maverick:
I actually believe it is realistic possibility that the Earth was seeded with life from a different planet. Whether it was intentional, I am not sure. We'll find out if they return.
fohat wrote: Funny that the Middle East will be able to easily generate large amounts of solar energy for itself, when it wants to.

And, if all the oil is not sucked out in the immediate future for the people who are alive today to burn, future generations will be very appreciative of whatever oil is left, because what it is really useful for is making plastic!
So basically any moderately organized Middle East country will be fine in a post-oil world, and the rest of the world won't give a shit about them anymore, unless they have the raw materials for batteries buried in the sand or have a layover in Dubai.

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webwit
Wild Duck

02 Oct 2016, 20:22

vivalarevolución wrote: I actually believe it is realistic possibility that the Earth was seeded with life from a different planet. Whether it was intentional, I am not sure.
Why would someone want to plant a Clinton or Trump on a remote rock? :?
It seems like a strange exercise.

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vivalarevolución
formerly prdlm2009

02 Oct 2016, 23:03

webwit wrote:
vivalarevolución wrote: I actually believe it is realistic possibility that the Earth was seeded with life from a different planet. Whether it was intentional, I am not sure.
Why would someone want to plant a Clinton or Trump on a remote rock? :?
It seems like a strange exercise.
Like many grand endeavors, they start with high hopes. Sometimes the results are less satisfactory than anticipated.

On a related note, Elon Musk's obsession with colonizing Mars gives me a chuckle. What makes anybody think we wouldn't screw up that planet, too?

I do like the vacation possibilities, though. The ultimate desert resort, without having to worry about pesky critters and spiky cacti.

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